cudak888 

Not bad. Keep glossing on some nice enameled flattery and I just might give you the honor of buying them for $43k.





-Kurt

xiaoman1 

I suggest we do a go fund me for 50.00in order to send a member that is near the seller. We can then get a full report..... If we all gave a .01 then we could even manage to send several members and get a number of "biased" reports on the value of the lot.
JM2C's, Ben

CliffordK

Will the person we send have full access to pull every single bike down off the rack, photograph it, and take an inventory of all the components?

It should be able to be done in less than 10 hours. Might as well get some benefit for that $50.

repechage

that if read correctly will cost $500.

from the advert-

To this end, I will allow individuals (two at a time maximum) to schedule an hour on my premises for the non refundable fee of $50.

clubman 

Grant Petersen?

xiaoman1 

Ok, the fund should pay for food and lodging......(2) McDonalds kids meals for lunch and dinner and an (1) egg Mc Muffin and coffee for breakfast as well as and (1) night at the local "Y"...that should do it.
Fund fully recoverable, if no "drive" side pics are posted.
Best, Ben

repechage

That separate $50 viewing offer within a listing is an eBay rule violation no doubt. There would be no percentage for them, they are into maximizing profit.

repechage

For the true entrepreneur

honda parts warehouse lot

https://www.ebay.com/itm/32515450485...3ABFBM7oPdhIlg

cyclophilia 

The seller has posted an inventory of the collection as an update to the eBay listing.

repechage

Going to be tough getting 50k.
if an entity like the Pro's Closet offered 30, take it.
there is a lot of work before profit would be realized.
eclectic focus, which is quite ok, but some brands like Serotta, good machines but too many in near same size. Think demand over time.

wrk101

Got to wonder if that break down above means most of the list is just frames. Some entries show component group. No group could mean just a frame.

The larger the pile and the faster he wants it moved, the bigger the discount. He would be wise to break it into ten bike lots instead. Otherwise, the pile if it does sell will go for about what the five or ten best are worth. To properly value such a large group, its going to take more like 20 hours or more. The way I overcome having to put so much time into it, I just look for a bigger discount instead.

Drillium Dude 

If the seller is truly serious about selling, they need to **** or get off the pot. Provide details prospective buyers can actually work with; wouldn't even take that long if they have access daily to the bikes. Heck, it only took me an hour to peruse the photos, take some notes, then publish an inventory of approximately 70 of the purported 100 bikes and frames here. How tough could it be to completely fill in the "blanks" on that list? It's almost as if the seller is being intentionally vague; anybody else getting that vibe?

For the money asked (that $50k is the opening bid) you'd think the effort would've been put in before the auction was ever uploaded. Heck, for a collection that size, you'd think they might already have an inventory of sorts!

Ah, but what do I know?

EDIT: Just noticed sizes are given haphazardly in either Imperial or metric measurements. Strange lack of consistency there.

DD

P!N20

How to spell Cinelli correctly?
​​​

merziac

Way too many way too smallish for 50K

Doug Fattic 

Describing an English frame size in inches - the way they were actually measured when they were made - is what makes the most sense to me. Converting a 23" frame to centimeters gives an odd number 58.43. That makes me have to translate an odd number back to inches so I can understand what size it was actually made. And besides English frames typically measure center to top and that is different than some more modern frames measured center to center.

I see in this collection some of the best English names like Ephgrave and Hurlow and that makes me think this is a collector that went after the better builders. Many of the best models of English builders after WWII had fancy cut lugs. So it can make quite a difference which model of frame he bought from each builder. Some Condor frames were built by Bill Hurlow and would be much more interesting to me than a standard model. Another example is H.R. Morris that was known for cutting lugs so maybe his frame has fancy lugs and maybe not. That would have an influence on a buyer.

I see there is a Columbine in the collection. The brothers charged some of the highest prices for their more elaborate work so I would expect it to go for more money. I might also mention that his frames made in Europe after WWII until the 80's would have averaged him around $100 each. I paid $75 for my Hetchins in 1969 and $150 for a Hurlow in 1974. And Bill charged 10£ more than average.

Another example of wanting to know more would be the Carltons. If they were made before they were bought out by Raleigh, I'd want them a lot more.

ctak

"This list is preliminary and is subject to revision. Furthermore, the list will be enhanced to include original/repaint information as well as any applicable provenance information."

I would certainly hope so. This "inventory" isn't even half-baked in its current form.

Drillium Dude 

I'd considered that might be the reason - I now recognize the pattern - but then again, for a seller not providing a whole lot of detail (or, should I say, letting details seep out slowly over the course of time), I found this particular detail kinda funny. I mean, the seller wants to sell the whole thing lock, stock, and barrel. If he converted everything to metric, it wouldn't really matter. After all, there's a variation in sizes across the board here. Save the prospective buyer from having to make extra effort; to me, it's the seller's job to make the sale, and that would make things clearer to a prospective buyer. Dunno, just my opinion.

