79pmooney

Keep that old bar tape on! Don't put on the cork - until you've dialed in the levers and bars so you can ride issue free. (Pure human nature. Spend real money on a pride and joy that cannot be altered without damage, throw it on now and I guarantee you the bars/levers will stay in less than optimum position for years.)

And look seriously at modifying your setup so the drops are fully usable. They offer the most comfort and best control of the bike. Also a big change in position from all the other options.

metropical

my spouse is a PT. She'll dig your map work.
I was just at the Orthopedist for unrelated thumb issues. He was telling me how much arthritis and other problems result from thumb/fingers grip, rather then palm/fingers grip.
Definitely got to fix the issue.
I say it again, aging is for the birds.

metropical

I measured the OEM San Marco, 125mm. My buddy, whom I bought the CAAD from originally, has moved to a Giant Fleet 145.
Maybe that is the issue, that i was measured for a 175mm seat bone, but perhaps I'm used to narrower and need more cushion and the cut out rather than what is "correct" for my measurement.
Trek only stocks Trek. Hence the need to seek out an LBS even if it ain't so local.
That and the idea of a less acute and perhaps shorter stem than 85mm.
Surprised to see that 50, 90 and 110 mm seem to be very popular, at least at Modern Bike.

GAtkins

I recently went from a 138mm Bontrager, no cutout, to a 165mm with cutout. Tried a 155mm cutout, no joy. Life is better.

Glenn

burnthesheep

Seconded here, frameset is a size too small. If you've got that many stack spacers and riser stem and upturned bars and the tips of the hoods are still just now getting even with the saddle..........frameset too small.

When you see things like drop bars rotated skywards and tips of saddles having the saddle with a reverse tilt.................fit/frameset problems.

Otherwise, in general some core strength goes a long way for how much weight is on the hands. Other thing is some folks ride stiff armed versus having flex in the arm. The arms being stiff/straight would mean shocks transmit into the hands more then into the neck/shoulders. Bent arms acting as shock absorbers will relieve both the hands and the neck/shoulders.

metropical

yea, seeing where that makes sense now. but alas, now is not the time for a new bike. gonna try a stem change.

genejockey 

175mm? That seems awfully wide for a guy. Are you sure you were measured properly? Have you tried the corrugated cardboard method?

metropical

I have not, but I will now.

aliasfox

Re: Trek shops. I don't mind them in principle - why would another bike shop be a problem? It's that they're edging out multi-brand stores that carry non Trek, non Bontrager branded items. Not to mention that these multi-brand stores are usually mom and pops or locally owned chains.

A Trek store will probably carry a Trek/Bontrager stem that would fit your bike, so you could still give that a shot. Has this thread determined if you have a fat (31.6mm, I think?) bar, or a skinny (25.4mm) handlebar? I'm not sure when road bikes went fat bar, but my 2004 Bianchi is skinny, and my 2019 Lynskey is fat - so no help from me.

As for saddles - any shop, even a Trek shop, that will allow you to fit a saddle on and take it out for a ride (even with a deposit) - would be good.

Of course, there might be people who will look at you funny for having Bontrager parts on a CAAD - but ride what works!

metropical

they have been good about trying saddles thus far. Guess can't hurt to inquire about the stem.
Not entirely sure, but from measuring the OEM 95mm stem, I'd say the handlebar is 25mm.

oldbobcat

Get your weight off your hands. There are three ways to do that. First, level the saddle so you're not sliding off the nose. Second, sit more upright with a shorter, taller stem. Third, move your saddle back (and down a smidge).

genejockey 

But before you move your saddle, see if it's too far forward by seeing whether you can lift your hands off the hoods without falling on your face. Ideally you should be able to lift your hands off the hoods and sit up slowly, and then back down onto the hoods without falling forward.

genejockey 

It's almost certainly 31.8mm. That was standard by 2009.

metropical

yes, it is 31mm, just measured. I did drop the saddle back to where it was with the OEM San Marco. My thigh is still level at the top of the stroke.
The saddle is set mid bar.

"Ideally you should be able to lift your hands off the hoods and sit up slowly, and then back down onto the hoods without falling forward."
I assume you mean at a stand still? Coz I can't ride no hands.

In any case, a shorter greater angle stem is next.

genejockey 

Ideally on a trainer, if you can't ride hands off.

