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Done got old...........

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Done got old...........

Old 07-24-21, 08:07 AM
  #1  
Murray Missile 
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Done got old...........

While replying to the quote below on another thread it hit me that maybe I should start a new thread for this one.........

Originally Posted by thumpism
Yes. I realized I was on the road to recovery when I could start turning down desirable bikes in my size. That happened some years ago. Nowadays I'll drag home something if I think it needs to be saved or if someone here mentions they want it but I'm not doing it to make money. No more 25"/64cm bikes, either. I've got to get real about this shrinking in my old age, so if I find a decent tourer in 60-62cm I'll get it but nothing else appeals to me. Might even be time to sell my tall bikes.
I've also come to the realization that my 25" bikes aren't going to work for me much longer. I recently refurbished a 21" Fuji for someone and on the test rides it hit me that it didn't feel as small as it would have in years past. I've also noticed in recent months I have to think about my dismounts from my 25" bikes where not so long ago it was a smooth automatic process.

Although I have made some impulse buys recently I'm still trying to cull the herd but even with the recent acquisitions I have fewer bikes than this time last year. I've also been leaning more toward smaller frames when I do make a buy however. In the past year I picked up a 23" Raleigh Racing USA Competition, the 23.5" Raleigh Carlton and a 23" 1987 Schwinn Super Sport with some rust issues that was originally purchased for the Shimano 600 Tri Color group for an '86 Super Sport. The Schwinn now may get repainted and rebuilt and the '86 the parts were going on sold as it is a 25". This is probably one of my least favorite Schwinn paint schemes of all time so it won't be a "correct" paint job.



A couple weeks ago I picked up a pair of 1973 or older Gitane Grand Sport Deluxe mixtes, mainly because they were too darn cheap for the condition they were in but also because one was a 23". The 21" is a very dark purple with very good paint but a couple damaged seat tube decals. The 23" has pretty decent paint for a Gitane that vintage and the decals are pretty decent. Mechanically they're both a bit of a hodge podge, I think I have all the pieces to make the purple one all correct Simplex again although I'm not sure I will. I also have plenty of 70's Suntour on hand. The 23" I'm going to build for me with old age in mind, not sure what yet but I'm sure index shifting is in it's future.





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Old 07-24-21, 03:21 PM
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Being quoted in the OP's post has effectively called my bluff, so I will probably be posting ads for the first and last ones listed in my Bikes string under my avatar, looking to trade framesets rather than selling outright.
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Old 07-24-21, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by thumpism
Being quoted in the OP's post has effectively called my bluff, so I will probably be posting ads for the first and last ones listed in my Bikes string under my avatar, looking to trade framesets rather than selling outright.
Uh oh, looks like I started something.........

I have several bikes I really like that are in 25", I had a hard time finding them in 25" but had I found the same bike in the same condition at a similar price in 23" I probably would have grabbed it as I could make a 23 work. I am quite doubtful I would be able to replace them with the same bike or frame in a 23 plus around here 25's are a tough sell. I don't know what will become of some of them when I can't ride them any more, probably get sold for pennies on the dollar and parted out but hopefully I have time to find homes for them. Maybe not being able to find replacements is for the better though, it will force me to get things down to a manageable number.
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Old 07-24-21, 03:59 PM
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Measuring the seat tube center-to-center, only one at 63cm (25").
I should probably move that bike on - for reasons other than size.

There are 2 favorites at 62cm.

Regarding vintage purchases, My range is now 59-61 cm bikes only, and head tubes must be 165mm minimum..

Still 6'1" and a tad @ 70yo.

note: bought my 'forever' bike 15+ years ago with shorter top tube, sloped for lower standover.height. Still ride it with long stem and a lot of seatpost showing.
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Old 07-24-21, 06:34 PM
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Funny, I'm going the other way. My road racing bikes were 59-60 cm and now I like 64-65 cm, a full 2 inches bigger. I used to have the stem slammed too, and now with trad stems (non-Technomic) I have them up near the highest safe position. I used to have a very aero position but now I don't go fast enough to benefit much from aero, even if I could still bend over that much.

