base2 

Yep, "Gravel" is nearly the same thing, but for those that care about speed. In addition to my earlier post, the absence of Lycra & road's elitist image is an undeniable draw towards the activity.

If I had a nickel for every time someone proclaimed they wanted a bike, but had no intention of racing the TdF, I'd have a lot of nickels.

It's easy to forget the humble Schwinn Varsity had what we now call "Gravel" geometry & 32-35mm wide tires.

wolfchild

Gravel riding is nothing new...people have been riding unpaved roads and gravel roads on various types of bikes for a very long time.

Rolla

I guess it comes down to how narrowly you want to define "basically." I think it's comical that half of their detractors say that gravel bikes are just "mountain bikes with drop bars," and the other half says they're just "road bikes with wide tires." I'm guessing neither camp has spent any significant time riding one in the manner it's designed for.

And if you really want to talk about marketing, look no further than "endurance road bike."

Rolla

Now that's a fresh take.

Ironfish653

Because the classic 'recreational' MTB is a much more comfortable, versatile tool for the way 90% of people would use a bicycle, 90% of the time.
Wide flat bars, fat tires, and a wide range of gearing are a lot more attractive to the average consumer, especially considering the 'lighter-skinnier-faster' trends of road bikes in the early-mid 1990s.

Modern, 29" full-suspension MTBs are far more off-road focused than their 26" predecessors, ironically making them less versatile in non-trail environments. Furthermore, since a great majority of major-brand bikes ride on 622 ERD wheels (700c/29") and disk brakes spread further through the model lineups, it's even easier to find whatever combination of bar shape and tire width you might fancy, right off the rack.

Coming full circle, drop bars in the dirt isn't anything new; pre ~1993, and the first generation of suspension forks, XC racing was a lot less technical, and as much about climbing and speed on the flats, as it was about clearing obstacles, it wasn't uncommon to see one or two of the top pro XC riders on rigid, drop-bar 26'ers.

rosefarts

https://www.bicyclecolorado.org/feat...ulder-roubaix/

Raced this on 23’s a few times.

If I were to do it again, I’d still choose a traditional road bike but with tubeless 28’s. It’s fast gravel and pavement, not at all what I’d both using a proper adventure mobile for.

rsbob 

Oh man! You mean my 70s 35 lb Schwinn Varsity (in beautiful brown) was the original gravel bike and I trashed it? I could have answered my own OP question.

Here I was trend setter before there was even a trend/backward evolution. The horror!

mstateglfr 

You don't think 'monster cross' as marketing bs? It's neither a monster bike nor a cross bike.
I have a frame that is actually called a monster cross, so it's not like I am against the style or whatever. It's just funny that you hate one term but like another when there is no actual difference between them.

mstateglfr 

A gravel path isn't a gravel road.
That gravel path could be soupy pea gravel that is unridable or it could be smooth hardback limestone flat railtrail. That gravel road could be sparse hero gravel or it could be freshly graded loose gravel.

Point is, a road bike might be great on some gravel roads or might be miserable on some gravel roads.

As mentioned, I set up my gravel bike to basically be a wide tire road bike because that's how I like to ride. I ride on on some pavement since most of my rides are mixed surface, and my gravel is just unpaved roads so all I want is a wider tire at lower pressure for comfort.

But there are others who use their gravel bikes on singletrack, or bikepacking, or fire roads and they all want something different from me.
An Evil Chamois Hagar has like 90mm of trail, dropper post, and 1x drivetrain- it doesn't feel anything like a road bike.
A Salsa Cutthorat has a 69 degree head tube, 445mm chainstays, fits a 29x2.4" tire, and uses a 483mm a-c fork- it doesn't feel anything like a road bike.


You can cite some examples that are basically wide tire road bikes, but that doesn't mean that is what gravel bikes are. The category is simply too wide and varied. You have a Cervelo Aspero or Scott Addict on one side and drop bar MTBs on the other side, then countless options in between.


As for why Look is selling the same frame for endurance and gravel, perhaps it's because they don't have the resources to support separate frame designs? Perhaps it's because they want their gravel bike to ride in a similar manner to their road bike? Perhaps it's because they think they will net the most money with this plan?
Who knows why they are doing it, but it just shows that gravel bikes are diverse in range.

Rolla

Worth a read, if only for the MC etymology: https://www.cxmagazine.com/monster-c...-dirt-drop-bar

PeteHski

I'm not a detractor, far from it. But gravel bikes are road bikes with wider tyre clearance and lower gearing. Isn't that why some people run 2 wheel sets on their "groad" bike and call it a day? They have little in common with modern mountain bikes.

