Vintage Falcon Reynolds 531 Frame
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Vintage Falcon Reynolds 531 Frame
I am looking for help in identifying (and possible valuing) a unique Falcon 1970's (possibly 1980s) frame that I brought with me (as a full bike) from the UK. I have owned the bike since 1986 and it was purchased from a bike builder/trader in Cambridge, UK who had stripped it down and chromed it from head to toe. Hence some of the badges and original decals are missing. The frame is in great shape and has some very fancy lugs that seem fairly rare to me. I have retained the original Wienmann brake hoods, levers and side-pull brakes and the (possibly original, possibly Campagnolo) gear shifters. It has the number (s/n?) 18760 stamped on the frame above the rear wheel axle.
Any thoughts & suggestions (or interest in purchasing) will be welcome.
I look forward to hearing from you
--Tony Simon
(I do have all the remaining components too, but there are almost certainly later additions so I figured I'd stick with what was most clearly "native". I am happy to supply info and pictures of pedals, cranks, derailleurs etc)
Full frame
Original brake hoods/levers
Bottom bracket with lugwork
Rear brake
Seatpost lugs
Front lugs
Front brake
Any thoughts & suggestions (or interest in purchasing) will be welcome.
I look forward to hearing from you
--Tony Simon
(I do have all the remaining components too, but there are almost certainly later additions so I figured I'd stick with what was most clearly "native". I am happy to supply info and pictures of pedals, cranks, derailleurs etc)
Full frame
Original brake hoods/levers
Bottom bracket with lugwork
Rear brake
Seatpost lugs
Front lugs
Front brake
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It seems that I cannot post the pictures until I have made 10 posts on the forum, according the popup! Very frustrating. I can supply pictures on request.
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Just mid even with the nice chrome it's only $150 or so at best I wouldn't doe more than $75 as is . Note strait tab rear and front tabs with single bracket mount's and best guess slightly poor alignment.. Looks great but only step above mass retail.
Last edited by zukahn1; 10-01-22 at 07:13 PM.
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More Pics Be Better
Does not scream "Falcon." Also not a "mid range" bicycle.
Is there a number on the steerer tube? Is the "serial number" embossed into both rear dropouts? Would you please upload a photo of the rear brake bridge? Are there holes on the inside of the head tube for a head badge? Which size is the seatpost? Would you please take additional photographs of the lugwork, perhaps removing the components blocking the view, and of the fork crown as well?
This is an interesting specimen, but absent the signature wrapover seat stays, likely not a "Falcon." Could be a 1954 Holdsworth. Perhaps you might post it over at CR as it's populated by some with deep knowledge of earlier British bikes.
(We'd be interested as it appears to be our size, around 24", but...)
Is there a number on the steerer tube? Is the "serial number" embossed into both rear dropouts? Would you please upload a photo of the rear brake bridge? Are there holes on the inside of the head tube for a head badge? Which size is the seatpost? Would you please take additional photographs of the lugwork, perhaps removing the components blocking the view, and of the fork crown as well?
This is an interesting specimen, but absent the signature wrapover seat stays, likely not a "Falcon." Could be a 1954 Holdsworth. Perhaps you might post it over at CR as it's populated by some with deep knowledge of earlier British bikes.
(We'd be interested as it appears to be our size, around 24", but...)
Last edited by machinist42; 10-01-22 at 09:03 PM.
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I do not recognize the lugs, but the fork ends seem older than 70's to me, and certainly the slack seat tube angle speaks to an earlier date of manufacture. This would be in keeping with the rear dropouts lacking an integral hanger. It's an interesting frame, and probably if juvela drops in, he will have something to say about the lugs and other frame fittings. Those pump pegs on the top tube, no braze on bottle cage fittings, etc. I think it might be a little older than you have estimated.
Otherwise, I'm no help. All the Falcon bikes I've seen in person are different from yours.
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A typical Falcon from the 70's found here in California and restored.
One of their straight gauge (unbutted) 531 frames
A 531 Reynolds double butted frame. This was their top of the line in the 70's.
So a couple of things. I think that the top of the line baby blue ones might have come fully chromed and then overpainted from the manufacturer. Not 100% sure on that. Anyway, that's often the case with frames that show up with chrome on the head lugs and on the stays.
But more importantly note the different frame details, especially in the geometry. of the frame and the more relaxed seat tube angle on your bike.
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...at a guess, it appears to be a frame that was originally fully chromed, but only polished in the places where it was not going to be painted. Then, somewhere before you got it, someone stripped off the paint, and stuck those decals on it. This would explain all the rougher looking places in the chroing, on the tubes near the lugs and bottom bracket. That's kind of what bikes look like when someone does this. It's not a big deal, but they look better when you mask off the polished portions , like the stays and lugs, and repaint.
