C9H13N 

I think there’s a good-sized subset of cyclists who have heard of the Original Nivex precisely because of Jan’s writings, myself included.

elcraft

Yeah, I was just thinking of Suntour’s version of this, the S-1. Suntour managed to incorporate the cable tensioning and chain tensioning in a sleeker design. The cabling was used more conventional ferrules and adjustment.
See:
https://www.disraeligears.co.uk/site...leur_s100.html

Classtime 

I want one. I also want one of those crank sets. And a pair of those brakes. And a stem with Maes bend bars. And 700c RH tires. And …

HEY! I just clicked and that RD is only 729 bucks 😉

daka

You mean where he says "What happens if we start from scratch to make the best mechanical derailleur possible? " Wait, that's not it. How about " (The 1930s Nivex provided a wonderful inspiration, but it was never intended for modern drivetrains.)". One sentence, in parentheses, is his attribution. More or less.

bulgie 

I made a custom frame for Ray Chong once. Nice guy. I told him he should change his middle name to "Don". Alas, he didn't do it.

Germany_chris

Honestly if I had a bike that this would look right on I'd get one

PhilFo 

I'm still stuck on the intro stating that modern derailleurs are precise, then stating that the new Nivex shifter index notches "serve as a guide." So, is it not precise? Just get the PR wording correct in the whole post; if you want precise, say your new derailleur and shifter are precise, if you want something to "serve as a guide", then state it as such. This is just like a 4-way stop in Philly, it's advertised with big, red, octagonal signs as one thing, but in real life those signs are merely suggestions.

JulesCW 

Clearly you have either not read nor are choosing to ignore the numerous other times over the past decade+ that Jan has written about the Nivex and how much he liked it, and how he was working on a new version. FWIW, the cheval you are beating is quite morte... it will never pull the cart of angry villagers with whom you're hoping to storm Jan's chateau.

smontanaro 

I think one of the great unreported stories of 2022 is all the hate that's been heaped on Jan Heine. He runs a niche bicycle components business and publishing company. Isn't he allowed to do stuff outside the mainstream?

fender1

He is the "new" Grant Petersen.

BertoBerg 

He’s allowed to do whatever he wants of course! I think what we are seeing here is a lot of knee jerk reactions to the cost of the product and to the name of the product. I’m guilty of having the same reaction as well.

RH’s new derailleur isn’t for me but I wish it luck!

cudak888 

I'd bet cost - more than anything else - is driving these reactions. Those who know what "Rene Herse" is will understandably be sore, but we'd probably see the same amount of utter retrogrouchiness if it had been branded under Jan's previous Compass brand.

-Kurt

santa fe 2926 

From Disraeligears, advertising picture of the Nivex, showing the clamp on version, I.e. no welding of mounting, and the chain holder, allowing easy removal of rear wheel for flat repair. Collier ou constructeur. Schwinn or Gugie!

smontanaro 

Lots of whining about the price over on The Paceline as well, and that's a crowd that's not shy about spending for expensive componentry.

cudak888 

They're probably whining about tech relative to cost.

-Kurt

bear_a_bug 

I don't think Jan is going to revolutionize much of anything in the cycling world with his new Nivex RD, but I think it's probably going to make a few people (himself included) very happy to own one at any price.

scarlson 

I will attempt to provide my perspective, at the risk of sounding silly, since it hasn't been said by anyone else. I'm honestly kind of surprised I have a novel perspective on this dogpile? Whatever, here goes.

I CNC machine stuff sometimes. It is hard, and takes a long time, mostly to make the first one. Subsequent ones will be easier/faster and that's where the profits could come in. That said, I don't understand how he will make much money at all doing this. How many will he realistically sell? I would bet it's not worth the costs to sell it, all things considered. If it were, I'd probably be CNC machining more stuff for money. God knows people ask me to.

And it is very cool, and will be cherished like the CNC'd Paul and White Industries derailleurs of old. But it's not for money. He makes his money on tires and we all know that. I think he's doing it because he wants to make a statement. The funny thing is, I don't know if it's the right statement to make. He's got kind of an ego, and I think that's the elephant in the room here. It's not price. It's not fidelity to the original design. it's more subtle than that, and that's why people aren't putting a finger on it.

It's the expression of his ego in this thing, that people don't like. I've proposed to him that he ought to release the plans and allow us all to make our own Nivex. It's folded sheet metal, after all. We can order metal and get it cut. Maybe 3D print some parts, as he did in some iterations. He could crowdsource the development. Crowdsourcing the development of this thing could have been great publicity among the exact crowd who'd be interested in it. And it reduces exclusivity, which could be helpful within such an exclusive niche of an already exclusive hobby. AND I'd wager that he would not even lose sales. The type of person who's going to make one isn't the type who'd buy one. But he hasn't done that, and I can see no other reason than vanity. And we know what Vélocio said: Ne jamais pédaler par amour-propre. Never ride for vanity. Remember Lance? That's why some people dislike him too. It's the elephant in the room. That's why I'm calling my east-coast shadow-organization Cycles René Hubris. It's a grim reminder we all fall for it from time to time.

