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Why don't people want to pedal anymore?

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Why don't people want to pedal anymore?

Old 09-08-22, 03:33 PM
  #126  
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Originally Posted by DMC707 View Post
I gotta admit, my only experience with e-bike users is mountain bikers on actual trails. Locally in the central Oklahoma area, the most prominent e-bikers here are in their 70's , but Bentonville AR is not far away, and the place has wonderful downhill trails - but precious few shuttles and no lifts.

In either of those scenarios , --- sure, some backyard mechanic may be able to tune his E-MTB to run a theoretical 40mph, but they will soon find themselves bouncing off trees as tthe trails can only support speeds of 9 or 10 mph for mere mortals and perhaps 12-13 for legitimate racer types


I actually love it that the 70 ish y/o guy (and his wife) whom i know to both have matching turbo Levo MTB's - are putting in average laps to rival mine on Strava
It for sure is a location sensitive issue. The Ebikers ride the sidewalks, weave from riding on the streets to zipping up on the grass, over to a sidewalk, cutting across parking lots. Basically like an electrical circuit, finding the lead resistant path (pun intended) to maintain constant movement & speed.
When a regular ole pedal bicycle comes up & around them on the roadway, they seem peeved in most cases too. That's when you'll find out if they are governed at 20MPH or not.
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Old 09-08-22, 06:04 PM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
The new hazard around here (Silicon Valley) is the e-scooter. They are limited to 15 mph, but many have been hacked to go much faster.
Saw a guy here recently doing over 50 down hill and easily maintaining 35 on flat.

Most of the e-bikes I see are the fat bike type and are usually ridden on the sidewalk at relatively low speed.
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Old 09-08-22, 08:09 PM
  #128  
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It's not really about being too young to ride an e-bike. My single is analog and our tandem low level PAS assist, what the assist does is cut down the time of the ride on either your route or getting to a break point at a favorite food stop that analog would take longer to get too- so things like your lunch break or sun setting become a factor. Same effort- further range. For us it's maybe a 3mph difference but that's significant. Just adding another viewpoint besides ability.
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Old 09-09-22, 01:07 AM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs View Post
Ummmmm .... wow ..... yeah the United States are Vastly different than Germany.

Come on over ..... you won't want to visit twice.
I'm actually American
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Old 09-09-22, 06:26 AM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by kayakindude View Post
It's not really about being too young to ride an e-bike. My single is analog and our tandem low level PAS assist, what the assist does is cut down the time of the ride on either your route or getting to a break point at a favorite food stop that analog would take longer to get too- so things like your lunch break or sun setting become a factor. Same effort- further range. For us it's maybe a 3mph difference but that's significant. Just adding another viewpoint besides ability.
I'm not speaking for others, but I condone FCC approved & ADA backed OPDMD that are E powered for pedestrian handicap mobility use. If a handicapped ped is using equipment outside of the FCC approved ped mobility equipment on a MUP with the motorized vehicle restriction, then they would be equally subject to disciplinary action as anyone else. The day I witness a sane handicapped individual abuse a MUP in that fashion, it might become one of the top five disheartening things I've been exposed....

Originally Posted by Germany_chris View Post
I'm actually American
every few years, the ways of life in the USA tends to take a turn, resulting in an obsolete understanding of our culture.
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Old 09-09-22, 06:50 AM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by Troul View Post
I'm not speaking for others, but I condone FCC approved & ADA backed OPDMD that are E powered for pedestrian handicap mobility use. If a handicapped ped is using equipment outside of the FCC approved ped mobility equipment on a MUP with the motorized vehicle restriction, then they would be equally subject to disciplinary action as anyone else. The day I witness a sane handicapped individual abuse a MUP in that fashion, it might become one of the top five disheartening things I've been exposed....


every few years, the ways of life in the USA tends to take a turn, resulting in an obsolete understanding of our culture.
Since when does the FCC approve mobility equipment? Other than the electronics not producing spurious RF emissions, that is.
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Old 09-09-22, 06:54 AM
  #132  
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Originally Posted by Milton Keynes View Post
Since when does the FCC approve mobility equipment? Other than the electronics not producing spurious RF emissions, that is.
https://www.fcc.gov/engineering-tech...-authorization

Maybe I am reading it wrong, but that outlines the process in a nutshell.
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Old 09-09-22, 07:05 AM
  #133  
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That's just for RF emitting devices, unless the mobility device uses a radio signal for whatever reason there's no need to get FCC approval for it. There is a requirement that any electronics must have spurious emission levels under a certain level, though, and under Part 15 they are not allowed to interfere with any service and must accept any interference. But just about all electronic devices fall under that rule.
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Old 09-09-22, 07:19 AM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by Germany_chris View Post
I'm actually American
Don't tell me your problems ....

If I go into the city this weekend I might look and see what the rent-a-bikes are all about ... but I know they rent electric scooters as well (same company) and I wouldn't be surprised if the bikes, like the scooters, were full electric, no pedals needed. Greater appeal across a wider range .....

All the people I know with e-bikes are cyclists who wanted or needed a little assist, which are not the folks causing trouble for the OP.

