Ask your small, random, track-related questions here
#5251
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Just a quick observation/question after watching some of the World Cup over the weekend.
In both the Women's and Men's team sprint, teams failed because Rider 1 skidded the rear tire coming out of the starting gate and couldn't recover (see Day 1 at about the 40-minute mark on the UCI's video post). It seemed the reason was simple - the back tire lost traction. But why? Is it that these riders are leaning too far forward on the front tire, trying to get more power, or is it at the starting gate (i.e., trying to go a fraction of a second before the gate releases)? Or is it the wooden track, maybe an less-familiar surface than one's home track? It seems this is happening a lot more, and it's got to be disappointing to train that hard for that long and lose because the tire slips.
In both the Women's and Men's team sprint, teams failed because Rider 1 skidded the rear tire coming out of the starting gate and couldn't recover (see Day 1 at about the 40-minute mark on the UCI's video post). It seemed the reason was simple - the back tire lost traction. But why? Is it that these riders are leaning too far forward on the front tire, trying to get more power, or is it at the starting gate (i.e., trying to go a fraction of a second before the gate releases)? Or is it the wooden track, maybe an less-familiar surface than one's home track? It seems this is happening a lot more, and it's got to be disappointing to train that hard for that long and lose because the tire slips.
#5252
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i honestly thought there would be bigger gear variance between the track styles but this at least means there’s one less variable to worry about come race day.
#5253
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thats really interesting - I will focus more on technique between the tracks rather than worrying about gearing so much then.
i honestly thought there would be bigger gear variance between the track styles but this at least means there’s one less variable to worry about come race day.
To estimate your Flying 200m time, double the 100m split time and add 0.1”. That should get you close and save your legs for more tests.
EDIT:
I'm not sure how much experience you have on the tracks that you intend to race on. But, I think your windup strategies (e.g. when to accelerate, when to relax, when to jump out of the saddle, where to start the dive, etc...) will have more of an effect on your time than a few gear inches up or down. For example, at DLV, adjusting your "jump" point several meters forwards or back will greatly affect your time. That jump point also depends on what gear you have on. It's all sort of mingled together.
Last edited by carleton; 10-22-18 at 10:03 AM.
#5254
Lapped 3x
thats really interesting - I will focus more on technique between the tracks rather than worrying about gearing so much then.
i honestly thought there would be bigger gear variance between the track styles but this at least means there’s one less variable to worry about come race day.
I've ridden 200m tracks that were both round and cigar shaped, these being Rochester Hills and the old Bromont Velodromes.
The old Bromont Velodrome was a 166m track that was already slightly oblong because it was constructed as a temporary velodrome that went into a hockey arena. It then got each straight lengthened by 17m to make for a 200m track when it found its permanent home in Bromont. Riding this track was not for the faint of heart (54*banks) and was really like shooting into the corkscrew of a rollercoaster after coming in on that "long-ish" straight. As a 16yo I was pulling roughly 2.5G in the banks and the amount of compression really made it hard to pedal compared to other tracks. Rochester Hills was the opposite, and rode much like a 250, as the track was rounder with shorter straights and gentler banks, making it super easy to carry your speed through the turns.
As an aside, besides gearing, the tactics for racing on these two tracks (despite being the same length) were quite different. A shallower banking puts a passing rider further to the outside than a steeper banking does, as a stepper banking "stacks" the riders more. A shallower track makes it much more important to make the most of a passing attempt on the straight. A steeper track with long straights offers quite an advantage for the passing rider as theet is less distance penalty, yet you really shoot out and down the track as you come out of the turn. The right and long tracks make for more exciting racing to watch in my opinion.
#5255
Senior Member
Just a quick observation/question after watching some of the World Cup over the weekend.
In both the Women's and Men's team sprint, teams failed because Rider 1 skidded the rear tire coming out of the starting gate and couldn't recover (see Day 1 at about the 40-minute mark on the UCI's video post). It seemed the reason was simple - the back tire lost traction. But why? Is it that these riders are leaning too far forward on the front tire, trying to get more power, or is it at the starting gate (i.e., trying to go a fraction of a second before the gate releases)? Or is it the wooden track, maybe an less-familiar surface than one's home track? It seems this is happening a lot more, and it's got to be disappointing to train that hard for that long and lose because the tire slips.
