So ... what are the latest thoughts on carbon clinchers and rim brakes?
09-19-17, 11:50 AM
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I've been running the low spoke count Shimano RS-81 C24 wheels w/ a composite AL/Carbon construction w/ zero issues in braking or anything else.
Light weight, 16/21 drill, reliable smooth cup/cone hubs and an AL braking surface w/ no need to switch brake pads on wheel changes.
Take your pick of 24, 35 or 50 rim depth to suit requirements. For LD/FG rides I fit the front on the fixed gear for a mix of 19th & 21st century tech.
-Bandera
Light weight, 16/21 drill, reliable smooth cup/cone hubs and an AL braking surface w/ no need to switch brake pads on wheel changes.
Take your pick of 24, 35 or 50 rim depth to suit requirements. For LD/FG rides I fit the front on the fixed gear for a mix of 19th & 21st century tech.
-Bandera
.
09-19-17, 12:24 PM
#52
~>~
It will be interesting to see what wheel designs Shimano releases to pair w/ the new 8000 level rim brake group sets.
In the meantime these will just have to soldier on.
For someone like myself who spends a good bit of time time riding a fixed gear any wheel tech later than 1950 is a Modern Miracle, but a return to 28-30mm tire clearance goes back to the days of Anquetil & Poulidor.
The more that things change....
-Bandera
09-19-17, 12:25 PM
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well, that's kinda what I was talkin about, in nasty conditions (including just wet pavement) I was not really like the grinding sound coming out of my AL rims when hitting the brakes, I wouldn't want carbon for that reason, other poster makes it sound like my fear is largely unfounded. myself I'd want discs if I were riding mup's and stuff with carbon rims for fear of gouging the p!ss out of my expensive carbons (if I had them) and that is what made me rethink even getting them
09-19-17, 04:00 PM
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I won't ride a full carbon clincher simply because I don't trust it. I've seen carbon frames fail, wheels fail, handlebars and seatposts fail. And those are all fixed items with no friction applied to them. I just have a high degree of anxiety thinking about how adding braking friction to carbon will only help it fail faster. So, I'll stick with my aluminum clinchers and I'm ok with that. Just something about a brake pad smashing up against carbon fiber that makes me feel a little too uneasy.
09-19-17, 04:27 PM
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09-19-17, 05:30 PM
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I've seen aluminum and steel fail. I've seen carbon fail. Not too worried about it. I ride in the city, I'm a lot more concerned about bad drivers than a frame or rim failing.
Got a bunch of miles on a set of Enves, they're fantastic, and very strong. But mine are disc brake so I can't comment on what the OP is asking about specifically.
Got a bunch of miles on a set of Enves, they're fantastic, and very strong. But mine are disc brake so I can't comment on what the OP is asking about specifically.
09-19-17, 07:07 PM
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yea but with 18 front spokes and 24 rear spokes, you won't need the Zipp 202's as you will weigh 50kg and any wheel will do .... will cost a fortune to have them trued on a regular basis if you are a bit 'muscular'
you are better off getting a custom build with a decent spoke count and which weighs 200 grams more than the Zipp 202 which weigh 1450 grams (200 grams weighs a bit more than a few M&M's .... or fill your waterbottle 3/4 instead of full)
you are better off getting a custom build with a decent spoke count and which weighs 200 grams more than the Zipp 202 which weigh 1450 grams (200 grams weighs a bit more than a few M&M's .... or fill your waterbottle 3/4 instead of full)
09-19-17, 07:14 PM
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here is where I stand: I originally planned to go with disc brakes and carbon clinchers--clinchers because if I am trying to do a century, I want to be able to replace/repair tubes whenever needed. I have gotten two and once three flats on a shot ride ... and if I am 50 miles from home ... that's a lot farther than I want to walk.
Carbon so I could do 38-mm semi-aero rims and not have big weight---and discs because of rim wear and wet braking.
It is great to say "Don't ride if it looks like rain," but if I am on six- or seven-hour ride .... weather happens. If I decide to take a cycling trip to say, ride some hilly terrain, and one a week-long cycling vacation (CC touring or out-and backs from hotels/hostels/campsites each day) and it rains, and I am on hilly terrain ... vacation time is Very rare and I would need to ride regardless.
That idea--that I wanted a bike I could Always ride, anywhere paved or close to it---was the initial motivation and the initial motivation for discs. I prefer rim brakes because they are lighter and work as well ... unless I was say, on a road which didn't look like packed earth and gravel on the map, but when I crested the hill, turned out to be ... and since it is only drizzling ....