I am sure there are sales stats somewhere online .... but I don't care that much. I am just here for the bad jokes and silliness.
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Old 09-09-22, 07:26 AM
  #135  
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Originally Posted by DonkeyShow View Post
That's the thing with e bikes tho, it's fun but fun gets boring kinda quick.
After almost 15,000 miles on eBikes, I have to say I知 not yet bored. Still lots of fun.
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Old 09-09-22, 07:43 AM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by Germany_chris View Post
Unless the states is vastly different than Europe the vast majority of e-bikes are pedalecs that need pedaled.
Apparently, yes, vastly different. Many of the e-whatevers I see are pure throttle machines with pedals. We can argue all the semantics of the different classes like some on this thread are doing so they feel better about themselves, but the reality is to most consumers they're all electric bikes. Typical Joe Consumer will be much happier with the $1k China POS that does 30 mph than the $10k Trek that has all sorts of self-imposed rules and limitations around it.
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Old 09-09-22, 08:06 AM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by msu2001la View Post
My neighbor's teenage kid drives a 400+ HP car that will go 150mph+, but sure... age and speed limits for e-bikes because they're so dangerous and what not.
Good point. So many more idiots driving cars than e-bikes.
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Old 09-09-22, 09:00 AM
  #138  
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Comparing POVs with BSOs is not apples to apples. More like eggplants to bricks.
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Old 09-09-22, 09:18 AM
  #139  
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Originally Posted by Troul View Post
I'm not speaking for others, but I condone FCC approved & ADA backed OPDMD that are E powered for pedestrian handicap mobility use. If a handicapped ped is using equipment outside of the FCC approved ped mobility equipment on a MUP with the motorized vehicle restriction, then they would be equally subject to disciplinary action as anyone else. The day I witness a sane handicapped individual abuse a MUP in that fashion, it might become one of the top five disheartening things I've been exposed....


every few years, the ways of life in the USA tends to take a turn, resulting in an obsolete understanding of our culture.
Yea .gov ships me back every once and a while so I can keep up with the changes
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Old 09-10-22, 11:52 PM
  #140  
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
There is a 52 mile paved bike trail about an hour from home that I will ride at least once a year. I've been riding this trail for 7 years now.

This past weekend I spent a day riding it and was amazed that roughly ~80% of the users I encountered were on e-bikes and the majority of them were young people...20's and 30's. Not the older people that may have some disability or other physical limitation that would otherwise prevent them from riding. This is something that I never seen before in the years I've been riding it and found it somewhat disturbing.

Then to top it off...some of them almost ran into me causing a crash. You could tell that they lacked biked handling skills (probably their 3rd time riding a bike in years) and were weaving all over the trail instead of sticking to the side and normally wouldn't be riding that fast if they had to pedal.

I just don't get this e-bike craze.
I hear where you're coming from. However, to counter this, apparently several studies have shown people who own and ride e-bikes are getting more exercise than on their Amish bikes. AARP was one of those reporting these findings. Some of it may simply be the thrill of the new ride, or marketing or who knows what. But if it's getting more people out and exercising, I can't complain too much.

Now the other aspect of this e-bike and e-mobility thing is the potential big positive.

Once the pandemic restrictions were dropped, after over a year of very little traffic, gridlock quickly returned. One popular freeway was backed up as usual, as everyone was heading to the beach. What a shame.

And the electric car will do NOTHING to address this. A freeway full of bumper-to-bumper, crawling Teslas is just as bad as idling muscle cars, transportation-wise.

Well, the electric bike (and other individual modes of transportation) has the potential to really change things. That popular beach everyone visits, but has to survive an hour of bumper-to-bumper traffic could be easily reached on e-bikes. Take the back roads through the redwoods to the beach on a really fun ride. No more gridlock grind, no more road rage, frustration and parking nightmares.

I wonder if e-bikes will precipitate the conversion of many of our urban freeway lanes to e-bike usage instead. I know this is probably wishful thinking on my part, but it's definitely within the realm of possibility. And for this reason, I welcome e-bikes. I just wish users could obey common sense, not blast other cyclists at 40mph and use a bell!
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Old 09-11-22, 06:51 AM
  #141  
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Originally Posted by LV2TNDM View Post
I hear where you're coming from. However, to counter this, apparently several studies have shown people who own and ride e-bikes are getting more exercise than on their Amish bikes. AARP was one of those reporting these findings. Some of it may simply be the thrill of the new ride, or marketing or who knows what. But if it's getting more people out and exercising, I can't complain too much.
I live on the edge of the largest Amish communities in the USA. The Amish are now about 50% E bikes and it shows in their prosperity. The number of illegal bikes for the Amish is the highest I have seen anywhere. 3,000 watts and all throttles are not uncommon. I was passed at 25 mph by an Amish guy pulling a trailer with regular car type tires on it with goats, chickens and tools in it headed for an auction up the road. When I passed the auction there were way more e bikes than buggies. Buggies are for going to meetings now. They have a wide choice of color, black.