What's the reasoning for going to s smaller frame? I thought the shortening from age was mostly in the spine, which doesn't care what your framesize is. The legs don't get much shorter do they? (I'm really asking, I don't know). I'm only 65, so not much height lost yet if at all.

When I get too decrepit to throw a leg over, I might make some sort of mixte or step-through frame, but with a really long head and steerer, to match the bar height of a 65 cm level-TT frame. As a young cyclist, I imprinted on classic stems shaped like a "7" and drop bars, so I want to avoid extreme up-jutting stems or riser bars. Just an aesthetic crotchet of mine. I doubt I'll find anything "off the rack" with that spec, so I'll probably have to make it myself. It'll have lugs, centerpull brakes (or canti), friction shifting etc, so young people will smirk and pity me. But I get a fair bit of that already — I can take it!

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Old 07-24-21, 07:12 PM
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Nice.

I had a 1987 Prelude with Shimano
105 group back in the day.
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Old 07-24-21, 07:29 PM
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-----

...if our bulgie is able to be comfortable on an 85cm my crystal ball predicts there could be a career for him in the NBA...at centre


-----
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Old 07-24-21, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by bulgie
What's the reasoning for going to s smaller frame? I thought the shortening from age was mostly in the spine, which doesn't care what your framesize is. The legs don't get much shorter do they? (I'm really asking, I don't know). I'm only 65, so not much height lost yet if at all.
Well, since you asked.........

I can only speak for myself but I'm almost 66 and I was once 6' 2-1/2", I'm down to 6' 1", maybe. I have a condition called Chondromalacia which basically means the cartilage in my knees is gone plus my lower legs have have always bowed slightly just below the knees and over the past few years the bowing has become quite considerable and I have lost most of my height in my legs. I've gone from a 34" inseam to 32" and I'm probably not far from a double knee replacement as the only time they don't hurt now is when I'm riding a bike. As my condition progressed I had to give up SPD pedals because even the slight twisting to unclip became a concern. My left knee has come "unhinged" a few times when I turned it wrong and trust me that's no fun, the worst part is when it snaps back together. On really bad days I actually have to wear a knee brace to bed to hold it together in case I turn wrong in my sleep. I've switched back to platforms and I even have to use knee saver pedal extensions with some of them depending on the bike and crankset. I also feel more comfortable on a slightly smaller frame now that I'm not as flexible as I once was. I'm putting off the replacements as long as possible for various reasons I won't get into here so in the meantime I adapt and do the best I can until I get the new ones but the replacements won't give me back my lost height or straighten my lower legs so the shift in frame sizes will still be needed.
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Old 07-24-21, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by EricWade
I had a 1987 Prelude with Shimano
105 group back in the day.
I had this '86 Prelude in 23" but sold it, I'd kick myself but I'd just fall down LOL.

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Old 07-24-21, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Wildwood
head tubes must be 165mm minimum...
No wonder you slam your stems.





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Old 07-24-21, 10:07 PM
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For years I rode 23" frames when I was younger, then a bike shop who was more serious about road bikes fitted me to a 25 1/2" frame Raleigh. Since then and for most of my adult life I rode 63-64cm frames As I got older and started to have knee and back issues riding got more and more difficult unless the bike fit me just right.
For what ever reason, one day I took an old Nishiki International 23" frame and did a straight bar conversion with a long seat post and stem. The conversion got me riding more as I got older. I've not lost any overall height but somehow have lost inseam size. I'm still a fraction shy of 6ft 3in tall, but can no longer stand over my old 25.5" Raleigh Pro. Now I notice that even 23" seems like too much to stand over. I struggle to even get on the Raleigh these days and I even sold two vintage 23" frame mountain bikes I had which were just too tall for me now.
As I get older I have pain in my knees, ankles and feet, and lately my elbows and hands when I ride. I find that foam grips help the hands, and making sure I get maximum extension when pedaling. My knees and ankles don't hurt while riding, its when I step off the bike it hits me. I often can barely walk and over the next half hour or so my knees start to really throb. The knees have gotten worse but first bothered me in my 30's but at least then it would subside after a bit of walking but now I'm lucky to make it to somewhere to sit down. I carry a cane for when I have to get off the bike. I quit riding motorcycles for the same reason, I was having trouble coming to a stop and keeping the bike upright at rest. I'd put my foot down and the pain would light me up so bad my knee would buckle. First it was my right knee, now its both, and my ankles.
I picked up an old Peugeot mixte to flip a few months ago but have been riding it myself quite a bit, for some reason the knee issues aren't as bad on that bike, despite it being a good bit heavier and on the small size for me.
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Old 07-24-21, 11:29 PM
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Originally Posted by juvela
-----