I have a dedicated rain bike, but it is heavy compared to my speedy road bike (speedy indicating potential, if it had a decent motor.) I really feel the difference--and I want a wide-tire century bike with enough luggage space for a rain jacket and a spare bottle which weighs a lot less than my rain bike, which is also my grocery and light-touring bike.
People scoff at the idea of building a new bike with rim brakes ... but for most riders doing most riding, rims brakes are just fine and a lot lighter (Hy-Rd calipers 205 each, 105 calipers like 175 ... plus discs, plus fluid, plus through-axles ... Also, disc-ready wheels seem to cost a little more and are heavier themselves. I am looking at a really light frame with heavy hardware all of a sudden.
I am torn on this ... and I understand the disc/rim brake debate pretty well, having rim brakes, and hydro and mech discs on different bikes. I really want light weight and I really want disc brakes for the "just in case" .... so I obviously have to compromise.
What I have no experience with, is carbon clinchers with rim brakes. That seemed like the one option I hadn't explored, and with the Chinabomb option I could get under 1400 grams for under $400 ... which suits the bank account nicely.
The idea of really sorry braking in the rain though .... it is a serious consideration. From what people say, it isn't "As bad as calipers on alloy" it is "Worse that calipers on steel rims:" (for you old folks) Plus it eats the CF rims. Plus I hear way too many horror stories about Chinese wheels .... the well-known brands are good, but cost more and the others are crapshoots.
These are the kind of hyper-important First-World issues I have to weigh.
The life of a cyclist is hardest not on climbs or into a headwind, but shopping online.
Carbon so I could do 38-mm semi-aero rims and not have big weight---and discs because of rim wear and wet braking.
It is great to say "Don't ride if it looks like rain," but if I am on six- or seven-hour ride .... weather happens. If I decide to take a cycling trip to say, ride some hilly terrain, and one a week-long cycling vacation (CC touring or out-and backs from hotels/hostels/campsites each day) and it rains, and I am on hilly terrain ... vacation time is Very rare and I would need to ride regardless.
That idea--that I wanted a bike I could Always ride, anywhere paved or close to it---was the initial motivation and the initial motivation for discs. I prefer rim brakes because they are lighter and work as well ... unless I was say, on a road which didn't look like packed earth and gravel on the map, but when I crested the hill, turned out to be ... and since it is only drizzling ....
I have a dedicated rain bike, but it is heavy compared to my speedy road bike (speedy indicating potential, if it had a decent motor.) I really feel the difference--and I want a wide-tire century bike with enough luggage space for a rain jacket and a spare bottle which weighs a lot less than my rain bike, which is also my grocery and light-touring bike.
People scoff at the idea of building a new bike with rim brakes ... but for most riders doing most riding, rims brakes are just fine and a lot lighter (Hy-Rd calipers 205 each, 105 calipers like 175 ... plus discs, plus fluid, plus through-axles ... Also, disc-ready wheels seem to cost a little more and are heavier themselves. I am looking at a really light frame with heavy hardware all of a sudden.
I am torn on this ... and I understand the disc/rim brake debate pretty well, having rim brakes, and hydro and mech discs on different bikes. I really want light weight and I really want disc brakes for the "just in case" .... so I obviously have to compromise.
What I have no experience with, is carbon clinchers with rim brakes. That seemed like the one option I hadn't explored, and with the Chinabomb option I could get under 1400 grams for under $400 ... which suits the bank account nicely.
The idea of really sorry braking in the rain though .... it is a serious consideration. From what people say, it isn't "As bad as calipers on alloy" it is "Worse that calipers on steel rims:" (for you old folks) Plus it eats the CF rims. Plus I hear way too many horror stories about Chinese wheels .... the well-known brands are good, but cost more and the others are crapshoots.
These are the kind of hyper-important First-World issues I have to weigh.
The life of a cyclist is hardest not on climbs or into a headwind, but shopping online.
09-19-17, 10:48 PM
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I am with this guy. No way I am putting carbon wheels on my CF frame with CF forks, CF bars, stem, saddle, and seat post. Too much risk.
Actually, I attend the Seattle Forrest school of risk management---dodge the drivers and don't sweat the mechanicals.
I broke two CF seatposts before I realized what a hugely overweight rider combined with a huge seat post exposure was always going to produce ... but I have never broken a lighter-weight CF seat post with about three inches less exposure on another bike .... so if my wheels fail I will be sure to get more spokes in the next set.
