Soody

Any ideas what this is? Or, what's the deal with this tubing?

It's got a 70mm bb. 126 rear spacing. A 25 mm campag post, but the binder bolt is pinched closed so maybe too small. The top tube, downtube, and one chainstay are cool shapes/ not round. Weighs 11.13 kg.

Soody

The bad:
brake cable is siezed in the top tube with rust
the rear derailer is damaged with extreme slop and the hanger is bent
the guy didn't measure c-c so it's smaller than I thought so I can't steal the fork for my concorde which is probably a good thing.
It's red

masispecial

Columbus Multishape tubing. Each tube was supposedly optimised for the specific loads imposed on it. There was a lugset that was usually supplied with the tubeset.
I am fairly sure 25.0 was the ‘correct’ seatpost diameter.

Jimbo1983

That bike looks nice, I saw that one too. It was very vague on details on the listing.

You gonna use the saddle? I've been looking for a Rolls like that for a while. What length steerer do you need for your Concorde? I've got a couple of forks from 62 cm frames that might suit. One from a frame that cracked the headtube and one that had a twisted seattube (yeah actually twisted) from trying to force a stuck seatpost out (not me the person I bought it from) so no damage to the forks.

seagrade 

I think it's highly unlikely but when I saw the font and style of the "Super Built" decal and the fillet brazed construction I just thought Dave Tesch.

I have no idea if he built from Columbus MS at any stage. May he rest in peace.

Back in the day I thought his frames were very cool. I think the OTTL was my frame of choice for a while, not that I ever saw a Tesch for real in my corner of the world.

Jimbo1983

Nevermind I just looked in your Concorde thread and saw the length, the two I have are shorter than 237. You might have to Ebay something

Soody

Yeah the guy had no idea what it was, and had never ridden it. He apparently got it from a church fair for super cheap. He was a bit salty about the price he got with the auction too. I had asked him to go and view it and was gonna offer more in cash but he refused. Anyways. Auction ended when everyone was at the beach.
I do quite like Rolls, more than the other selles, I have one on another bike. I'll let you know if i want to sell though and give you a good price.

and the fork is stupidly long. I'm not in a rush to replace it. The allum one rides fine now that I toed the pads.

Jimbo1983

Oh yeah that'll do it, glad you sorted the judder out!

It's funny how the timing of auctions can really make or break them, when the Rugby is on is a good time to bid too.

Thanks for keeping me in mind for the saddle, I was probably being a bit cheeky there but there aren't many people on here from NZ so worth asking

Soody

Super Built Mt Albert Cycles it says
It's a local bike shop sticker, I assume that specced the frame? Maybe the Mt Albert Cycles that became Mt Albert Mowers and Cycles now just Mt Albert Mowers. Used to be a pretty good shop.

Soody

haha yea no it's all good
oooo that game. Feel terrible for Drouin

Soody

thanks man
good to hear the seatpost is maybe right
will investigate but i don't think i've ever seen a nice seatpost in even vaguely that size.

so it's some italian nonsense that never caught on?

non-fixie 

25.0 mm is not that uncommon. It was also the correct size for quite a few early aluminium bikes, such as Alan.

MauriceMoss

The fork crown panto is that of Krapf (a Swiss company from Bischofszell in the canton of Thurgau):






A lot of their frames (if not most) that you're gonna find online were made by Giovanni Losa. The mystery frame, however, doesn't exhibit any characteristics of a Losa build.


There were non-Losa Krapfs, but I've never found confirmation of who the suppliers were.
Among these I've only seen a couple that were fillet brazed (and generally matched the one in this thread). Here's one that was resprayed:











The mystery frame looks (to my eyes) more French than anything else. Actually, now that I look at it in more detail, I'd say it was very likely made by Francis Quillon's workshop, since it looks very much like some Geliano frames. Overall fillet brazing, the rear end, the top tube internal cable routing style (coming out at the top near the seat post), as well as the Italian threading and 25mm post are all consistent with Gelianos I've seen.

So, it is possible that Krapf contracted Quillon to build a small number of frames for them (which would explain why these fillet-brazed ones are rare), or maybe this is a Geliano with a Krapf fork.


Here is a couple of fillet brazed Geliano bikes made with Columbus MS tubing:

Bianchigirll 

It’s sad that bike was left to get like that but as awful as it seems to us, to most people a bicycle is…. we’ll just a bicycle.

I’ve always wanted to try out a MS tubed bike but sadly there don’t seem to be many around so the price is seldom reasonable.

velomateo

Ugh, cable rusted into the top tube is a real pain. I had a Masi with that same issue. I tried flushing it with Kroil for 6 months with no results. I ended up using cable clamps when I sold it off.
I hope the OP has better luck than me, that's a cool frame that deserves better.

masispecial

There was no Multishape Mk2. I think it was too weird for the conservative road market, and probably pretty annoying to build with.

Aluminium Vitus frames used 25.0mm posts, so most major component makers offered the size BITD.

I am wondering if pouring Evaporust into the brake cable tunnel might be more effective than penetrating oil.

masispecial

I never heard of Mt Albert Mowers and Cycles importing any frames, so I guess they built it up for someone who imported it privately.

1simplexnut

Just the three of us ?

Soody

Sounds rough.
Thankfully I got this one. Success simply yanking it out. Took a lot of force and the coils in the cable did pull apart but the outer layer stayed intact and the cable had not rusted through. Cleaning it up to smoothly accept a replacement cable will be the real challenge now

That's a good idea but I suspect there will be holes in the tube inside the frame so it would just run out? Maybe soaking a rope or something in evaporust to pull through would work best. Iunno. Or construct some kind of brush that wouldn't come apart to pull through repeatedly and clean it.

I do actually really like brake cables internally in the top tube, despite the obvious problems it can cause and the worse braking performance. Makes shouldering and straddling the bike nice. So I would like to fix this rather than replace with clamps.

Soody

It's before my time. Also maybe a different shop.

Soody

@ MauriceMoss
Amazing info. Thank you.

It turns out Krapf (love that name) still exists, as Radsport Krapf.
I have sent them a speculative email to see if they can provide any info.
"Sie haben folgende Daten gesendet"

Soody

Well there is some truth to it just being a bicycle. On the up side the tricolor hubs feel fantastic. And it has a mint Dura Ace 7400 bb. No pitting.
Will report back on the ride when it's riding. I'm pretty curious.

Soody

I think this fork is a replacement.
It has been cut very wonky. The threaded section is shorter than usual and there's no keyed part.
Would you expect campagnolo dropouts with campagnolo fork ends?
I'm not sure if the style matches either.






This is a shame because I was quite keen on having KRAPF decals.

Soody

I will have to be careful reinstalling the headset. Maybe I should square up the end of the steerer? Not sure how though.

masispecial

From sometime in the 80s until a couple of years ago there was only one shop with the same ownership