All of this is guesswork on my part. But I have done some similar restorations. Still, I have no idea if it is or is not a Falcon.
...at a guess, it appears to be a frame that was originally fully chromed, but only polished in the places where it was not going to be painted. Then, somewhere before you got it, someone stripped off the paint, and stuck those decals on it. This would explain all the rougher looking places in the chroing, on the tubes near the lugs and bottom bracket. That's kind of what bikes look like when someone does this. It's not a big deal, but they look better when you mask off the polished portions , like the stays and lugs, and repaint.
All of this is guesswork on my part. But I have done some similar restorations. Still, I have no idea if it is or is not a Falcon.
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machinist42 is spot on - this is not a Falcon but a 1954 Holdsworth.
Those fancy spear point lugs indicate it's a Cyclone. That model was in production for a long time and had a fair bit of variation, but even within the same year (at least when comparing serial numbers) there were minor differences. This is why you might see other Cyclones from the same year with a different fork crown.
Here are some pics:
Those fancy spear point lugs indicate it's a Cyclone. That model was in production for a long time and had a fair bit of variation, but even within the same year (at least when comparing serial numbers) there were minor differences. This is why you might see other Cyclones from the same year with a different fork crown.
Here are some pics:
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machinist42 is spot on - this is not a Falcon but a 1954 Holdsworth.
Those fancy spear point lugs indicate it's a Cyclone. That model was in production for a long time and had a fair bit of variation, but even within the same year (at least when comparing serial numbers) there were minor differences. This is why you might see other Cyclones from the same year with a different fork crown.
Here are some pics:
Those fancy spear point lugs indicate it's a Cyclone. That model was in production for a long time and had a fair bit of variation, but even within the same year (at least when comparing serial numbers) there were minor differences. This is why you might see other Cyclones from the same year with a different fork crown.
Here are some pics:
Last edited by zukahn1; 10-02-22 at 09:36 AM.
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...it would be a more difficult restoration, because of the absence of most of the 1950's components. Not impossible, but more painful and more expensive without some sort of donor bike or an extensive parts stash. There's a 1950's Bianchi on the local Sacramento CL right now that has many of the original parts still on the frame, but it's one of those rust projects. I have been cured of those. 1954 is not too old to find the stuff to build it back close to original, but it's old enough that the stuff is a little pricey.
So if your intention is to sell it and move on, that will save you a lot of money. But you ought to consider that in the sales price. I'm sure someone could put it back on the road in Davis or Sacramento with parts similar to the ones you removed, and that would cost less.
The whole restoration thing is a money pit, and I don't know many people still doing it, except the guys over on the CABE. And they mostly are into old pre-war cruisers.
Edit: I reread this, and it seemed a little negative. A lot of the stuff, like GB brakes and the Williams C34 cottered crank that are mentioned as "proper" build components, were made in great numbers, and for a long time. I have a Williams crank on a mid 60's Carlton, so it's not like they are rare, exactly. But it takes a long time to search them out in the United States, because not that many of them were sold here, as compared to the UK. Once you start shopping for stuff to do your restoration in England, the costs begin to rise rapidly.
...it would be a more difficult restoration, because of the absence of most of the 1950's components. Not impossible, but more painful and more expensive without some sort of donor bike or an extensive parts stash. There's a 1950's Bianchi on the local Sacramento CL right now that has many of the original parts still on the frame, but it's one of those rust projects. I have been cured of those. 1954 is not too old to find the stuff to build it back close to original, but it's old enough that the stuff is a little pricey.
So if your intention is to sell it and move on, that will save you a lot of money. But you ought to consider that in the sales price. I'm sure someone could put it back on the road in Davis or Sacramento with parts similar to the ones you removed, and that would cost less.
The whole restoration thing is a money pit, and I don't know many people still doing it, except the guys over on the CABE. And they mostly are into old pre-war cruisers.
Edit: I reread this, and it seemed a little negative. A lot of the stuff, like GB brakes and the Williams C34 cottered crank that are mentioned as "proper" build components, were made in great numbers, and for a long time. I have a Williams crank on a mid 60's Carlton, so it's not like they are rare, exactly. But it takes a long time to search them out in the United States, because not that many of them were sold here, as compared to the UK. Once you start shopping for stuff to do your restoration in England, the costs begin to rise rapidly.
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Last edited by 3alarmer; 10-02-22 at 11:30 AM.
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Nice frame!
In terms of valuation I would gladly pay $250 for frame and fork if it fit me. Alas, it appears too small.
Brent
In terms of valuation I would gladly pay $250 for frame and fork if it fit me. Alas, it appears too small.
