roccobike

I'm looking to buy a new to me used bike. I've narrowed the search down to three that I like. Other than paint schemes the frames are the same size, brand and model very close in years. All of these are not local so I can't demo them before I buy. The big difference appears to be the groupo and the wheels. The groupos are Bike 1, full DA 7900 except for the crank. Bike 2, full SRAM Red 10 speed, Bike 3 Ultegra 6700 with a DA crank. Wheels are not an issue because I've already got the wheels I want on my current bike.
My question is, how does SRAM Red compare to DA 7900? I'm very familiar with DA7900 as I have that on one of my main riders right now. Also, my older Tarmac has DA7800. So I know Shimano but my only experience with SRAM is with mountain bikes. I've had three MTBs with SRAM X7 or X9, 9 speed drive trains. Honestly, I like SRAM MTB equipment over Shimano XT (which I used to have). However, I'm not sure about the road groups. My concern is some reviews that I've read that say SRAM Red 10 speed does not hold up as well as DA. The reviews say they break more frequently than DA and are more difficult to keep in tune. My own experience with DA 7900 is really good as once I get the group tuned up, they are very reliable and stay in tune, even more reliable than DA7800.
Is the critique or SRAM Red valid or just some folks with sour grapes? Comments here will have an impact on which bike I buy.
Thanks in advance.
EDIT: One advantage for SRAM Red is, I believe it weighs less than the DA group so that would be an advantage.

datlas 

They are not the same but differences between them, both pro/con are quite modest, so it may matter more how worn and/or well maintained they are rather than the groupset itself.

datlas 

BTW, some people will tell you that the DA7800 you know about is actually BETTER than the DA7900. YMMV

Bob Ross

You couldn't pay me to ride a bike with SRAM mechanical shifting -- and I say this as someone who owns one bike with SRAM eTap 11-speed and whose next bike will almost certainly sport SRAM eTap AXS 12-speed.
Whereas not only is DA 7900 arguably the most user-friendly mechanical groupset available, but OP already is familiar with it. Choice is a no-brainer from my perspective.

Iride01 

I have an acquaintance that used to swear by Di2 and swear at SRAM, he had both between the several bikes. Di2 on the road bike and SRAM on the mountain bikes. A year later after all the bad mouthing of SRAM was over, he put SRAM on his road bike! Couldn't even begin to tell you what version SRAM electronic shifting it was. Maybe the later version was better than the earlier version he was cussing.

I've only got Di2 experience. All I can say is that it works. Never even rode a bike with eTap or other electronic shifting.

roccobike

Electronic shifting is not in consideration.

genejockey 

I can't imagine better mechanical shifting than the 18 year old 7800 STIs and RD I have on my Ritchey.

roadcrankr

Same here. Weird SRAM double-tap system. And SRAM brakes disappoint, as well. Wonky single pivot.
DA 7900 (and 7800) shift better than any of their mechanical setups. Looks gorgeous, too. Total no-brainer.
Easy to find the DA crankset in 50/34 configuration. Chainrings more durable, as well.
You find SRAM's weight differential in the crankset, which I consider their best component.

tFUnK

Such a personal decision. I went from Ultegra 6600 to SRAM 10sp on all my bikes. Shimano feels higher quality and heavier. SRAM feels light but cheaper quality. I liked the single lever moving on SRAM instead of the both levers moving on Shimano. I also like having the same form factor and cable pull across the SRAM lineup (I can have a bike with Rival and another with Red, Force, and they'd all feel the same) whereas I think with Shimano, the 105, Ultegra, Dura Ace were all different form factors (I don't know this for sure), and I think DA gear can have different cable pull ratios than the others. This makes it easier for me to stock extra hoods and rear derailleurs. I'm sure 7900 is great, though.

Johnny Rad

In my opinion, the shifting with Shimano DA is quiet elegance whereas SRAM Red is kerchunk industrial. And I consider myself a fan and happy user of Red mechanical and now Red eTap. That said, I hope my new bike is outfitted with DA Di12 (because it’s time for a change is all).

Caliwild

My choice would be Dura Ace. I've never had good luck with SRAM mechanical groupsets (their electronic ones are much better).

aliasfox

Don't have DuraAce and Red, but I have two Ultegra bikes (6500 and R8000), as well as a SRAM Force bike that I built last year just for fun.

Ultegra 6500: I did 130mi and 9k ft on this bike last week, with original everything (down to the shifter cables and housing). I have almost never had to do anything to keep her shifting nearly perfectly. She's 17yrs old, and I wouldn't be surprised if she has 10k+ miles on her - only started recording Strava since 2018, and there's ~1700 miles since then, and she's been my secondary bike for much of that time. This bike has a triple crank, and even that shifts reasonably crisply.

Ultegra R8000: 3300mi on this bike since 2019, and rarely misses a shift - it really only felt weird when I put a Miche cassette on, but otherwise does quite well. Very clean front derailleur shifting, too.

