Get.Schwifty

1996 Bianchi Veloce Placeholder (swear I'll post a photo just as soon as the site lets me )

OK, I bought this beast about 25 years ago, and it's still serving well, at least in the flats or minor hills. Long past are the days where I'd push it up canyons or anything switchbacked or with a grade posted.

Now it has a pair of SPDs and a Brooks saddle, and a new 13-26 cassette (best climbing 8-speed available anymore) on the way.

I'll grind away in the big ring in my no-terrain town, but I've got a big tour or two coming up with real climbs, and I want to dump these 175mm cranks for some 165/70, maybe cut down those chainrings from their (53/39 maybe? I'll have to go look) big teeth number down to manageable 40s and 30s, even if it means only changing the inner ring to gain a climbing gear.


'97 Bianchi Veloce


Trying to keep cost low -- no sense in overhauling an acient bike to run 10-speed, as obviously I'm limited by this 8-speed Veloce group. The aim: slap a shorter crankset with fewer teeth on it (can that even be done for less than $200?), or otherwise bolt a granny ring on the inside rather than the 39 (or whatever) so I can keep cadence up and stay in the saddle on climbs. Any suggestions here from the Campagnolo experts?

wrk101

Your existing crankset likely will not allow for a granny ring. Head to a bike shop and ask them how small of chain rings you can install on your crankset. My guess your current crankset cannot accommodate a much smaller ring and certainly not a granny ring.

Bike shops can look at your bike in person, make informed decisions, and provide help to do the work. They have a huge advantage over anyone on the internet.

Cheapest route? Find a used bike with the gearing you prefer. I routinely see nice used touring bikes out there at reasonable prices.

Maximum flexibility for all terrain = triple crankset, which will mean new crankset, new bottom bracket, new rear derailleur, and more.... a long list of stuff typically way in excess of your budget. A compact crankset does not provide maximum flexibility but reduces the scope and cost of the project significantly (will not fit within your budget either).

Buying parts on the internet is best suited for someone who knows exactly what they want. A local bike shop will cost more, but they take out the hassle of making mistakes, buying the wrong stuff, and so on. Depending on where you live and local bike shop labor rates, the labor alone will exceed your budget.

As far as ancient bikes go, my newest bike is 1992, my oldest is 1973, with a lot of stuff inbetween. My main rider is a 1987, but it has upgraded drivetrain.

Get.Schwifty

Suspecting you're right --- I see no interior chainrings any smaller than that out there, with almost all Miche sets matching the 53/39 original set. Rolling the dice on this replacement cassette -- maybe this plus a new chain will give me a ride capable of some climbing (my love of a granny ring, and/or a large maximum cog really comes from attacking fairly extreme hills or hauling a bunch of panniers and a heavily-loaded bike up rolling country highways.

Oof, the more I look at this though... 40 gear inches (1.5 minimum gear ratio) it might be suicide to take this thing on a weeklong ride.

cat0020

Square taper B/B?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/185340600023


Hollowtech II B/B
https://www.ebay.com/itm/265595892602

Get.Schwifty

Both look cool. Virtually no way of knowing if either of those BB tapers would work with an unknown 1996 BB. I would love either. I'll have to try to positively ID that BB.

SpedFast

Shorter crank arms will defeat what you're trying to attain. A longer crank (175) means you're getting more leverage on the chain ring. Good luck

cat0020

Take a picture of your crank and B/B connection, I can usually tell by looking.
or
If you have the brand/model of the existing crank, that would help determine the B/B, too.

About leverage & crankarm length..
As a reference, I used to use 175mm crankarms when I was racing 20+ years ago, trying to be fast on the bike, not riding long distance or pleasure.
Nowadays, I ride for pleasure.. for company.. for entertainment at destination, not to exert myself to the limits, I ride 170 or 165mm cranks and spin at 85-90 rpm cadence most of the time.
I find myself riding further, getting off the bike with less pain with shorter crankarms.