It takes about 750 watts to go 28 mph, 3,000 watts to go 40 mph and 7,500 watts to go 50 mph so when I read these negative comments about speeds, I have never witnessed in 20k miles of e biking, I have a big BS meter going.
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Old 09-11-22, 07:09 AM
  #142  
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Originally Posted by KPREN View Post
It takes about 750 watts to go 28 mph, 3,000 watts to go 40 mph and 7,500 watts to go 50 mph so when I read these negative comments about speeds, I have never witnessed in 20k miles of e biking, I have a big BS meter going.
Those power vs speed numbers seem excessive. Pros maintain 28 mph often in breakaways, and there is no way they are producing 750 watts.

28 mph on a road bike requires around 400 watts, maybe slightly more. 750 watts would result in speeds in the mid 30s. 40 mph, maybe 1200 watts or so.
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Old 09-11-22, 07:37 AM
  #143  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
Those power vs speed numbers seem excessive. Pros maintain 28 mph often in breakaways, and there is no way they are producing 750 watts.

28 mph on a road bike requires around 400 watts, maybe slightly more. 750 watts would result in speeds in the mid 30s. 40 mph, maybe 1200 watts or so.
Never seen a pro on a heavy upright e bike. If you can identify the bike, as an e bike when it goes by, you are not looking at a 400-watt 28mph bike. An e bike doing 28mph looks very fast to an observer where a car doing the same speed looks slow.
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Old 09-11-22, 07:46 AM
  #144  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
Those power vs speed numbers seem excessive. Pros maintain 28 mph often in breakaways, and there is no way they are producing 750 watts.

28 mph on a road bike requires around 400 watts, maybe slightly more. 750 watts would result in speeds in the mid 30s. 40 mph, maybe 1200 watts or so.
Pros are also pedaling a 16 lb bike. Less watts required
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Old 09-11-22, 08:42 AM
  #145  
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
There is a 52 mile paved bike trail about an hour from home that I will ride at least once a year. I've been riding this trail for 7 years now.

This past weekend I spent a day riding it and was amazed that roughly ~80% of the users I encountered were on e-bikes and the majority of them were young people...20's and 30's. Not the older people that may have some disability or other physical limitation that would otherwise prevent them from riding. This is something that I never seen before in the years I've been riding it and found it somewhat disturbing.

Then to top it off...some of them almost ran into me causing a crash. You could tell that they lacked biked handling skills (probably their 3rd time riding a bike in years) and were weaving all over the trail instead of sticking to the side and normally wouldn't be riding that fast if they had to pedal.

I just don't get this e-bike craze.
Ebikes are addictive. My reg bike been collecting dust. Some say you get just as much exercise as riding a regular bike because ebike ppl tend to ride further distances than before.

I ride more often now and further distances. However I cannot lose the weight off the midsection vs when riding a regular bike. Because you get into a lazy habit of letting the motor do half the work for you.
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Old 09-11-22, 09:21 AM
  #146  
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
Pros are also pedaling a 16 lb bike. Less watts required
Pedaling a heavier bike on a flat road requires very little additional power.

Kreuzotter power calculator, default settings, road bike, 28 mph:
  • 16-lb bike - 442 Watts
  • 30-lb bike - 445 Watts
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Old 09-11-22, 09:21 AM
  #147  
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I read somewhere that you burn 48 calories/mile riding a bike. I asked my DW to haul me to the top of the highest hill around here and I'd meet her at the bottom.... We'd repeat that until all the weight was gone.
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Old 09-11-22, 09:34 AM
  #148  
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Originally Posted by KPREN View Post
If you can identify the bike, as an e bike when it goes by, you are not looking at a 400-watt 28mph bike.
Speak for yourself. I can spot an e-road bike quickly, whether it's standing still or passing by. One or more of the following is a "tell":
  • massive down tube
  • beefy bottom bracket
  • fat rear hub
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Old 09-11-22, 09:58 AM
  #149  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
Pedaling a heavier bike on a flat road requires very little additional power.

Kreuzotter power calculator, default settings, road bike, 28 mph:
  • 16-lb bike - 442 Watts
  • 30-lb bike - 445 Watts
I have two sets of wheels and tires. The difference between the two of them at 15mph is 120 watts. You are trying to compare a pro road bike to an e bike and there may more than double the watts at the same speed. You are also comparing weight differences on a dyno. Do you really think the 16lb bike with a rider on it who cares about windage and rolling watts is the same as the 30lb bike?

I had the chance to get on a mediocre road bike last week after not riding one in years. I could not believe how easy it was to go 18-20 mph. The same power on my S works mountain bike nets me 14 mph and on my e bike nets me 12 mph power off, no motor drag.

The average class 3, 750 watt US e bike won't do much over 28 mph unrestricted. A Sur-Ron 3000 watt bike will do 40 with the right gearing and looks like a dirt bike. A 7,500 watt Stealth Bomber will crack 50 under the right conditions, requires other than bicycle gearing and is a dirt bike. These are high rolling resistance, high windage, upright riding position e bikes, not road bikes.

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Old 09-11-22, 10:24 AM
  #150  
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If and when I go electric, it will hopefully be an electric moped. Much less expensive than any car. Some are faster than others.
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