In both the Women's and Men's team sprint, teams failed because Rider 1 skidded the rear tire coming out of the starting gate and couldn't recover (see Day 1 at about the 40-minute mark on the UCI's video post). It seemed the reason was simple - the back tire lost traction. But why? Is it that these riders are leaning too far forward on the front tire, trying to get more power, or is it at the starting gate (i.e., trying to go a fraction of a second before the gate releases)? Or is it the wooden track, maybe an less-familiar surface than one's home track? It seems this is happening a lot more, and it's got to be disappointing to train that hard for that long and lose because the tire slips.
#5256
Lapped 3x
If you keep your butt over the seat yoully see this go away. Watch videos of kilo starts. Everyone is straight arming and keeping their butts back over the saddle.
Last edited by taras0000; 10-23-18 at 10:09 AM.
#5257
Senior Member
#5258
Lapped 3x
Its not to say that you can't move forward to get more leverage over the pedals, but you have to keep your hips/center of gravity behind the front wheel. If you feel the seat brush the back of your thighs asayou pedal, then your in a good spot to start from.
Think "monkey humping a tennis ball" as Ryan Bailey once put it, with the tennis ball being the back of your stem.
Think "monkey humping a tennis ball" as Ryan Bailey once put it, with the tennis ball being the back of your stem.
Last edited by taras0000; 10-23-18 at 10:11 AM.
#5259
Senior Member
Anybody know what type of bearings are in a Mavic iO? I found this info before, but now I can't seem to dig it up, all I find is the magic bearing kit online. Thanks
#5262
Lapped 3x
No prob! Any 6001 bearing will fit, but you will want seals/shields too. A straight 6001 bearing will have open races. You'll need the suffix designation as well. "RS" means rubber seal on one side. "2RS" is robber seal on both sides. "Z" designates a metal shield or "seal". "ZZ" or "2Z" is shielded on both sides.
Rubber provides a better seal, but metal shields offer way lower rolling resistance. I'd opt for 6001 ZZ/6001 2Z. They are the same bearing
You could go for 6001Z (single shield/one side only) for even lower resistance, facing the open sides inwards, but you would have to service your bearings frequently, and that's not so bueno for cartridge bearings.
Rubber provides a better seal, but metal shields offer way lower rolling resistance. I'd opt for 6001 ZZ/6001 2Z. They are the same bearing
You could go for 6001Z (single shield/one side only) for even lower resistance, facing the open sides inwards, but you would have to service your bearings frequently, and that's not so bueno for cartridge bearings.
#5263
Senior Member
^ If it's a primarily indoor (or race only outdoor so long as it's a track and not road or exposed to the elements) you can get by with no seals fairly safely. Just check every once in a while.
I did that on my road TT wheels for years running low fill grease. (although I did some extra precautions if the weather sucked)
It doesn't save you much admittedly
I did that on my road TT wheels for years running low fill grease. (although I did some extra precautions if the weather sucked)
It doesn't save you much admittedly
#5264
Senior Member
6001. You can double check it if you have the wheel available. Mavic part #M40318 . 12mm ID, 28mm OD, 8mm deep = 6001 bearing.
Also, for Mavic newbies (like me...) the axle is a slight interference fit, and needs to be lightly tapped out (screwdriver handle works). But be careful, the axle is aluminum and has EXTREMELY fine threads that look super easy to damage! So take care when removing/installing.
#5266
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Do any of you know whether you can reuse pins To relink a K710SL chain?
i have accidentally split the chain too short ( maths cock up trying to do it in a rush and not double checking).
They are almost £30 per chain here in the UK so I’m keen to save it if I can.
