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Putting early 90s MTB back on the street

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Putting early 90s MTB back on the street

Old 07-05-21, 01:25 PM
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Xwang
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Putting early 90s MTB back on the street

Hello everybody, I am a 45 year old "boy" and I live in a coastal town near Rome.
I'm putting my early 90's Bianchi MTB back on the road.
The bike has spent the last 25 years in my garage and has very few kilometers.
I will use it as a city bike to go to the beach (which is about 12 km from my house) and to get some exercise because I'm a bit overweight.
I would like your advice to complete the restoration in an economical way.
I hope to be able to post pictures of the bike soon, in the meantime I hope you can help me with the problems I am currently facing.
The most important is braking.
The bike has front and rear cantilever brakes with the original plastic handlebar levers and cables.
I changed the brake pads to cheap Chinese ones, but the braking power is still very poor (at least for my 107kg weight).
When I sit in the saddle I can move the bike even if I touch the ground only with my toes and despite pulling both brake levers. This happens because in such a situation the brakes are unable to prevent the wheels from turning.
So I wonder if it is better to upgrade to v-brakes using a cheap unbranded kit with new levers, cables, brakes and pads or if I can obtain better results with Shimano pads mounted on my cantilvers.
The v-brake kit costs 21€. Shimano's front and rear pad cost 10€.
The fact is that I'm not sure I will solve the issue with any of the solutions.
Consider that here in Italy is difficult to find cheap components for cantilever brakes and I'm pretty sure that I need to change the plastic made handlebar brake levers.
The v-brake kits is sold by Amazon so in case it doesn't work correctly I should be able to obtain a refund.
What do you suggest me to do?
The second issue is that maybe my bike is a bit small for me.
I am 1.84 meters tall and the height at the crotch is 83 cm.
So I put the saddle to 72 cm, but the handlebar is too low and I put a lot of load on my arms.
So I'm trying to figure how to raise the handlebar and I'm thinking to convert it to an urban bike with a more erect position.
Is it possible or should I consider other things?

Last edited by Xwang; 07-06-21 at 01:57 PM.
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Old 07-05-21, 03:53 PM
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I'm a junior member and have lots to learn, so won't give an opinion about brakes.
Plastic brake levers, was the bicycle a higher end model when you bought it 25 years ago?
If the bicycle is too small, you are 6ft. tall, which is usually large size.

It's difficult to work on a bicycle without a repair stand, and some special tools will be needed.
Restoration is more than fresh grease and a tune up.
The bicycle was stored in the garage, so I'm guessing not much rust and corrosion.

If the bicycle didn't cost very much when it was new, and it's too small, then spending the money to restore it might not be cost effective.
Bianchi made fine bicycles, it would depend on the model and frame size of your bicycle.
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Old 07-05-21, 04:07 PM
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I'd focus more on the brakes themselves. I had a probably mid-90's Finnish city bike for a while that had front cantilever brakes. The brakes and levers were plastic! Maybe not ironically, they were Italian (Saccon or something like that).

I tried replacing them with a no-name V-brake and lever of more robust construction. The noise they made was unbearable no matter what I did, including changing in expensive supposedly silent pads. They were cheap, but I bought them as a pair, which turned out to be a false economy as I needed only the fronts.

Ultimately I bought a set of Shimano Acera level V-brakes and levers and had a good experience with them. Acera has a pretty good performance-to-price level for utility/city bikes, in my opinion.
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Old 07-05-21, 04:51 PM
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First figure out if the bike is the right size for your height. If not, move it on and find another.