Actually, I attend the Seattle Forrest school of risk management---dodge the drivers and don't sweat the mechanicals.
I broke two CF seatposts before I realized what a hugely overweight rider combined with a huge seat post exposure was always going to produce ... but I have never broken a lighter-weight CF seat post with about three inches less exposure on another bike .... so if my wheels fail I will be sure to get more spokes in the next set.
09-19-17, 10:49 PM
#61
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You are making a common mistake. You are pretending that two different approaches to weight reduction are either/or. They are not. The only limit to desired weight reduction is a zero weight bike. So if you can carry less water instead of riding lighter wheels, you can also carry less water AND ride lighter wheels. Substituting one weight reduction for another is a naive approach to bike lightening.
09-19-17, 11:05 PM
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I have long toyed with the idea of wheel-building because I cannot afford really strong, really light wheels. However, I also understand the limitations of my time, patience, and manual dexterity ... and a poorly built wheelset might be light but who do I sue if it fails mid-ride and I grind my face off?
I won't do tubular because of the (perceived) difficulty of changing tubulars on the roadside in the rain at night along a dark stretch of road two-thirds of the way through a painfully long ride... which is exactly where I did my last tube swap (well, honestly it wasn't raining ... ) But I dream of a pair of 1300-gram clinchers tough enough to support me.
I have pretty much decided on rim brakes ... and because of economics, alloy rims. It looks like for affordable commercially available wheels $350-$450 gets me in the 1500-1600-gram range and Another couple hundred gets me one hundred grams less .... not a good deal.
I have also had to admit that light weight will probably matter more than aero ... I have lost about an MPH in average speed since breaking my collarbone---never got back my fitness back after regaining 30 pounds and with 20 hours added to my work week and my schedule flexibility evaporating (No one realizes how hard a First-World life can be <sob>.)
So ... back to the quest for affordable, strong, lightweight rim-brake clinchers ....
Too many worries about wet braking, and too much hassle changing wheels And pads to accommodate the weather .... and not enough gain from a deep rim (though I am having a hard time giving up a pair of 38-mm rims at 1530 grams ... Particularly after Mr. Robert's last post .... ) Happily so long as I am still alive I can still equivocate.
Thanks Everyone (serious for a change) for the info.
09-20-17, 05:08 AM
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09-20-17, 06:28 AM
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I haven't read through the whole thread, but from my experience, there's not too much to worry about if you go with a name brand rim. I bought Reynolds 45 mm carbon clinchers with a PowerTap hub about 2 yrs ago. I have ridden in all kinds of weather, including heavy downpours and recently stoned and horrible roads. Yes, the braking in wet is not so great. However, the wheels have been great. I can lock up the wheel when dry. Wear on the rim is not noticeable after ~10k miles. I run them every day and on the trainer in the winter.
I think a little wider might be nice for the ability to use a wider tire and gain some comfort, but no going back to alloy for me.
I think a little wider might be nice for the ability to use a wider tire and gain some comfort, but no going back to alloy for me.
09-20-17, 09:08 AM
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I won't do tubular because of the (perceived) difficulty of changing tubulars on the roadside in the rain at night along a dark stretch of road two-thirds of the way through a painfully long ride... which is exactly where I did my last tube swap (well, honestly it wasn't raining ... ) But I dream of a pair of 1300-gram clinchers tough enough to support me.
Risk management is tough. We all get mechanical problems now and then, they’re usually pretty rare. The more stuff you’re prepared to deal with, the heavier and more encumbered you are on all the rides that don’t have problems. Where that line is, depends how well you tolerate risk, or maybe how good you are at pretending it isn’t there. With my mech skills, a tubular flat is a ride ending ordeal, on clinchers, it’s just a quick pain in the ass, then it’s over.
Carbon, I’ll take that risk. I had a Cervelo that developed a crack, it appeared in the seat tube, and grew slowly. I saw it, rode gingerly home and it got me there, and they replaced it with a new frameset. We have a lot of threads in here about people on carbon bikes and carbon wheels, we don’t have hundreds of threads every week about them failing and people busting their teeth. If we start to see that, I’ll give the matter another thought.
Weather, I guess it depends on the patterns where you live, but I don’t mind rolling the dice when the odds are in my favor, and planning important trips around good weather. I mean, I live in the PNW and I backpack with a down quilt; if it’s gonna rain, I really don’t want to sleep in a meadow anyway. Just like I’m not gonna drive 100 miles to ride my bike in the rain.