...if our bulgie is able to be comfortable on an 85cm my crystal ball predicts there could be a career for him in the NBA...at centre


-----
OK wiseguy, I edited my post to be a little closer to reality, Happy now?
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Old 07-25-21, 06:31 AM
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Originally Posted by oldlugs
For years I rode 23" frames when I was younger, then a bike shop who was more serious about road bikes fitted me to a 25 1/2" frame Raleigh. Since then and for most of my adult life I rode 63-64cm frames As I got older and started to have knee and back issues riding got more and more difficult unless the bike fit me just right.
For what ever reason, one day I took an old Nishiki International 23" frame and did a straight bar conversion with a long seat post and stem. The conversion got me riding more as I got older. I've not lost any overall height but somehow have lost inseam size. I'm still a fraction shy of 6ft 3in tall, but can no longer stand over my old 25.5" Raleigh Pro. Now I notice that even 23" seems like too much to stand over. I struggle to even get on the Raleigh these days and I even sold two vintage 23" frame mountain bikes I had which were just too tall for me now.
As I get older I have pain in my knees, ankles and feet, and lately my elbows and hands when I ride. I find that foam grips help the hands, and making sure I get maximum extension when pedaling. My knees and ankles don't hurt while riding, its when I step off the bike it hits me. I often can barely walk and over the next half hour or so my knees start to really throb. The knees have gotten worse but first bothered me in my 30's but at least then it would subside after a bit of walking but now I'm lucky to make it to somewhere to sit down. I carry a cane for when I have to get off the bike. I quit riding motorcycles for the same reason, I was having trouble coming to a stop and keeping the bike upright at rest. I'd put my foot down and the pain would light me up so bad my knee would buckle. First it was my right knee, now its both, and my ankles.
I picked up an old Peugeot mixte to flip a few months ago but have been riding it myself quite a bit, for some reason the knee issues aren't as bad on that bike, despite it being a good bit heavier and on the small size for me.
I know where you're coming from! I gave up motorcycles because of back and hip pain years ago. I started out on a 23.5" Raleigh Grand Prix when I was 16 and then moved up to a 25" Miyata 310 as I grew another 2 inches, I even had a couple 27's for a brief period. I can still ride my 26" Schwinn Varsity but getting on and off isn't anything too graceful, I foresee it being decommissioned and probably sold VERY cheaply or donated/scrapped by this time next year. I also used to love to take long walks/hikes and by long I mean 10-15 miles average just for the pleasure of it. Those days are long past and I miss it. I acquired a cheap Dahon folding bike last summer mainly to put in the trunk of the car so I can ride it home when I dropped the car off for service. The shop is a half mile from our house and before I'm halfway my knees are killing me. Although it's a single speed I have found it to be a lot of fun to just putz around the neighborhood on. My wife really enjoys it too, in fact she has kind of claimed it as "hers" LOL.