Now for some nuts and bolts. Because I read about the Nivex in the first edition of the Dancing Chain when it came out in 2000, and first saw one in Nijmegen in 2002, and I own an original Nivex and a frame for it, so I feel that I can comment about this:
What about the dropout? Where's the fancy dropout? Those dropouts he sells don't have a chainrest. Is that not the point of the whole thing? Yes, he said that it "doesn't work well with modern cassettes" but what does that mean? Did he even try? He used to sorta show his methods for developing new stuff, like supple tires and thin wall tubing. Not so anymore? Am I wrong? Is it in BQ someplace?

To my mind, the dropout is a necessary part of the system with a chainstay-mounted rear derailleur. As you can see, the chain wraps way around the cog. Anyone who's ever had to remove a wheel with this kind of system sans chainrest knows that it involves touching the chain - quite a bit, in fact. That's why Tullio's Gran Sport was a better system for racers than these chainstay-mounted cyclotouring derailleurs: you could easily and quickly remove a wheel by pivoting the derailleur back on its mounting bolt. Can't do that with a chainstay-mounted derailleur. Hence, the chainrest. Seems it would play well with thru-axles. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I wonder if he's missed an opportunity here. Or, if there will be an improved dropout, if not an improved derailleur, coming out someday. I can guess about why the chainrest didn't work for him. Maybe because small cogs are all different sizes? If that's the case, why not make them replaceable, like the Campy portacatena? Like I said, I've been curious about this since 2002. That's more than half my life. I was thinking about making a chainrest for my rinko Trek mongrel, but I don't have enough time to really sink my teeth into that project.

Finally, I wonder if he can even legally trademark the Nivex name, since it has already appeared on the same object. Is there no prior-art clause for trademarks? Maybe he can only trademark it in the USA, because it was probably only ever registered in France. I will ask my trademark attorney friend next time I see her.

L134 

It's got me thinking about another bike I don't need. That's worth something? I can easily imagine that friction shifting without the springs could be a really nice improvement. I guess I'd like to be able to try it before buying it. Otherwise, the only thing about the announcement that annoys me is that everything one needs to make it functional is not available and there is no mention of when all the bits will be available (or did I miss that?).

daka

You are correct, I've never subscribed to BQ and don't follow any blogging he posts. What I know of the Nivex is from Frank Berto's "The Dancing Chain". I find Jan Heine to be tiresome in a "Big Hat, No Cattle" kind of way. But the truth is that there is no victim here - the original Nivex is long dead, he isn't depriving some grieving widow of a royalty income. In fact the only person likely to be hurt financially by the new Nivex is Heine himself. I'm going to try and twist my attitude and dislike around to see this as a labor of love trying to honor the original idea rather than exploit it.

esasjl

There are two bikes I'd really like to have. One is a Tony Oliver 753 ATB tourer and the other is an Oregon Outback Rene Herse. If either are ever available I'll not be able to afford them, but, like the Nivex, I can appreciate them from afar and make do with what I have. I'm really glad there are folk out there doing different things.

Classtime 

I think he really likes riding bikes. And he gets to build really cool bikes to ride lots. And that is his job. I am jealous.

Atlas Shrugged

Trying to figure out the basis for that comment. We have a person who believes strongly in analyzing lessons learned in the past and put his money where his mouth is. From the newsletter, blog and manufacturing you could say there is a lot of cattle behind that hat.

BoltBreaker

For that much money, a rider could simply opt for a tried & true Rohloff hub & shifter knob. But for the common bloke looking to upgrade his C&V frame? Sorry, RH have jumped the shark, this is just folly.

steelbikeguy

just wondering....
you mention owning a Nivex equipped bike and show this photo.
Maybe it's just the angle, but it looks a lot like a Cyclo.
The only image that I could quickly find of a Cyclo is from the Dancing Chain...




plus this image of a Jo Routens displayed at a semi-recent Classic Rendezvous event by Mr. Della Rossa



Steve in Peoria

GullyFoylesbike

It's an interesting example of how online reputation & marketing develops - I feel like (lately at least, I'm relatively new to all of this) Peterson/Riv evoke such a wildly different set of responses from people than Heine, despite there being so many similarities between the companies. People just seem to not like Heine (or at least, not like how he holds himself out publicly).