Force22: Very positive shifting action from the derailleur, and good feedback going up and down the cassette. Shifting into a harder gear in the back is arguably better acting than even Ultegra. Very lightweight shifters. That said, the shifter action + cable throw needed to shift to an easier gear (or into the big ring in front) is long - long enough that I feel I've strained the muscles/tendons/ligaments in my right middle finger after a few rides. If the downshift action were shorter throw, I think I'd be fine, but definitely not the biggest fan. As for performance, Force22 shifts up and down the cassette with alacrity in both directions, so if you're ok with the ergonomics, the performance is there. I'm considering converting this bike to a flat bar bike to get away from the shifters... but not sure what I'd do with a flat bar bike right now.

Based on my experience, I'd pick DuraAce - even my ancient Ultegra holds its tune phenomenally well, and I'd probably get along with the ergonomics, too.

oldbobcat

I've been double tapping with Force since 2012. You'd have to pry those levers from my cold dead fingers. That said, avoid the earliest run of Red with its titanium front derailleur cage. These wore out so quickly that the pro mechanics replaced them with Force units until SRAM fixed this. And now regarding 7900. I've heard from those who lived with it that it was Shimano's worst shifting 10-speed kit since 5600. It was their first attempt at routing the shift cables under the tape, and they really didn't get it right until 6700 Ultegra. Having worked on these bikes, I tend to concur. My anecdotal experience says that there's less cable wear inside double tap levers, too. On the other hand, the 7900 crankset really is a work of art.

Schlafen

Sram fanboy checking in.
I have been riding 11s Sram since 2012 too and now added a 12s AXS bike as well.

I haven't used Red 10s, even though it is possibly the lightest groupset ever made and still goes for a pretty penny but another thing to bear in mind is the double tap levers are known to break off. The design was improved for 11s and the lever is very reliable.

As far as front derailleurs, I use R8000 and GRX400 on 2 of my bikes, they work better than Sram's.

Never used 7800, which seems to be a bit rough from what I heard and Shimano's under the bar tape routed shift cables seem to fray and brake shifter cables inside the STI, this applies to all of them apparently.

Personally, I don't like Shimano mechanical shifting ergonomics and can't say I'm upset they're phazing it out completely, even though shifting ergonomics is not the reason they push electronic shifting so desperatly.

So which bike did you get OP ?

bykemike 

I just moved from Di2 shifters to Sram Red etap, I loved the Di2, solid system all the way with amazingly long battery life between charging.

I just picked up a BMC Roadmachine with Sram Red etap, I can't speak to longevity or battery life but I can say it is a very easy system to use, very intuitive for me, I was always mixing up my paddles with the Di2, not so with the etap.

Bah Humbug

DA all day.

oldbobcat

7800 was the last Dura-Ace version with external shift cables. You're thinking about 7900.

cxwrench

The OP has already posted that electronic isn't an option...why even bother posting about it?
Anyone that replies like this should not be taken seriously.

Honestly they both work great. Shimano is smoother, fatigues/breaks cables in the shifters, and requires less effort/movement to shift. SRAM is notchier, doesn't break cables, works better when neglected/dirty due to cable pull ratio. SRAM AeroLink brakes are not as easy to set up. I could ride either and be perfectly happy. Oh yeah, the first Ti cage Red front derailleurs truly sucked, if you get that group and it has one throw it straight into the trash. Replace w/ either 'steel cage Red' or Force...or Rival.

Schlafen

You are correct sir, I was thinking about 7900 as under bar tape routing and 7800 side exit, somehow mixed up the generations, old Shimano stuff is not my strongest point.

Bah Humbug

He asked, I answered with my take based on my experience. You just decided to be a dick. I do hope you feel better on your Sunday.

cxwrench

Why you so sensitive? Jesus, just say "In my experience I prefer XYZ". That is NOT what you posted.

oldbobcat

No problem, friend. Sometimes I end up counting up from 9-speed.

jnbrown

I have SRAM Red 10 speed on my tandem and 11 speed on two other bikes.
I like it a lot especially the double tap shifting and have had zero problems.

Camilo

I prefer Sram (have a Red and a Force 10 speed) because the ergonomics of the double tap shifting suits me better. I've had Ultegra and Tiagra and, in my experience, the shifting (front and back) is perfect in both Sram and Shimano, as are the brakes. People complain about Sram front shifting and the brakes compared to Shimano, I just have never seen a functional difference.

So ergonomics is the only meaningful difference, in my experience.

bruce19

I have a GURU Photon with DA and a GURU Sidero with SRAM Red. The SRAM is lighter and, of course, they shift differently but I wouldn't worry about the durability of either. Maintenance/adjustment of both are minimal. FWIW I also have a CAAD 12 and a Colnago CX both with 105 and 105 is excellent.