It was so much fun that when a super clean 8 speed Giant Revive pedal forward bike came up for sale CHEAP I picked it up thinking it would be good for the wife as she had expressed a desire for multiple gearing on the folder. I haven't got her to try it yet but I have found getting it set where I'm comfortable with the steering at low speeds is next to impossible, it's very strange to ride. Once you get some speed up it rides smoothly and is very stable but low speed maneuvering is a bit on the spooky side. I suspect once I get her to try it she's not going to like it either and I'll be putting it back on Marketplace, I'll give it a little more time but I'm not optimistic. It's solid, has good components and it's easy to get on and off of but it is heavy and as long as a normal road bike overall making it a PITA to transport and store. You're also stuck with that gawd awful seat and the frame design makes the built in rear rack next to useless except as an attachment point for saddle baskets or panniers. Did I mention it's ugly too? The one saving grace is that I'm in it cheap so I can sell it cheap.


I think I need a matched set of Raleigh 20's....
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Old 07-25-21, 06:53 AM
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LOL, I just bought this as my "grow old bike". Purposely got it as a stepthrough for ease of mounting. I'll tell you what it's pretty nice to just step on this thing and go. Obviously not my workout machine but still I bet I use this in the winters a lot more for longer rides.


For sure not C&V but totally practical for a wide range of riding. Roller brakes, 8 speed IGH, fenders, dynamo hub with lights, huge carrying capacity, etc.
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Old 07-25-21, 07:35 AM
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I’m just curious - Do you folks with bad hips, knees, etc find it easy to step through a mixte? I briefly rode a Mixte around last summer and I found stepping through was awkward and I ended up throwing a leg over like usual.
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Old 07-25-21, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by RustyJames
I’m just curious - Do you folks with bad hips, knees, etc find it easy to step through a mixte? I briefly rode a Mixte around last summer and I found stepping through was awkward and I ended up throwing a leg over like usual.
I'm not quite there yet but a few of times this year I've had to lay my bike down and step over sideways to get off, I can still swing my right leg high enough (for now) to clear the saddle but I don't trust my left knee to support me. I have to step over the down tube with my right foot when the bike is about halfway down to keep my feet closer together and then step over again to clear the top tube once it's all the way down, very awkward to say the least. Pivoting on my left leg has become rather painful and sometimes a bit noisy between the crunching and whimpering LOL so I try to restrict my movements on it to straight lines with no twisting. Even if I had to lay down a mixte rather than just step through it would still be easier as I could keep my feet closer together as the bike went down and only do one step over. I should get the 23" Gitane I bought out and practice with it before I invest much more in it. It might be a good candidate for 650B conversion.

My wife has a bad hip and it has become hard for her to even get on a regular step through frame but the Dahon is no problem as she can step through it no problem or get on from behind the saddle. We were discussing the bike situation this morning and I brought up the idea of getting a pair of Raleigh 20's and she was very receptive to the idea. I had shown her a super nice one in a local antique store a few weeks ago but they had an insane price on it. I may go back and see how serious they were on that price or if they're just fishing. I'd be willing to pay up for that one, it's that nice, but not what they're asking!
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Old 07-25-21, 11:05 AM
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I'm in the "25 inch bikes won't work for me any more" club, but they're too small not too big! Unfortunately, I tend to like frames made of 531c, Super Vitus 971, etc, and those are REALLY hard to find in 26-26.5". )-;

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Old 07-25-21, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Murray Missile
...This is probably one of my least favorite Schwinn paint schemes of all time..
Yup, a swing and a miss on that color selection by Schwinn. The M part of CMYK.
A while back someone was selling NOS Super Sport frames in that color on eBay.
​​​
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Old 07-25-21, 11:34 PM
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Originally Posted by leftthread
Yup, a swing and a miss on that color selection by Schwinn. The M part of CMYK.
A while back someone was selling NOS Super Sport frames in that color on eBay.
​​​
And vintage frames usually look great in pink. Should have been hard to screw up, but they did.
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Old 07-26-21, 04:53 AM
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Originally Posted by polymorphself
And vintage frames usually look great in pink. Should have been hard to screw up, but they did.
Yeah, I love the mid-80's pink and black Team FUJI paint jobs. I wonder how it look in that shade of pink with a black seat tube and graphics?