As far as your notations about higher-end English frames, I did spend a couple years in the mid-90s over there, and in fact picked up the vintage bike disease while in the UK; even had Condor build me a custom frame. I agree with your assessments, which makes it all the more strange the seller hasn't provided any representative photos of those particular frames and/or bikes.

Admittedly I have no interest in acquiring this collection, but I recognize that if the seller wants big money they gotta show what they've got to those whom may be willing to take a punt. Tho I'll admit I'd like to see some pics of the other bikes he's listed which didn't show up in the photos, and as a result also didn't wind up on my "inventory" post.

DD

verktyg 

I retired at the end of 2018 at 75. I received a settlement that would more than cover the listing plus all expenses involved.

At that time I would have seriously considered buying the collection as an investment IF:

It it were located much closer to the left coast - shipping and transportation costs, if I had a reasonable amount of time to inspect the collection to evaluate everything and there was a reasonable amount of time to remove everything.

A friend designs and sets up websites for commercial enterprises. He could have set up a site like the Pros Closet or other online classic bike sellers in a day or two. I think that I could have at least recouped my outlay in 2-3 years, maybe less especially if the bikes would have cost me ~$500 each.

That was 3 1/2 years ago. I have neither the desire or energy to take on such a project today. Somebody else may have the time and energy but the seller needs to be more user friendly towards potential buyers.

I mentioned above that an old friend passed away in January and his former girl friend is executor for his estate. He had quite an extensive bike collection of which 1/3 were antiques from the late 1800's to the early 1900's that only a special collector would be interested in. He had some rare high quality C&V bikes plus a lot of junk too.

I spoke with her on several occasions. She needed to liquidate everything: 2 properties, 5 vehicles, the bikes plus 2 other collections. I put her in touch with a SoCal collector/seller who is in a position to fly over to where the bikes are, lay a bunch of Uncle Bens on the table, rent a truck and cart everything off. I twice suggested that if someone offered her $15-$20k to take care of everything she should take the money and run... The collection cost her NOTHING and it would all be cash in her pocket.

The SoCal collector just contacted me and said that she wanted $75k based on what my friend had valued everything! His response to her was a polite crickets... She needs to get rid of the bikes so that she can sell the main property and return home to the Midwest. Her problem, not mine. GREED IS GLORIOUS

verktyg

Kilroy1988 

Both of the Internationals are described as path racers, which means they're almost certainly earlier frames from the 1950s with the fancy "International" lugs designed by Bill Hurlow. 'Tis actually my favorite frame but I have yet to get the opportunity to purchase one in a larger size like I need. At whatever size the frames can sell for between $500-1,500 depending on condition. A 1966 Flyer would be akin to the model sold in the US (or is the same) after the Raleigh purchase, and a few members around here have them and they're nice frames with the Hayden lugs, but not too special.

I'd love to see what lug patterns are on the Bill Hurlows as well - if they're Condor-esque fancy lugs of any kind the frames alone are worth a thousand apiece at least on today's market.

A 1953 Hetchins Vade Mecum with mostly non-original parts but in working order just sold for $995 on US eBay, but some frames/bikes can be much more expensive, so more details are necessary there to even begin estimating values...

The 1947 F.H. Grubb Perfection should be a real gem, and probably worth a couple thousand dollars if it's a full bike with original components in even decent condition.

-Gregory

Kabuki12

This update sheds a little light on the collection , unfortunately much more is needed to make someone seriously consider purchasing the entire lot and that will take some time. I'm not sure how this is going to play out , but I wish this person the best. I can tell by the list he is passionate about classic bikes and whatever situation put him in the position he is in is serious. One thing that this has done for me ( I'm pretty sure I'm not alone) is make me evaluate my own situation and keeping things simple for those who would be left with my humble collection of bikes. I have about a dozen or so , and nothing too high end so , as Chas said , take whatever $$ and have a good time. To me , it would be nice to know who ever got my bikes would enjoy them as much as I do ....and have long legs!!

tricky 

Right?! How about indicating what is a frame versus what is a complete? Sheesh. That said, I need to stop bagging on this auction since there are obviously some difficulties causing the sale.

repechage

@Kabuki12-
that's the issue, so so many are at the near same size. When you flood the market like this, the lot will sell at a big discount.
the time required for the market to absorb the vast majority will be quite long.

My view -tall guys are cheap, and short guys have no money.

icemilkcoffee 

That is the truth. I think the sweet spot for C&V bikes is around 55-59cm. Those 50-52cm bikes will be very, very hard to unload. I'm 5'8" and I've had bikes from 49cm to 55cm. From my own buying and selling I notice that the smaller bikes are very slow to sell. There was a $650 52cm Serotta on our local market that failed to sell for a whole year. Maybe things would be different if more women get into C&V bikes.

P!N20

Well the listing has ended so I'm just waiting the market to be flooded with vintage bikes and components.

cyclophilia 

Does anyone know who purchased the bicycles?