Iride01 

If you don't have good core strength about your waist, then this is really a pipe dream IMO. I can't really do that comfortably on my bike. Not certain I've even tried. But for certain when I've seen that suggested by professionals, they always preface it with being able to do that when cycling at a the higher end of your normal power output.

You have a fairly aggressive geometry bike. And that puts you butt and your CG further forward and more over the BB just due to the angle of the seat tube. So your pushing on the pedals while you are riding doesn't unweight your arms and hands as much as if your butt was further behind the BB's vertical datum or axis.

If you want to be lighter on your arms and hands, then you really need a different geometry bike. One that has a much slacker seat tube angle. And that might not be a road bike. Might need to look at a different style of bike to get that very slack seat tube angle that will let you sit very upright on a wider more cushy saddle and unweight your hands.

Possibly you might get some results by getting a seat post with a large amount of setback. But that might require a shorter stem or bars with less reach than you have currently.

metropical

I believe I have the core strength as I do exercise and yoga everyday for the last 20 years. I'm perhaps 10% overweight.
But not the balance or perhaps confidence to try no hands.
Not ready to give up and go to a sit up straight hybrid just yet, though there are days they look appealing.
I think my butt is behind the BB, but I have to get a picture of me to know for sure.

SoSmellyAir

Are you keeping your wrists relaxed and straight? The depicted handlebar angle is all whack; can you even use the drops?

metropical

no definitely not, and that is the issue. The drops I use occasionally, but mostly on the hoods and bar.

SoSmellyAir

Has your handlebar always been set this way!? Wrists have to be relaxed and straight when riding, else it's torture. Try the following, one at a time:

1. Rotate the handlebar (with respect to the stem) such that the ends of the handlebar (where the bar ends are inserted) are roughly parallel with the top tube (when viewed from the side).
2. Install levers further up the bar (i.e., closer to the tops), such that when your hands are on the hoods, your wrists are relaxed and straight.
3. If you need to raise the bar, or position it further forward or backward, that is done by installing a stem with a greater angle (and different length), not by tilting it.

Since you do yoga, I am assuming that you have decent flexibility, such that you have should have no trouble reaching the hoods, even if they end up a smidge lower than depicted.

metropical

I did rotate the bars up a smidge from level last week. I'll put them back.
The hoods are where they were when I got the bike, but I'll move back as you describe.
The more I read, the more it seems I need to try a shorter greater angled stem for my aging self.
I'm gumby, although I can no longer touch my neck with my nose.

Iride01 

Hybrids still have pretty much the same seat tube angle that road bikes have. So the only benefit they might give is a higher frame stack. Nothing there that will change your position over the BB and lighten the load your hands bear.

But you can also find road bikes with higher frame stacks too. And the bikes I suggested will give you that same fit as a hybrid, but still give you the drop bars for multiple hand positions. All of which won't relieve your numb hands if the fit isn't correct or the hoods positioned correctly for you.

So in the short term looking for solutions, you might just change the angle of your STI's as other have suggested. And even their angle pointing in or out. While some like them toed in you might need to see if having them pointed just a tad outward works better for you.

metropical

by changing the the angle of the STI/hoods, we mean moving them closer to the cockpit on the flat part of the bar, not away from me to the curved part of the bar?
They are currently toed pretty parallel to the bar.

genejockey 

Gumby?


There are a couple basic things I aim for when setting up a bike. First, the pitch of the saddle should be neutral, in the sense of neither throwing me at the bars, nor having to reach out for them. Second, I should be able to lift my hands off the hoods, while riding along at 15-20 mph on a smooth, straight road, without falling forward. Third, I shouldn't feel either flat-footed (saddle too low) or like I'm reaching out with my toes for the pedals. I should be able to spin at 105 rpm easily.

That's all saddle position, and I generally set that up to match my other bikes.

Next, the bar. First, when I get on and start rolling, my hands should fall naturally onto the hoods, with a couple fingers wrapped around the brake lever. Second, I should be able to ride for a couple miles in the drops, pedaling at a normal cadence, without any back pain. While in the drops, I should be able to easily access the brake levers without having to contort my wrists.

With that fit, I've gone 100 miles with nothing going numb, and no pain apart from tired muscles. Oh, yeah - and I went through 4 saddles before I found one that really worked for me. Then they stopped making them!

metropical

Gumby


I'd say the saddle is correctly set by those standards, though I'm not convinced this is the best saddle ...yet.
But the stem needs to change.