For the brakes, koolstop pads is one of the goto for cantilever. Cheap pads will not stop well as you are experiencing. Need to know what type of components on your bike to give an opinion on whether it's best to change the brakes or not.
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Old 07-06-21, 10:51 AM
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Check out this thread for inspiration; https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...sions-1127647/
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Old 07-06-21, 11:35 AM
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Thanks to all.
Sorry if I wasn't able to replay before but there is a 5 post limit in 24 hours that limits my possibility to replay immediately. I hope it is a limit that is only temporary for newer user. Isn't it?
Anyway the bike has Shimano transmission components with a BD date code so it should be of April 1993.
At that time I was 17 and I had already reached my actual height.
Moreover the same bike was sold to my brother who was (and still is) 10 cms higher than me.
My height at the crotch is 83 cm and so the ideal frame saddle tube should be 48.14 cm (obtained multiplying the height at the crotch by 0.58). The frame saddle tube measures 48.5 cm. So it seems that the frame is correct for me. Do you agree?
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Old 07-06-21, 11:40 AM
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As far as brake components, they are no brand ones and today I've tried to change the brake cable and to optimize the cantilever lever factor, but braking power is still awful.
So I'm really considering the possibility to buy a cheap v-brake set and change the whole braking system.
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Old 07-06-21, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by katsup
First figure out if the bike is the right size for your height. If not, move it on and find another.

For the brakes, koolstop pads is one of the goto for cantilever. Cheap pads will not stop well as you are experiencing. Need to know what type of components on your bike to give an opinion on whether it's best to change the brakes or not.
Hi,
as I've said on my bike there are unbranded cantilever brakes with "plastic" handlebar levers.
Even with a pretty true wheel (about 1mm lateral movement) and with limited space between pads and wheel, almost all lever brake movement is used just to compensate deflections of levers, strand cable and brakes.
They are very poor.
As soon as I will be able to put images, I will do
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Old 07-06-21, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by DiegoFrogs
I'd focus more on the brakes themselves. I had a probably mid-90's Finnish city bike for a while that had front cantilever brakes. The brakes and levers were plastic! Maybe not ironically, they were Italian (Saccon or something like that).

I tried replacing them with a no-name V-brake and lever of more robust construction. The noise they made was unbearable no matter what I did, including changing in expensive supposedly silent pads. They were cheap, but I bought them as a pair, which turned out to be a false economy as I needed only the fronts.

Ultimately I bought a set of Shimano Acera level V-brakes and levers and had a good experience with them. Acera has a pretty good performance-to-price level for utility/city bikes, in my opinion.
I understand, the fact is that Shimano components are not available in Italy and they are more expensive than I want to spend at the moment. I'm trying to spend less than 30€ for a complete set. Then with time and if I continue to use the bike I will update to better quality components.
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Old 07-06-21, 11:44 PM
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I've just found a complete v-brake set for just 13.50€ (including taxes and shipment).
This is the link:
https://www.bikeinn.com/negozio-cicl...ke/138142155/p
It is branded ALHONGA (with the name present on the parts too, which is not always the case with chinese parts).
Do you have any experience with this brand?
Is it a good value for money?

Last edited by Xwang; 07-07-21 at 01:06 PM.
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Old 07-07-21, 06:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Xwang
I've just found a complete v-brake set for just 13.50€ (including taxes and shipment).
It is branded ALHONGA (with the name present on the parts too, which is not always the case with chinese parts).
Do you have any experience with this brand?
Is it a good value for money?
- I'm giving a strong NO vote to the cheap V-brakes. If you spend your good EUROS on cheap brakes, all you end up with is cheap brakes.
- Somebody already mentioned the Salmon-colored KOOL Stop pads. Get those. Watch some Park Tool videos on set up, or read SheldonBrown.com and get the brake set up correct. Canti's properly set up should be fine for beach riding.
- I picked up a $60 Bianchi IMPACT and I'm using it for my single track bike. No - I don't like the floppy plastic levers, but they aren't broke, so not replacing them. (I'll replaced them one ride before they break.... hehehe - hopefully)
- I sprayed my Bianchi - replaced cables / housings / tires / bars / seat - maybe brake pads, can't recall. I'm waiting for the 7-speed rear wheel to poop out so I can up grade to 8-spd.

some before and after....


oops - this is the replaced seat and bars.....


