John N

I am trying to confirm some information. I am considering a Santos Travel Master 3+ Pinion & Belt for my next bike. I am 5'10" and have a 32.5" inseam. Using 700cx35mm tires on both, my recently stolen Co-Motion Americano (56cm) has, according to Co-Motion's website, a standover height of 790mm which was fine or maybe even a smidgen too tall as my legs are not as limber swinging over the top tube as compared to when I was 40 years younger. When I look at the Santos website for the Travel Master Pinion, it shows a standover height of 820mm (over 3cm higher on a 3cm smaller frame compared to the Americano) on the 53cm frame which is the next to smallest frame out of 7 stock sizes. I would need the smallest frame they make to get a sub-790mm standover height. Since I feel I am average height in the USA, I was surprised to see such a high standover height on the 2nd smallest frame. I also did a frame comparison over on bikeinsights.com and it confirmed the Santos frame is "large".

I look at pics with riders and either they are all really tall or the bike frames are small as they look more like a MTB frame than a traditional touring frame.

What am I missing? I would not think the website is wrong. Are the Dutch super long-legged or what?

Does anyone happen to have a Santos Travel Master 3 (any version)? If so, what frame size do you have and what inseam do you have?

I like the bike's great flexibility (run dual wheel sets, wide tire clearance, Pinion & derailleur, lots of bosses, etc.) but would hate to order it sight unseen just to discover it is too small.

Thanks in advance, John

GamblerGORD53

I have never seen one. Their list of measurements is almost useless. WTH.
I just don't think any of them will fit you. The HT is long making the frame look cramped. I bought a bungie fork hybrid similar with a high slope frame, a size too big.
Always felt awkward. I tried a swept HB, right way up it was too high and upsidedown too low.
Rohloff14 is way better IMO. Their frame for this won't fit either. And yes, Dutch are the second tallest now.

John N

Thanks for the input. The head tube on the Santos is actually 10mm shorter than the Co-Motion. See BikeInsights.com for a comparison. Also, I have had 3 Rohloff hubs so I am familiar with the hubs. Alee Denham (Cycling About) has done studies on various gearboxes. Plus he has significant touring experience. Here is a comparison between the two systems: https://www.cyclingabout.com/best-bi...inion-gearbox/ . For me, the benefits of the Pinion outweigh the benefits of the Rohloff. I am not putting Rohloff down.

However, this thread is not about Pinion vs. Rohloff vs. other stuff. I am primarily concerned about the standover height and why it doesn't seem to match up. Tailwinds, John

Tourist in MSN

I have only seen two Santos Travel Masters. That was eight years ago, my conversation with the owners was short, it was a young couple from Europe in the campsite next to ours at Bryce. All I remember was one was derailleur and one Rohloff. Sorry can't help on the two that I have seen.

When you get it, we need photos and a review.

John N

Another request. If someone has an 56cm Americano, can they measure the standover height midway between the nose of the saddle and the headtube. Maybe the standover height on the Americano at that position is higher. According to Co-Motion's website, it is 79cm (31.1") which sounds about right.