Get.Schwifty

Narrowed this guy down to a pretty damn sure it's a 1997 Bianchi Veloce, brakes/shifters/derailleurs, cogs and wheels all stock so
Campagnolo Veloce cranks, 172.5mm
68mm shell, English
Camp Veloce BB, 1.370 x 24 tpi, assuming 111mm
(Assuming the 115mm variant would be for triple chainrings)
Making it a ISO square taper, or Campagnolo/Miche compatible only I'd assume.
I'd post pictures but these cranks are good and on and I might <?> have a crank extractor.

This is as close to a picture as I can post on the site (I can't post photos or links since I'm a noob)
dubdubdub.ebay.com/itm/154825681349

cat0020

That's just a square taper B/B..

Vintage Schwinn

A few questions here:

Why not go "backwards" to an ancient 7 speed if you cannot obtain anything with better gearing than 13 - 26 in 8 speed?

The 26 teeth low gear cog is KILLING YOU!

Sheesh, when you boil it on down, you'd be better off with an alloy rear wheel set up from about forty five to fifty years ago if it simply had a five speed freewheel with 14 - 32 or a five speed freewheel with 14 - 34.
Certainly that would be going way too far backwards, but it would in fact give you superior rideability in situations where you have hills!
At the end of the day having one or two more gears to choose among is practically useless IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE GEARING WHERE IT DOES YOU GOOD!

Simple Math calculation of GEAR number:
39 front
26 rear
39 divided by 26 = 1.5
1.5 times 27 = 40.5
(27) was chosen as wheel diameter in INCHES because 700C =622mm and 27" = 630mm .......
so your calculated GEAR number of 40.5 , rounds to a GEAR number of 41
so the your lowest available gear = 41 GEAR

heck,all Schwinn five speeds from 1970 on had better lowest GEAR number than that, as the '70 on COLLEGIATE had 37 GEAR ---and-- SUBURBAN 5sp had 39 GEAR, and the 10speed SUB/VARSITY/CONT had 38 GEAR

Just to recap, so anyone seeing this will understand just how simple it is to calculate GEAR number;
Number of teeth on FRONT CHAINWHEEL DIVIDED BY Number of teeth on REAR COG = "result"
Take that "result" and MULTIPLY IT BY 27 = GEAR Number

(you use 27 as the multiplier for all 27" or 700C wheeled bikes, but you'll use 26 as the multiplier Instead of your bike has 597mm, 590mm, 584mm, 571mm, or 559mm wheels.)


You have a nice bicycle, that happens to have 53/39 up front and 13 - 26 in back. THE 53 and 13 will really give you some Go if you can turn it.... as that combination gives you 110 GEAR...................................so the GEAR range on your bike is from 41 GEAR to 110 GEAR.........................That gives you an impressive top-end possibility but the fact that your 8-speed cassette essentially wastes those eight gears by not providing different step progressions on at least the first two lowest of the eight..........................................it is always a trade-off.............................here you have a nice bike, where the 8 speed cassette has narrower step progressions within a narrower range than most all 5 speed freewheels, 6 speed freewheels, 7 speed freewheels, and 7 speed cassettes since 1969. Yes cassettes didn't come in until the 1980's but it goes to show that your bike was purposely designed to have closely spaced eight gears that assist in maintaining average mph speedpace once you're cruising at say 14 to 15 mph or more. You get killed however if you cannot pedal power it out using existing speed and momentum to get to the start of the hill with speed and then gear down as needed to get up it until you get to the lowest gear of 41 and YOU AIN'T GOT ENOUGH FOR YOU TO GET UP THE TOUGH HILLS!
Thats the trade-off, for YOU, you'd benefit greatly if you had different gear progression spacing that would give you a 32 teeth rear cog or a 34 teeth rear cog.
Heck, there are eight frikken gears, a bicycle could do just fine if you had just 3 high end gears.............its always a trade off however you divide it up, but heck, with seven or eight total gears, there is more than enough to give you the top-end that you have and not lose anything in speed acceleration, and have a really useful hill climbing for those hills that are those "oh no, not this again climbs".