09-20-17, 09:34 AM
#66
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This is why I don't like you---you have too much talent and skill.
I have long toyed with the idea of wheel-building because I cannot afford really strong, really light wheels. However, I also understand the limitations of my time, patience, and manual dexterity ... and a poorly built wheelset might be light but who do I sue if it fails mid-ride and I grind my face off?
I won't do tubular because of the (perceived) difficulty of changing tubulars on the roadside in the rain at night along a dark stretch of road two-thirds of the way through a painfully long ride... which is exactly where I did my last tube swap (well, honestly it wasn't raining ... ) But I dream of a pair of 1300-gram clinchers tough enough to support me.
I have pretty much decided on rim brakes ... and because of economics, alloy rims. It looks like for affordable commercially available wheels $350-$450 gets me in the 1500-1600-gram range and Another couple hundred gets me one hundred grams less .... not a good deal.
I have also had to admit that light weight will probably matter more than aero ... I have lost about an MPH in average speed since breaking my collarbone---never got back my fitness back after regaining 30 pounds and with 20 hours added to my work week and my schedule flexibility evaporating (No one realizes how hard a First-World life can be <sob>.)
So ... back to the quest for affordable, strong, lightweight rim-brake clinchers ....
Too many worries about wet braking, and too much hassle changing wheels And pads to accommodate the weather .... and not enough gain from a deep rim (though I am having a hard time giving up a pair of 38-mm rims at 1530 grams ... Particularly after Mr. Robert's last post .... ) Happily so long as I am still alive I can still equivocate.
Thanks Everyone (serious for a change) for the info.
I have long toyed with the idea of wheel-building because I cannot afford really strong, really light wheels. However, I also understand the limitations of my time, patience, and manual dexterity ... and a poorly built wheelset might be light but who do I sue if it fails mid-ride and I grind my face off?
I won't do tubular because of the (perceived) difficulty of changing tubulars on the roadside in the rain at night along a dark stretch of road two-thirds of the way through a painfully long ride... which is exactly where I did my last tube swap (well, honestly it wasn't raining ... ) But I dream of a pair of 1300-gram clinchers tough enough to support me.
I have pretty much decided on rim brakes ... and because of economics, alloy rims. It looks like for affordable commercially available wheels $350-$450 gets me in the 1500-1600-gram range and Another couple hundred gets me one hundred grams less .... not a good deal.
I have also had to admit that light weight will probably matter more than aero ... I have lost about an MPH in average speed since breaking my collarbone---never got back my fitness back after regaining 30 pounds and with 20 hours added to my work week and my schedule flexibility evaporating (No one realizes how hard a First-World life can be <sob>.)
So ... back to the quest for affordable, strong, lightweight rim-brake clinchers ....
Too many worries about wet braking, and too much hassle changing wheels And pads to accommodate the weather .... and not enough gain from a deep rim (though I am having a hard time giving up a pair of 38-mm rims at 1530 grams ... Particularly after Mr. Robert's last post .... ) Happily so long as I am still alive I can still equivocate.
Thanks Everyone (serious for a change) for the info.
The 2nd set I did has survived ~500 miles now, plus a cyclocross race.
09-20-17, 09:41 AM
#67
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Seriously ... don't I need a tension meter, a dishing guide, maybe some other stuff? I have a truing stand but I only use it for emergencies.
Keep in mind, this is someone who switched to velcro sneakers because of the difficulties of laces ....
09-20-17, 09:44 AM
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I agree with this. I had a set of too-light-for-me carbon tubulars years ago. Wanted to see what all the fuss was about, what the ride quality was like on tubulars. I got a flat on the approach to Mount Rainier. I used a can of sealant but it wouldn’t hold. The good news is you can ride on a flat tubbie, very slowly, the tire is glued on and protects your rim. The bad news is there goes $100 for the tire, and 2 hours drive each way to/from the mountain.
Risk management is tough. We all get mechanical problems now and then, they’re usually pretty rare. The more stuff you’re prepared to deal with, the heavier and more encumbered you are on all the rides that don’t have problems. Where that line is, depends how well you tolerate risk, or maybe how good you are at pretending it isn’t there. With my mech skills, a tubular flat is a ride ending ordeal, on clinchers, it’s just a quick pain in the ass, then it’s over.
Carbon, I’ll take that risk. I had a Cervelo that developed a crack, it appeared in the seat tube, and grew slowly. I saw it, rode gingerly home and it got me there, and they replaced it with a new frameset. We have a lot of threads in here about people on carbon bikes and carbon wheels, we don’t have hundreds of threads every week about them failing and people busting their teeth. If we start to see that, I’ll give the matter another thought.