Brent
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Thanks machinist24! You have raised a lot of interesting Qs. I did not expect the guy who sold it to me might be telling "porkies" so I always assumed it was a Falcon, but never saw one with similar lugs. I have a few more pics, and will take further ones as requested. I am still running into limits with uploading pics and have not been able to edit my gallery for some reason. The number is only stamped on the LEFT rear dropout, as shown in the picture). There are holes in the head tube for a badge (pic to come soon) though it looks like 1 or two have been filled. I don't think the seat post you see inserted is original but I am not sure exactly what you are asking when you say "what size is the seat post". Can you give me some more detail to that q? Strictly speaking, the center of the crank to the top of the tube is 23". Now it is stripped down and I am looking closer I see a mark I have never noticed before on the top of that crank case! It seems to be the letter R and then a large oval with a horizontal line through it (bike wheel? letter G?) and then what looks like the letter H, all contained within an oval frame. That picture and the one of the badge holes are now in the gallery called "Falcon (but probably not?) frame pictures".
Please keep the Qs coming and I will add even more pics
Please keep the Qs coming and I will add even more pics
Last edited by tjsimon1; 10-02-22 at 09:48 PM.
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Thanks for your thoughts. It measures as 23" (center of crank case to top of tube)
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"Porkies?"
Thanks machinist24! You have raised a lot of interesting Qs. I did not expect the guy who sold it to me might be telling "porkies" so I always assumed it was a Falcon, but never saw one with similar lugs. I have a few more pics, and will take further ones as requested. I am still running into limits with uploading pics and have not been able to edit my gallery for some reason. The number is only stamped on the LEFT rear dropout, as shown in the picture). There are holes in the head tube for a badge (pic to come soon) though it looks like 1 or two have been filled. I don't think the seat post you see inserted is original but I am not sure exactly what you are asking when you say "what size is the seat post". Can you give me some more detail to that q? Strictly speaking, the center of the crank to the top of the tube is 23". Now it is stripped down and I am looking closer I see a mark I have never noticed before on the top of that crank case! It seems to be the letter R and then a large oval with a horizontal line through it (bike wheel? letter G?) and then what looks like the letter H, all contained within an oval frame. That picture and the one of the badge holes are now in the gallery called "Falcon (but probably not?) frame pictures".
Please keep the Qs coming and I will add even more pics
Please keep the Qs coming and I will add even more pics
"RGF."
No worries. Your pictures upload even though the popup says "nope."
Curious about the seat post or seat pillar as Holdsworth doesn't specify tubing used for their 1954 Cyclone, and the size of the seat post can often belie the tubing used.. It's likely Accles & Pollock and there's probably an almost indiscernible tubing stamp maybe on the steerer tube or downtube.
Any additional photographs of frame details is appreciated as we view few examples of 1954 Holdsworth Cyclones.
Last edited by machinist42; 10-02-22 at 10:42 PM. Reason: Grim Grammers.
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I think you all have nailed it. From everything I see here and the new pictures I have added, I am solidly convinced that this is 1954 Holdsworth Cyclone frame. (Now it has some extra personal value since the sadly-departed Alan Holdsworth was one of my very favorite "jazz" guitarists). I am interested in selling if anyone has an interest. I very much appreciate all the comments and identifiers. If there are any dissenters, I'd be interested to hear from you too.
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No worries. Your pictures upload even though the popup says "nope."
Curious about the seat post or seat pillar as Holdsworth doesn't specify tubing used for their 1954 Cyclone, and the size of the seat post can often belie the tubing used.. It's likely Accles & Pollock and there's probably an almost indiscernible tubing stamp maybe on the steerer tube or downtube.
Any additional photographs of frame details is appreciated as we don't see many examples of 1954 Holdsworth Cyclones.
Thanks again Machinist42. I'll keep digging to see what I can find on the bike as I am now very intrigued. The seat tube is currently immovable but I'll work on loosening it to see what I can see. Nothing visible elsewhere but I'll keep looking and will add to the gallery.
Curious about the seat post or seat pillar as Holdsworth doesn't specify tubing used for their 1954 Cyclone, and the size of the seat post can often belie the tubing used.. It's likely Accles & Pollock and there's probably an almost indiscernible tubing stamp maybe on the steerer tube or downtube.
Any additional photographs of frame details is appreciated as we don't see many examples of 1954 Holdsworth Cyclones.
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Carry On Pic Assist
Still would appreciate a photograph of the rear brake bridge, You may have to remove the caliper to shoot a clean shot. Is it arched or straight?
Thank you for uploading the additional pics!
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I own an early '70s Falcon San Remo and a Holdsworth Professional. You will be happier with a Holdsworth instead of a Falcon.
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Still would appreciate a photograph of the rear brake bridge, You may have to remove the caliper to shoot a clean shot. Is it arched or straight?
Thank you for uploading the additional pics!
Rear brake bridge is arched - photo added to gallery
Thank you for uploading the additional pics!
Rear brake bridge is arched - photo added to gallery