PostScript: I removed the reflectors. Don't do that unless you're foolish. If for some reason the brake-cable breaks, the straddle cable will catch the knobby tire. On the rear, this just brings you to a speed halt. Hopefully.
With the front wheel you're going knee-caps over coffee cups and probably land on your face and need to drink through a straw for a few months. So - keep those reflector thingys in place to catch the straddle cable if the brake cable breaks.
Use me as the bad example that will teach a good lesson.
ciao!

Last edited by mrv; 07-07-21 at 06:21 AM. Reason: ps: SAFETY FIRST! ..... i guess... if i gotta...
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Old 07-07-21, 01:39 PM
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Here we are.
This is the bike with the saddle at the correct height:


Handlebar is already at the maximum height and probably I'm going to change it to transform to an urban bike.


Front unbranded original cantilever still not optimized to maximize mechanical leverage

Rear unbranded original cantilever set to try to maximize mechanical leverage

Shimano original front derailleur command

Rear unbranded original cantilever before optimization

Original Shimano rear derailleur, freewhell and chain


Original unbranded plastic brake command. The Shimano original rear derailleur command is a SL-MY20 which has lost the upper cover.


Original handlebar with commands.


Ofmega Sierra original crankset with broken external plastic finiture. The plastic part is not structural.

Ofmega Sierra original crankset with broken external plastic finiture. The plastic part is not structural.

This is a video of the strange longitudinal movement of the freewheel I've made:
Is it normal?
My brother's bike (which is exactly the same model than mine, which was bought the same day and which has been used exactly like mine) does the same thing.
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Old 07-07-21, 03:19 PM
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The original tires deflated and flatten to the floor, maybe. They probably won't last very long on pavement, and they don't look very dry rotted.
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Old 07-07-21, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Peroni
The original tires deflated and flatten to the floor, maybe. They probably won't last very long on pavement, and they don't look very dry rotted.
If you are speaking about these ones


Original air chambers removed from bike
you are right.
They are the original air chambers of mine and my brother bikes.
One of them is still functional (the one inflated in the background) after 25 years. The other three are not.
The wheel on the right is one of the wheels of an Atala bike which has not been used for 25 years too.
In any case I've changed air chambers and tyres with newer ones (the ones you can see mounted on the bike).