Weather, I guess it depends on the patterns where you live, but I don’t mind rolling the dice when the odds are in my favor, and planning important trips around good weather. I mean, I live in the PNW and I backpack with a down quilt; if it’s gonna rain, I really don’t want to sleep in a meadow anyway. Just like I’m not gonna drive 100 miles to ride my bike in the rain.
Risk management is tough. We all get mechanical problems now and then, they’re usually pretty rare. The more stuff you’re prepared to deal with, the heavier and more encumbered you are on all the rides that don’t have problems. Where that line is, depends how well you tolerate risk, or maybe how good you are at pretending it isn’t there. With my mech skills, a tubular flat is a ride ending ordeal, on clinchers, it’s just a quick pain in the ass, then it’s over.
Carbon, I’ll take that risk. I had a Cervelo that developed a crack, it appeared in the seat tube, and grew slowly. I saw it, rode gingerly home and it got me there, and they replaced it with a new frameset. We have a lot of threads in here about people on carbon bikes and carbon wheels, we don’t have hundreds of threads every week about them failing and people busting their teeth. If we start to see that, I’ll give the matter another thought.
Weather, I guess it depends on the patterns where you live, but I don’t mind rolling the dice when the odds are in my favor, and planning important trips around good weather. I mean, I live in the PNW and I backpack with a down quilt; if it’s gonna rain, I really don’t want to sleep in a meadow anyway. Just like I’m not gonna drive 100 miles to ride my bike in the rain.
That seems more like a lack of information than mechanical skills.
09-20-17, 01:04 PM
#69
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I am considering building a lightweight endurance-geometry frame which would be more comfortable (more relaxed riding position, wider tires) for longer rides than my Workswell 066.
The question I am facing is rim brakes and deepish carbon clinchers with potentially questionable braking ability and the potential of wearing out the (rather more expensive) rim or disc brakes, in which case I could offset the weight lost with CF wheels with discs and heavier calipers. (I always seek to avoid unnecessary weight loss.)
With CF rims I can get lighter wheels for the same money--but light wheels which don't stop or don't last .... not such a bargain.
So ... does anyone here ride CF rims with caliper brakes, and how bad is it/are they?
The question I am facing is rim brakes and deepish carbon clinchers with potentially questionable braking ability and the potential of wearing out the (rather more expensive) rim or disc brakes, in which case I could offset the weight lost with CF wheels with discs and heavier calipers. (I always seek to avoid unnecessary weight loss.)
With CF rims I can get lighter wheels for the same money--but light wheels which don't stop or don't last .... not such a bargain.
So ... does anyone here ride CF rims with caliper brakes, and how bad is it/are they?
09-22-17, 12:55 PM
#70
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The OP hasn't mentioned tire size preference. To me, that's what'll dictate the rim choice, and thereby the brake choice.
There are a host of aero aluminum rims or hybrid alloy/carbon rims for 25mm tires. Rim brakes would be the choice. Rims would be Aforce AL33, Hed Belgium Plus, Flo 60, and a few others.
There are a few aero carbon rims for 28mm tires. Disc brakes would be the choice with ENVE SES AR4.5 rims, Zipp 303 Firecrest, NOX Falkor, and their Chinese knockoffs.
There are no aero rims for >28mm tires. A few disc-only rims exist that have decent aerodynamics when matched to wider tires. The aero penalty of the disc rotor and caliper vs rim brakes likely cancels out. This leaves two compromise options: lightweight rim brake (Stans Alpha 340, Velocity Quill, etc) or aero-ish disc brake (Velocity Blunt 35, Velocity Blunt SS, NOX Farlow, NOX Teocalli, Chinese carbon MTB rims).
There are a host of aero aluminum rims or hybrid alloy/carbon rims for 25mm tires. Rim brakes would be the choice. Rims would be Aforce AL33, Hed Belgium Plus, Flo 60, and a few others.
There are a few aero carbon rims for 28mm tires. Disc brakes would be the choice with ENVE SES AR4.5 rims, Zipp 303 Firecrest, NOX Falkor, and their Chinese knockoffs.
There are no aero rims for >28mm tires. A few disc-only rims exist that have decent aerodynamics when matched to wider tires. The aero penalty of the disc rotor and caliper vs rim brakes likely cancels out. This leaves two compromise options: lightweight rim brake (Stans Alpha 340, Velocity Quill, etc) or aero-ish disc brake (Velocity Blunt 35, Velocity Blunt SS, NOX Farlow, NOX Teocalli, Chinese carbon MTB rims).