I'm pretty sure it's getting painted 72 GM Ontario Orange Metallic with black graphics though. BITD I had a '72 Chevelle SS that color with black stripes and interior and always wanted something else that color. What better than another Super Sport?

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Old 07-26-21, 07:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Murray Missile
I'm not quite there yet but a few of times this year I've had to lay my bike down and step over sideways to get off, I can still swing my right leg high enough (for now) to clear the saddle but I don't trust my left knee to support me. I have to step over the down tube with my right foot when the bike is about halfway down to keep my feet closer together and then step over again to clear the top tube once it's all the way down, very awkward to say the least.
Welcome to the club Murray. I call it the "Geezer 2 step", pretty much my standard dismount now after an embarassing, slo-mo fall after I caught my heel dismounting at a local supermarket. Aging out gracefully required some adjustments but so far all my bikes are still rideable, thanks to passing most taller 56/57 cm frames on to my tall #1 son over the years. In past, I could ride them but made me feel like a 12 y.o. on a birthday bike, while they were just tall enough for him with a longer seatpost and stem. Most of my grand kids are in a height range matching my keeper bikes, so many stay in the family as I reduce the herd. Don

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Old 09-30-22, 08:01 AM
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Well, my knee surgeries are behind me now, my legs are straight again and an inch longer and I have been doing some "real" bike riding not just on the trainer. I haven't tried my road bikes yet but I've been on my 2021 Trek Marlin 5 MTB quite a bit and I drug out my old 22" Trek 820 MTB yesterday and it fit me just fine with no adjustments. I bought it new almost 25 years ago to the day so it was kind of like going back in time. I'm slowly getting back to swinging my leg over the saddle to mount, depending on which bike, but the dismounts are still ugly and nerve wracking. Now it's a matter of range of motion, it's slowly coming back but I'm still very nervous making certain motions like swinging my leg back over the saddle to dismount. I also had difficulty getting my foot out of the strap on the PowerGrip pedals on the 820 although I think with a little more practice it would become 2nd nature again. However I noticed my feet were parallel to the bike and centered on the pedal side to side so maybe it's time to dust off my SPD's......... I haven't been able to use them for a few years because of the condition my knees were in but I think I would be able to unclip with no issue now.
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Old 09-30-22, 01:55 PM
  #23  
tgot 
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Originally Posted by Murray Missile
Well, my knee surgeries are behind me now, my legs are straight again and an inch longer and I have been doing some "real" bike riding not just on the trainer. I haven't tried my road bikes yet but I've been on my 2021 Trek Marlin 5 MTB quite a bit and I drug out my old 22" Trek 820 MTB yesterday and it fit me just fine with no adjustments. I bought it new almost 25 years ago to the day so it was kind of like going back in time. I'm slowly getting back to swinging my leg over the saddle to mount, depending on which bike, but the dismounts are still ugly and nerve wracking. Now it's a matter of range of motion, it's slowly coming back but I'm still very nervous making certain motions like swinging my leg back over the saddle to dismount. I also had difficulty getting my foot out of the strap on the PowerGrip pedals on the 820 although I think with a little more practice it would become 2nd nature again. However I noticed my feet were parallel to the bike and centered on the pedal side to side so maybe it's time to dust off my SPD's......... I haven't been able to use them for a few years because of the condition my knees were in but I think I would be able to unclip with no issue now.
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Old 09-30-22, 02:13 PM
  #24  
philbob57
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Great update!
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Old 10-03-22, 10:01 AM
  #25  
63rickert
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Make it smaller from both ends. Olde English could have 90 and 95mm of bottom bracket drop. Toe clips will scrape a lot on the pavement when walking the bike. Tail of front derailleur may hit chain stay. We are talking old bikes where front derailleurs were uncommon. No, you won't pedal corners. Easier to mount and dismount. Lower center of gravity corners better and feels safer. Less altitude if you do fall.
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