Last edited by Xwang; 07-07-21 at 03:41 PM.
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Old 07-07-21, 05:20 PM
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The video is about the free wheel, and tire is what caught my eye, because it looks out of round. If the freewheel is working then keep using it, they can be expensive to replace.
I don't think this bicycle was very expenisive when it was new, so don't spend too much money on it. If the frame gets a crack in it, for example, or much of anything else thats costly, then it's time to replace the bicycle.
Ride it a little and think about buying a new or better bicycle in a larger size. The seat post isn't extended too far is it?
Don't build it into urban bike, you need more bicycle to begin with, just my opinion.
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Old 07-08-21, 03:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Peroni
The video is about the free wheel, and tire is what caught my eye, because it looks out of round. If the freewheel is working then keep using it, they can be expensive to replace.
I don't think this bicycle was very expenisive when it was new, so don't spend too much money on it. If the frame gets a crack in it, for example, or much of anything else thats costly, then it's time to replace the bicycle.
Ride it a little and think about buying a new or better bicycle in a larger size. The seat post isn't extended too far is it?
Don't build it into urban bike, you need more bicycle to begin with, just my opinion.
After I made the video I removed and reinstalled the tyre. Now it is round.
The freewheel is still working.
The seat post has another 2 or 2.5 inches that can be used to extend it further, but the way it is depicted in the photos it is already set to the correct height for me.
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Old 07-08-21, 07:30 AM
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Perhaps I am late to the discussion, but regarding your braking situation I see nothing wrong with your brake levers in spite of them being plastic - I suspect they will work fine. I think you are on the right track trying to optimize the mechanical advantage and I strongly recommend good quality pads...."upgrading" to low quality V brakes will only serve to make you mad (and they may not bolt on directly). I have a similar setup on my own mid 80s MTB that I use mostly on the street - I found a significant different with correct pads, set up and yoke cable length. I had original purchased NOS replacement brake pads and they were awful; modern pads made a huge difference. I did have to use some shims to get the pads to sit correctly and I found they needed to be set quite close to the rim to minimize the amount of slop in the system.
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Old 07-08-21, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by markk900
Perhaps I am late to the discussion, but regarding your braking situation I see nothing wrong with your brake levers in spite of them being plastic - I suspect they will work fine. I think you are on the right track trying to optimize the mechanical advantage and I strongly recommend good quality pads...."upgrading" to low quality V brakes will only serve to make you mad (and they may not bolt on directly). I have a similar setup on my own mid 80s MTB that I use mostly on the street - I found a significant different with correct pads, set up and yoke cable length. I had original purchased NOS replacement brake pads and they were awful; modern pads made a huge difference. I did have to use some shims to get the pads to sit correctly and I found they needed to be set quite close to the rim to minimize the amount of slop in the system.
You are not late.
I'm still considering what to do with brakes and I appreciate your and others suggestions.
There are some things that puzzle me:
1) when I asked to three different local bike mechanics, all of them told me to put on new v-brakes and levers
2) despite multiple set up made on the rear brake, I do not see any improvement
3) I fear that the plastic handlebar levers will break as the plastic finish of the crankset has already done

The first point does not have a huge weight in my mind because it is possible that they told me so only to gain some money.

The second point is the most important. I thought that if I managed to increase the mechanical advantage, the braking power should have increased, but it is not the case. It seems as the additional force is all lost in the flexing of handlebar levers, straight cable and brake calipers. Moreover the more I increase the mechanical advantage, the more I find difficult to setup the pads to avoid them from rubbing on the wheel at rest and I go out of travel with the lever which touches the handlebar. I'm trying to fix the rear brake because I was taught since when I was a child to first use the rear brake and only in emergency use the front one. The problem is that at the moment the rear brake does not slow down at all and I have to squeeze both brakes with all my force to obtain a weak deceleration. If I manage to somehow solve the issue for the rear brake I'll do the same for the front one.

The third point is important because I would like to avoid to spend money and time to have a cantilever somewhat working to then be obliged to change to a vbrake because I cannot find a lever for the cantliever system.

For those reasons I thought that switching to a vbrake could be a better approach as it seems easier to set up and designed to work with less tension in the cables, but since all of you say the opposite I'm still weighting pros and cons of each one and doing experiments to see if increasing the cantilever angle while keeping a low joke angle will increase the performance of the brake.

My last bike I owned between 2014 and 2018 (which was stolen) was a folding one (decatlhon's bfold 3
) and its unbranded v-brakes worked perfectly.
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Old 07-08-21, 11:35 AM
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Are you actually seeing the brake levers deflect/bend when you squeeze them? I concur with the comments above, that better cables and pads can make a big difference. Is the Kool-stop brand of pad expensive or hard to obtain there? If not, that's where I'd start. Alignment of the pads is also important.
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Old 07-08-21, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by madpogue
Are you actually seeing the brake levers deflect/bend when you squeeze them? I concur with the comments above, that better cables and pads can make a big difference. Is the Kool-stop brand of pad expensive or hard to obtain there? If not, that's where I'd start. Alignment of the pads is also important.
The brake levers deflect a lot when I squeeze them.
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Old 07-08-21, 12:55 PM
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Again, I would try the cheapest solutions first: I think as madpogue mentioned with a lot of lever travel and little braking the cable housing could be compressing a lot; and no reasonable amount of adjustment of the yoke cable is going to compensate for rock hard brake pads. I would start with brake pads (you need good ones anyway), follow that with cable replacement. Both are wear items. But again based on my experience I had a similar situation with my cantilever brakes and it all worked out.