PeteHski

Okay so we can agree that there are infinite shades of grey when it comes to the spectrum of specific bikes from road racing right through to DH mtb. But what I would call mainstream gravel bikes seem to have around 40-50 mm of tyre clearance and geometry very similar, if not identical, to an endurance road bike. Just that bit more tyre clearance, which makes all the difference. When I think of a gravel bike, I think Specialized Diverge, Giant Revolt, Cannondale Topstone, OPEN UP/WIDE etc.

The Look 765 is a mainstream gravel bike to me and like most of those bikes it makes a decent endurance road bike on suitable tyres. That's why I think they went down that route. One frame with 40 mm ish of clearance for both uses. Job done. I seriously considered buying the road version of this bike and the extra tyre clearance does make it pretty versatile for no real penalty.

The more hardcore gravel bikes you mentioned above do seem like they are moving much further away from a road bike and more toward XC mountain bike geometry. But these are not the sort of gravel bikes I'm seeing splashed all over roadie bike magazines. Maybe they are advertised more to the mtb crowd, which would make sense? I'm a big mtb fan myself, but just not reading the mtb magazines at the moment.

seypat

Still waiting for Caliche riding to become a thing. We're going to need a whole new category of bike for that.

GhostRider62

My gravel is better than your gravel

Branko D

A lot really depends on the location. Where I live,most everywhere I need or want to go there's a road leading there and southern European roads are overall quite good. At least the main roads are fairly well maintained, and while tetriary local roads can be a bit gnarly and potholed in parts, you can just unweight a saddle for a few minutes until you are clear of it. I'm also no stranger to doing a bit of light offroad on a road bike - as long as you take it slow (and protective tape on downtube and other bits so rocks don't mar the paint), it's really not a big deal. So, where I live - the road bike is eminently practical and versatile and there's much more road to ride than gravel. I've put together a gravel bike this fall and while it's nice to have more places be accessible, I have to remember to chart a route where it'll be put to good use (without charting one which is too ambitious for a gravel bike).

However, if you live where there's a sparse road network but there's a lot of forest or gravel paths without asphalt then I can see the allure of it. A gravel bike loses much less on the road than a road bike does on gravel, and yet more stuff becomes accessible - you can do proper MTB trails on a gravel bike although it's not going to be the fastest bike on it. So, it is more versatile in many ways, and that's the basic allure of it.

Last summer I went to Montenegro and I took my road bike there; I could take only one bike for myself because we have rear rack space for only four bikes. I did some road riding and a race, but since it was all I had to ride while there, I also rode it on the local forest paths and so on with the kids - a gravel bike and a spare set of wheels with road tires would be a bit more practical for traveling for the holidays somewhere where there are more offroad paths to ride and sights to see. I would have probably ridden more through the woods than on the roads if I had had the bike suited for it (or at least a spare wheelset with something wider and tougher on it, had 23s on at the time).

pdlamb

Even my 1975 Schwinn LeTour had 1-1/4" tires. But it had a lighter frame than the boat-anchor Varsity. That's why it was a racing bike.

indyfabz

Frankly, I find it highly suspect that someone with MTB and road riding experience would legitimately not understand the "fascination" some have with gravel riding. I mean, just look at how many people ride the GDMTBR every year. And that's just one , small example. Here are a few others I just happen to have handy at the moment.

Wildwood 

Everybody wants a shot at the Gravel Riding Hall of Fame.

being set up by - the gravel race organizers. Self promotion is marketing in most cases.

mcours2006

You're making me drool with these pics!

EviLDORK

Gravel riding is about the bicycle industry cashing in on roadies surrendering the road to automobiles.

Hypno Toad

I'm calling mine "adventure bikes" ... and I love the adventure!

pdlamb

Love the pictures, but I'm curious. How many of those were taken on trips while you were riding a gravel bike?

seypat

It just depends on what type of area you grew up in and what you're familiar with. To a city person such as yourself, these pics are probably nirvana. But to someone such as myself, who grew up hauling hay out of fields like those, taking said hay down roads like those in 100+ temps, it's not. Or stringing barb wire fencing along those roads. Or grubbing mesquite trees with a grubbing hoe in a field next to one of those roads. All in 100+ temps with the wind blowing dust around. Been there done that too many times. I will admit that rolling down those roads in a vehicle with a big engine and RWD is a blast, but riding a bike on one is nothing special. I did my time there and then got the heck out of Dodge.

indyfabz

The OP didn't ask about gravel bikes. He asked about gravel riding.

In any event, I wasn't riding a designated gravel bike. I was riding my LHT, which is a touring bike that can be equipped to handle unpaved roads and trails.

CAT7RDR

The videos I came across were full squish to deal with a lot of rough single track. The one I watched with a gravel bike rider, he was not able to keep up with the full squish riders. Think it was the Van Duzer set of videos.