mschwett 

be pretty interesting to ride them back to back. certainly less different than going from a 1975 ford 500 to a 2022 accord, but some notable differences. would the new bike be faster? lighter? more comfortable? more grip? more reliable? easier to ride?

prj71

We have a group road ride weekly out of one of the local breweries. Every once in a while we get a new person that shows up on a vintage 80's or 90s bike. Lets just say that for whatever reason the person that always shows up on the vintage bike can't keep up.

Some of those said people ended up buying a new bike after being left behind and now can keep up.

genejockey 

Well, the 1975 bike would have a 6 speed freewheel, non-aero brake levers, DT friction shifters, non-ergo bars with a lot of drop, toeclips and straps, maybe a 52/42 crank and a 13-19 corncob rear cluster. It would have 36 spoke wheels shod in 21mm tires, maybe tubulars if you're lucky - which you'd have to learn how to glue on. Then you'd pump them up to rock hard. Bar tape would be paper thin. The frame would be pretty flexible when sprinting or climbing out of the saddle, which your 42 x 19 lowest gear would mean you'd do A LOT. You'd need to start braking a LOT sooner, and you'd need to make sure you were in the right gear when you start the climb, because you're pretty much stuck with it till the top. Getting in and out of the pedals would be a lot more dodgy, especially if you pull the straps tight so you can pedal more efficiently. Riding on the hoods would be A LOT less comfortable. And yes, IME it would be slower.

genejockey 

Yeah. A 4 minute difference over 25 miles works out to about a 10 second difference every mile, and a 10 second difference in the first mile is basically OTB. OR riding the same speed, but putting out more watts to do it and blowing up later in the ride.

genejockey 

I should note - I love all my bikes, and I like riding them as fast as I can, pushing as hard as I can. I don't baby the old bikes But they're slower.

mschwett 

42 x 19 !

that would be a very short ride for me.

genejockey 

When we do our monthly C&V rides, my co-organizer is often running that combo. He pretty much has to stand up for any little rise. He's strong, so he can do it, but still. This is why ALL my C&V bikes have at least a 42x26.

PeteHski

If you were lucky! All my bikes of that era had 5-speed freewheels. I don't think I had a 6-speed until the 80s.

genejockey 

Yeah, but we were talking high end. $750 in 1975 is the equivalent of over $4000 today

PeteHski

True. I couldn't afford high-end bikes when I was 7 years old!

genejockey 

Closest I ever came was that Ritchey with Dura Ace, and I could only afford it because it was 8 speed and then new 7700 9 speed DA had just come out. So I got it for 2/3 of the list price!

GhostRider62

I have a 1972 Masi Gran Criterium that you can ride if you wish, it is a 62 cm.

The biggest different for me WRT to just riding around are the bars and stem and brake hood ergonomics. No doubt the new carbon bikes with the latest technology and wheels are faster and more comfortable and easier to ride. Disc braked bikes are not that much lighter than the old steel bikes. More reliable? Not in my way of thinking WRT to derailleurs and shifters.....I have had new stuff break (SRAM shifters, derailleur, blipbox). One shimano shifter. Never the old shifters. The new carbon wheels with fewer spokes seem more reliable, too

big chainring 

Obviously. It's all about the bike.

prj71

To a degree I think its about the gearing on those old bikes and the cup and cone bearings. Gearing isn't low enough to keep up on the hills and the old cup and cone bearings have more resistance than the newer sealed cartridge bearings.

base2 

I disagree with the premise. All that innovation is a sandbox of new ideas. That which helps lower skilled, weaker riders go faster, further, or offer benefits in some way are (or very quickly become) a good bargain to the non-competative.

It might be useful to define the arena. "Racer" is not like "Doctor" where even the last place guy to graduate from doctor school still gets to be called "Doctor." The last place guy in the race isn't called Racer. He was simply too slow, too weak, to matter. He is the rest of us benefitting from (& taking for granted) the innovation that stuck & made a difference where it did matter.

BTinNYC 

What's the demarcation for "customer serviceable"?
Brifters?
Electronic shifting?

Those two modern things are so good, I happily deal with the downsides of their complexity.

70sSanO

I think you are on a pretty slippery slope when you talk of a cartridge bearing which are merely inner and outer races with ball bearings having less resistance than cup cone.

Cartridge bearing are great for easy replacement especially in adverse conditions, and poorly maintained bikes, but in clean and dry road conditions, it is really more wishful thinking that cartridge bearings are smoother.

John

Kapusta

There are several advantages to sealed cartridge bearings.

Resistance is not one of them.

tomato coupe

The lanterne rouge in the Tour de France will be very disappointed to hear that. (I'll break the news to Lawson Craddock the next time I see him.)

genejockey 

This is not the case in my experience. I have a couple cup and cone wheels that have a lot less drag than any of the cartridge bearing wheels. There's a reason Shimano stuck with cup and cone for their wheels for so long.

PeteHski

From an end-user perspective I find electronic gearing LESS complicated. Especially with fully wireless SRAM AXS. No cables to mess about with. Micro-tuning direct on the fly (usually a one-off event). Easiest system in the world to install on a bike.

DMC707

they need to learn the fine art of drafting

Ive shared this (and these pics) before, but shortly after i got a new bike i mapped out a 8 mile course with a little bit of everything - flats, rolling hills , (short ones , but im a Clydesdale class rider, so still a challenge for me)

Why so "short" ? So i could hit it several times in a day back to back to get repeatable results on a day with the same weather and same wind speed. If i tried to do a 25 mile TT back to back, it just wouldnt work. Most of my effort would have been expended on the first one

The results were the same regarding the stop watch. I flatted once on the old bike, so not counting that, it was very close. Observations were that the older bike could hammer the flats faster than the newer bike (Im guessing those old Campy aero wheels are still aero, and also have a bit more flywheel effect due to the extra weight ) , and the newer bike climbed more efficiently with the compact gearing and 12-27 in the back vs the traditional 53/39 with a 12-23 on the Italian bike

NEwer bike was more comfortable. The carbon frame and wheels really helped smooth things out - really, the most comfortable bike ive ever ridden.

None of the differences would result in me getting spit off the back in a group ride though. So my conclusion was that while "Steel is still real" and can still go real fast, --- good carbon is nicer to ride in a lot of ways . But i have experience with cheap carbon too -- A Cannondale Synapse equipped with 105. I never got along with that bike and honestly would pick steel over that unruly thing

cyclezen

Funny... one of the biggest differences I feel in ergos IS the on-hoods' riding experience of Brifters vs old school brake (break) levers... When I get back on the old school Levers - Campy/Shimano,Suntour/DiaCompe and all others...) they are not near as effective or comfortable as ANY of the 9 spd or newer Brifters... Can't set the olders levers to where braking from 'on-hood' and 'In-drops' is equally effective, and 'on-hoods' on the old crappage is way more uncomfortable in 3+ hours of saddle time...
And, yes, to me Wheel/Rim tech has been one of the BIGGEST Improvements. Campy and Suntour Hubs were always great stuff, but the rims... awful - light but awful to maintain without 36x and even then truing was an ongoing maintenance, like doing laundry. This with wheels built by some of the best builders in the NE.
I still have a bunch of these old wheels, but will NEVER, EVER ride them again - oh happy days...
Ride On
Yuri

WhyFi

Resistance is futile.

(sorry - had to )

JohnMorgan

You are being Bad, and you know it.

Bad Zut! Naughty Zut!