Another thought for a *really* cheap test: take the pads you have and grind off 0.5mm or so with a file - rough them up. If your braking improves even temporarily then new pads should be on the list. Of course they might be so hard all the way through that this makes no difference.

Also for reference: the pad at the top is a brand new one for my cantilever brake: its hard as a rock; the one below is a used pad for a V brake - also very common. When I changed out the top style for the bottom I also saw quite an improvement. I didn't think it would help and wanted to stay with the "original pads" but I am very happy I went with the bottom style - and they are much more available where I am located so that is a bonus too. Only thing is you may need to juggle spacers or add spacers to make things fit perfectly on your own bike.





EDIT: I just noticed you have the post style pads on your brakes - they make the bottom type of pad with the post style as well, and my comment about spacers is irrelevant as you can easily adjust things in and out without spacers.....
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Old 07-08-21, 03:30 PM
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Maybe a bit late into the discussion. I don’t know if someone else has spotted it already, but the angle of the cables for those cantilevers doesn’t look right to me. The straddle line (or whatever it is called) looks way too long. It apoears to me, that when you pull the lever, plastic or not, you pull the cantilevers more upwards than to the center.

i’d start there. Then go for better pads, then perhaps new aluminium levers. Just make sure you get levers for canti brakes, not V-brakes.

cantilever brakes are pretty good when set up properly. (And they look a lot better than any v-brake I have ever seen) I’ve got Old Shimano XTR m900’s on my Parkpre Pro Image, and while I haven’t done much downhill with it, the bike stops when I want it to. And the pads are original from 199x... (they have not seen a lot of miles, no)

Last edited by Berko; 07-08-21 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 07-08-21, 03:42 PM
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The reason bicycle store mechanics tell you to put V-brakes on it is because that's what they can sell you.

There is nothing wrong with cantilevers and I prefer them over any other type of braking system. Currently all 6 of my bicycles have them and I am very happy with the braking on my bikes. Cantilevers work equally as well with MTB configurations, and also with road bike levers. I have both. Repeating what others have said -

Don't buy cheap V-brakes. Cheap anything is no good for your bike or for you. V-brakes generally don't provide as much modulation, and cheap ones especially don't have the feel and control of cantilevers. Lot's of "grab" but not so much control. Hard to feather the brakes. They will feel cheap.

It's all about the pads, and the setup. I've been using the Salmon-colored Koolstop, like others have suggested. I just installed a set of the Velo Orange ones just to try them, and those are at least as good as the Koolstops.

Yes, watch videos and read articles on proper setup. That's the one knock on cantilevers, that it takes more skill (and practice) to set them up right. But once you do, they generally stay that way. I usually tell people that V-brakes were only invented so that Walmart stock boys could get them working.
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Old 07-08-21, 03:50 PM
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[QUOTE=Jeff Neese;22133865]
I usually tell people that V-brakes were only invented so that Walmart stock boys could get them working.
😂
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Old 07-08-21, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Berko
Maybe a bit late into the discussion. I don’t know if someone else has spotted it already, but the angle of the cables for those cantilevers doesn’t look right to me. The straddle line (or whatever it is called) looks way too long. It apoears to me, that when you pull the lever, plastic or not, you pull the cantilevers more upwards than to the center.
....
Right on! I didn't see the picture before but that is absolutely responsible for most of the weak braking.

Xwang - this shows the angles involved. Those straddle cables need to be shortened, a lot. No wonder the brakes aren't strong enough. Fix that, and put some better pads on there and I think you'll be amazed. But start with the straddle cable and shoot for a 90 degree angle of pull. That will help, a lot.

https://bike.bikegremlin.com/1739/ca...ke-adjustment/
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