I'd recommend selling your bike and purchasing another bike IF YOU CANNOT SIGNIFICANTLY IMPROVE THE BIKE'S HILL CLIMBING(low gearing).
There are just two ways to improve LOW GEARING: LARGER REAR COG(more teeth) with no change to front chainwheel ---OR---- smaller Front Chainwheel with no change to your existing rear cassette cog.
Well you could improve low gearing by significantly reducing the size of the bike's wheels but this isn't a practical solution. ---that would also limit top-end potential--
You could also add a gasoline engine or electric motor to assist you but as you know this is not a realistic solution!.

Are you certain that there aren't any USED 8 speed CASSETTES or USED 7 speed CASSETTES that can be found with the first gear cog having much more teeth than just 26 teeth??

Are you certain that there aren't any other practical solutions to swap and substitute another front chainwheel(s) crank configuration. It isn't rocket science. Sure, you'd have to change the front derailleur if you made significant changes at the front, and you'd have to change the rear derailleur if you go big at the rear cog on the cassette.
You might need to slightly alter the overall chain length by maybe a couple of links. It seems there are other similar bikes which offer the low hill gears that you need.
Why can't you make your nice higher level bicycle and make it slightly less sporting, making it more like a common person's bike, with better, useable low gearing?
Why would doing that make your bicycle any less of a bicycle by doing that, as you'd still have ample top-end capability and the ride quality, steering and braking, and overall comfort would not be changed in any way?
I do get that going downlevel to achieve this would likely impact the perceived prestige and perhaps the market value of said bicycle, but if doing so would solve your hill climbing issues, and it can practically be done, then why the heck not? Otherwise, just don't think twice and sell-it and then buy a bike that will have the necessary gears to work for you. I do urge you to calculate and compare GEAR number gearing between the various bicycles that you may be considering, This simple math computation is so simple, but folks get caught up in the excitement and hoopla of bike shopping and buying a bike that they sometimes don't realize the importance of having hill climbing capabilities until they are out riding the new bike and come to the realization of " oh, this bike isn't so great on hills".

shelbyfv

Yep, been there....

philbob57

A triple with a 24-28 granny gear will get you down to about a 1:1 ratio, which is a true low gear. If your crankset is Campy, you probably need a BB axle that uses the ISO, not JIS, taper.

Crank length is tricky. In theory, a 165 has less leverage than a 170, so that means using more power to get it around, but the circumference of the circle is smaller, so you don't have to move your leg or knee as far, which reduces stress. A longer arm (172.5, 175, etc.) gives more leverage at the expense of a longer circumference. That's theory; I don't know what actual results you'd experience.

You should be able to fit a 10 speed cassette on your wheel and fit the wheel on the bike, but I doubt you can include brake levers/shifters and cassette for $200. You could do it if you used DT shifters in friction mode, though.

DMC707 

8 speed Campy is just 8 speed . The later 9 speed cassette bodies would accept 9 , 10, maybe even 11

However, if he has Veloce brifters, Campagnolo brifters of that era were triple compatible --- so i'd say he just needs a new BB and a triple crankset - and maybe a FDR -- probably get all that for around $100 if sticking with Veloce/ Mirage level stuff

oops -- edited to add he needs a rear derailleur too most likely --- stretch that total to $200

DMC707 

Find a Veloce or Mirage triple crankset, bottom bracket and front derailleur - would need the long cage rear also ( Campagnolo also made a groupset called the Racing T but Racing T parts might be a wallet shocker - or maybe not


Perhaps not the most demonstrative photo OP, but this rig is wearing Veloce triple components - note the itty bitty 3rd chainwheel on there and the long rear derailleuer

DMC707 

Happy hunting !