09-22-17, 01:27 PM
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OneisAll .... yes, I decided to forget aero and discs, too.
I couldn't find 28-mm aero rims .... and as I understand it, the aero only works if the tire and rim are really closely matched in width ... and some 28 mm tires inflate to 30 mm .... waaay too wide. And for that width, discs would be pretty much the best approach but i couoldn't fiond anything affordabkle, and wide enough, and not weight three tons per wheel.
I really wanted those 28s though, because they (while heavy) smooth out sketchy pavement so well.
I went with 24-mm rims, so I can run 23s or 25s with good aero and 28s with good support ... but the rims are shallow and thus light, to offfset the weight of the tires .... which is good because I am not really fast enough to get a lot of aero benenfit ... particularly for metric centuries and centuries, which is what I am building this bike to do.
I originally wanted CF and aero, but couldn't hit the sweet spot of aero, weight, and cost. I originally wanted discs in part because of the CF rims, in part for powerful brakes .... but honestly, Shimano rim brakes have never let me down even in the rain ... (salmon pads as needed.)
So .... Kinlin rims, Bitex hubs, pretty light and a little under $500.
I couldn't find 28-mm aero rims .... and as I understand it, the aero only works if the tire and rim are really closely matched in width ... and some 28 mm tires inflate to 30 mm .... waaay too wide. And for that width, discs would be pretty much the best approach but i couoldn't fiond anything affordabkle, and wide enough, and not weight three tons per wheel.
I really wanted those 28s though, because they (while heavy) smooth out sketchy pavement so well.
I went with 24-mm rims, so I can run 23s or 25s with good aero and 28s with good support ... but the rims are shallow and thus light, to offfset the weight of the tires .... which is good because I am not really fast enough to get a lot of aero benenfit ... particularly for metric centuries and centuries, which is what I am building this bike to do.
I originally wanted CF and aero, but couldn't hit the sweet spot of aero, weight, and cost. I originally wanted discs in part because of the CF rims, in part for powerful brakes .... but honestly, Shimano rim brakes have never let me down even in the rain ... (salmon pads as needed.)
So .... Kinlin rims, Bitex hubs, pretty light and a little under $500.
09-22-17, 01:37 PM
#72
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I'm leaving tonight to pick up a set of deep (48 & 56 mm) carbon aero wheels, made for 28 mm tires; 1506 grams for the set. Disc brake, of course.
Gonna have some beautiful North Cascades roads to enjoy them on. Maiden ride over Washington Pass? Or maybe on gravel roads I haven't seen yet. So many choices.
I have to figure out how many bottles of Community Red to bring to LBS.
Gonna have some beautiful North Cascades roads to enjoy them on. Maiden ride over Washington Pass? Or maybe on gravel roads I haven't seen yet. So many choices.
I have to figure out how many bottles of Community Red to bring to LBS.
09-22-17, 02:07 PM
#73
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Yeah .... that is the sort of thing I was imagining. When I build my aero bike, I will save up for wheels like that.
Post some details and pics and impressions eventually please.
Post some details and pics and impressions eventually please.
09-22-17, 02:19 PM
#74
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I'm leaving tonight to pick up a set of deep (48 & 56 mm) carbon aero wheels, made for 28 mm tires; 1506 grams for the set. Disc brake, of course.
Gonna have some beautiful North Cascades roads to enjoy them on. Maiden ride over Washington Pass? Or maybe on gravel roads I haven't seen yet. So many choices.
I have to figure out how many bottles of Community Red to bring to LBS.
Gonna have some beautiful North Cascades roads to enjoy them on. Maiden ride over Washington Pass? Or maybe on gravel roads I haven't seen yet. So many choices.
I have to figure out how many bottles of Community Red to bring to LBS.
09-22-17, 03:35 PM
#75
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@SkepticalOne
A junkie broke the window in my car and pulled the bike out while I was taking a leak on a long drive. Disappeared with them and the bike.
I loved the wheels. The new ones are waiting for me in a shop in a little mountain town on the other side of the Cascades, I'm leaving this evening to pick them up tomorrow.
A junkie broke the window in my car and pulled the bike out while I was taking a leak on a long drive. Disappeared with them and the bike.
I loved the wheels. The new ones are waiting for me in a shop in a little mountain town on the other side of the Cascades, I'm leaving this evening to pick them up tomorrow.