KMC website Doesn’t list any spares other than missing links.
im guessing the answer is no but thought I would ask the community anyway just incase! *fingers crossed*
i have accidentally split the chain too short ( maths cock up trying to do it in a rush and not double checking).
They are almost £30 per chain here in the UK so I’m keen to save it if I can.
KMC website Doesn’t list any spares other than missing links.
im guessing the answer is no but thought I would ask the community anyway just incase! *fingers crossed*
#5267
Lapped 3x
Hey Taras, just FYI (and to other iO owners), it looks like the bearings are actually 61901, 24x12x6mm. The one's in this wheel are NMB r2412zz (though only one metal shield is fitted) which I cross referenced to the SKF number.
Also, for Mavic newbies (like me...) the axle is a slight interference fit, and needs to be lightly tapped out (screwdriver handle works). But be careful, the axle is aluminum and has EXTREMELY fine threads that look super easy to damage! So take care when removing/installing.
Also, for Mavic newbies (like me...) the axle is a slight interference fit, and needs to be lightly tapped out (screwdriver handle works). But be careful, the axle is aluminum and has EXTREMELY fine threads that look super easy to damage! So take care when removing/installing.
Edit: Just saying, those iO bearings are a REALLY obscure size. Although not unobtainable, they definitely are a special order bearing. Mavic really makes it a hassle to order a $10 part just because it's an iO.
Little trick: When installing new bearings, face these markings outwards under any dustcaps. This way you don't have to remove the actual bearing to find out what your replacement is should you need one.
Last edited by taras0000; 10-28-18 at 11:25 AM.
#5268
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Do any of you know whether you can reuse pins To relink a K710SL chain?
i have accidentally split the chain too short ( maths cock up trying to do it in a rush and not double checking).
They are almost £30 per chain here in the UK so I’m keen to save it if I can.
KMC website Doesn’t list any spares other than missing links.
im guessing the answer is no but thought I would ask the community anyway just incase! *fingers crossed*
i have accidentally split the chain too short ( maths cock up trying to do it in a rush and not double checking).
They are almost £30 per chain here in the UK so I’m keen to save it if I can.
KMC website Doesn’t list any spares other than missing links.
im guessing the answer is no but thought I would ask the community anyway just incase! *fingers crossed*
I've done it, and been doing it. It hasn't been a problem so far.
It's not a great idea to do it too often, but once or twice isn't really a problem. (Replacement pins can be purchased for $5-$6.)
#5269
Lapped 3x
Just throwing this one out there after some more investigating, the Comete Bearings are part #M40129 and are a 61902 bearing (15mmID x 28mmOD x 7mm width).
https://www.pelotony.com/cs/18-mavic...40129-mnoz-uni
https://www.pelotony.com/cs/18-mavic...40129-mnoz-uni
Last edited by taras0000; 10-28-18 at 11:37 AM.
#5270
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Bullet Pin HL710/KK710<br>(1 set/polybag) for BMX, Fixie & Track | KMC Chain
the pins I have pushed out of the chain itself are deformed and without the bullet part I have no idea how you would get it back in.
#5271
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Do any of you know whether you can reuse pins To relink a K710SL chain?
i have accidentally split the chain too short ( maths cock up trying to do it in a rush and not double checking).
They are almost £30 per chain here in the UK so I’m keen to save it if I can.
KMC website Doesn’t list any spares other than missing links.
im guessing the answer is no but thought I would ask the community anyway just incase! *fingers crossed*
i have accidentally split the chain too short ( maths cock up trying to do it in a rush and not double checking).
They are almost £30 per chain here in the UK so I’m keen to save it if I can.
KMC website Doesn’t list any spares other than missing links.
im guessing the answer is no but thought I would ask the community anyway just incase! *fingers crossed*
#5274
Senior Member
By light but not slick do you mean not the indoor tyres like Vittoria pista speed? But rather something with more rubber and maybe even some puncture protection?
#5275
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I bought Vittoria Pista G+ clinchers for my training wheels and Vittoria Corsa Speed G+ tubulars for my race wheels from probikekit.com. I race outdoors on a concrete track.