CAMPAGNOLO RACING T CRANKSET TRIPLE 170 MM 50-40-30T w/Bolts | eBay

Campagnolo veloce group 3 x 8 speed crankset triple 52/42/30 | eBay

Vintage 1990's Campagnolo Veloce triple / long cage front rear mech derailleur | eBay

Campagnolo Mirage T - Triple - Braze-On Front Derailleur - Bottom Pull | eBay

Campagnolo Mirage 170mm Triple Front Full Crankset and Original Crankbolts | eBay

NEW NOS Campagnolo SC-S Square Taper Bottom Bracket 115.5 mm ISO Italian Triple 702921446379 | eBay

New-Old-Stock Daytona/Centaur Bottom Bracket - English Threads (68 x 115.5 mm) | eBay

cat0020

These brand new 165mm cranks with 50/34 chainrings would likely fit your current B/B, under $90 with new B/B (might not fit your frame):

https://www.ebay.com/itm/284664853804

Get.Schwifty

After thorough searching, this would be as close as I could get to a comfortable hill climber. If a triple crankset would bolt straight on, I'd honestly be all about it. But the BB gives me pause (cost, effort, risk/reward).

My 26t cassette arrived in the mail and fit my freewheel perfectly (it was a gamble). You'd think there'd be a 28t Miche cog (or a knockoff) somewhere for a few bucks. There's some Swiss firm that does old-school sprockets for Campagnolo, but guess what old-school is to them? 9-10s (and Camp's esoteric weirdness means the spline pattern is all different).

I'm at peace with 13-26 rear and 39-53 front. I'll roll a gravel bike with a 1:1 setup if I start to doubt my commitment. For old man Bianchi though, I'm gonna try to tough it out.

Get.Schwifty

1997 Bianchi Veloce
Finally I'm past novice and I can post a picture. It currently has some 737 SPD knockoffs, a Brooks saddle. If I can find a nice lugged crowned fork I'mma get it, especially if it's chromed. If it's off-color I'll have to decide whether to try to match with the Celeste or just go Pantani yellow.

DMC707 

Youre over 25 years on the stock Veloce cartridge bottom bracket -- im sure its pretty tired unless you are an extremely low annual mileage rider . the only real question is whether the bottom bracket shell is English or italian -- youd think with a Bianchi the answer would be obvious, but its not always so - however, there are quite a few Bianchi-files over in the C&V section who would likely know

Im currently watching a Veloce square taper compact 50/34 crankset on the bay right now myself (they made them for a couple of years ) -- Im likely not going to bid on it,but that would give you some real relief too

Campagnolo Veloce 10SPD COMPACT Square Taper Crank 34/50 Vintage Campy 653 Grams | eBay

Russ Roth

This is the way for you to go and the best, easy advice so far. Most Campy cranks are 135 bolt pattern, yours included, which means the 39t on there is the smallest it can go, there's no help for it. If the BB is still good, this will bolt right on, you'll have to drop the front der to fit it and retighten the cable, take a link from the chain, and you should be good to go. Planet cyclery has you BB in stock for 32.00 if you need a replacement.

Get.Schwifty

Because the *vast* majority of my mileage is traditionally on other bikes, I am a pretty low annual mileage rider on this one.

Compact crank looks nice. Wish Miche had a reproduction.

Get.Schwifty

I donno if this is an anomaly for '97 but the der is brazed (because of course nothing's easy) so I can imagine the frame was designed for the trad'l 53/39.

Tempting though.

DMC707 

There is a lbit of adjustability as the deraileuer hanger is slotted. My DeRosa - which originally would have had a 52/42 crankset - worked fine with a 50/34

Russ Roth

DMC has it, the braze-on usually allows a range of adjustment as 52, 54 and even 55t chainrings are not unheard of. I'd suspect 50t is within tolerance, just note where its bolted in place, remove the bolt and see how far it can drop. 53 to 50 isn't a big drop, so it won't need to move much.

Get.Schwifty

Welp! Got a new Miche cassette (with a couple more teeth) from BikeInn, a new chain from Jenson.
Worked out.
That Bianchi will be on Ragbrai duty only from here on.
I'll trust it to get me through a tour of a rolling hills, but day-to-day I was starting to worry about its longevity.