Large,small,what's worth more?
#1
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Large,small,what's worth more?
I had a chance to buy a 65 centimeter frame for cheap which I considered to flip.Generally are oversized or undersized frames more valuable or less than a more standard size bike like 52-58?I'm talking bikes from the 80s.
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I've found that small frames go much faster than huge ones. Lots of people getting girlfriends and wives into the sport where big guys already have their frames.
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Yeah, usually a 65cm frame is worth just the same as a 58, all else being equal; but the 48cm frame can command about a 20% premium.
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I sold a 62cm this weekend and could have sold 2 more but generally 58 is the biggest I would buy because it is the biggest I can ride. I have usually ended up parting out very large bikes.
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I've been looking for a smaller lugged steel frame for my wife (48-50cm) and they are scarce. OTOH, I see plenty of frames 60cm and larger.
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XS bikes tend to bring 25% to 33% more than regular sizes. XL bikes tend to bring 25% less. Took me a year to sell one, despite offering it at a significant discount. This topic has been discussed many times. In my area, the mini-boom of female tri athletes, looking for a starter bike, and the move on modern bike sizing to put riders on smaller sized bikes, has combined to create quite a boom for small bikes. Add to that demand, the supply of small bikes, particularly vintage ones, is limited, as many manufacturers did not make very small bikes (in the 1970s, some of the Schwinn racing bikes were sized at 22, 24, and 26 inches. So "22" was small.) And the smaller the better. Had a buyer drive four hours one way to pick up an 18 inch Trek racing bike. Most of the smallest vintage Treks were 19 inches.
Whenever I pick up a small/extra small frame racing bike, I move it to the front of the line.
Whenever I pick up a small/extra small frame racing bike, I move it to the front of the line.
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I'd say the discount on large frames is even bigger(haha) than bill suggests. I can pretty much immediately sell a small frame at asking price and have to turn away multiple requests. A bigger frame 60 or above will simply sit. To some extent i think prices flatten at the very high end-- those bikes are a harder sell at market, no matter the size.
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Bikes over about 60cm are hard to get into a box that doesn't get dinged for "oversized package" fees from UPS or Fedex. It's a pretty steep fee, like $50 or something. That limits the bike's Ebay desirability and Ebay is where the niche market stuff sells. Much harder to find a huge guy on Craigslist.
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I tend to agree with Bill on this. Think about potential buyers - there just aren't (statistically) that many guys looking for a 65 cm. or larger frame, vs. the number of lookers in, say, the 54-62 range. I'm fairly tall, about 95th percentile US male, and I ride a 60-62, depending on the vintage / specific geometry. When I look on eBay, it often seems to me like there are way too many 'XL' frames for sale, and too few 'L' frames. My wife rides a 48-50, and since those are at the very bottom end of the 700c build (size) spectrum, higher-end frames in that size are not very common either. They just didn't make many. Plus, Japan Inc. will often go after the best examples of the small ones, so that drives demand up as well.
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I need large frames (XL in today's world) I ride 64cm as a rule, I can run just above and just below that size if I have to. I pay whatever the seller is asking in most cases, because they are hard for me to find. I guess it is a case of the right seller getting the right buyer at the right time.
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#11
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I don't know about other components but I think the same could be said of cranksets.......165mm seem to be more scarce/desirable/expensive and the 175mm seem to be plentiful and a harder sell.
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I rarely see anything in the 58-62 cm range here, which is what I'd want. Not that I'm actually looking anyway, though if I found a great deal, I probably wouldn't be able to turn it down.
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I tend to agree with Bill on this. Think about potential buyers - there just aren't (statistically) that many guys looking for a 65 cm. or larger frame, vs. the number of lookers in, say, the 54-62 range. I'm fairly tall, about 95th percentile US male, and I ride a 60-62, depending on the vintage / specific geometry. When I look on eBay, it often seems to me like there are way too many 'XL' frames for sale, and too few 'L' frames. My wife rides a 48-50, and since those are at the very bottom end of the 700c build (size) spectrum, higher-end frames in that size are not very common either. They just didn't make many. Plus, Japan Inc. will often go after the best examples of the small ones, so that drives demand up as well.
However, anecdotal evidence from others on this forum (as well as myself), suggests there really is a price differential - and that may be due to the popularity of female riders on "men's" bikes, and of course demand in places like Japan.
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I'm going to the Westminster swap in a few weeks. If form holds, there will be some good buys on larger framed rides. Which is fine for me. Not so good for the smaller rider.
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I've also found that smaller bikes command a much higher price than larger ones. I think a lot of it is because in the 80's most women who rode bikes didn't have higher end racing bikes - instead they had heavy 'lightweights' with steel rims and the like. Now, a lot more women are getting into cycling and the demand outreaches the supply (aka the demand 20-30 years ago).
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I have found that larger and smaller frames appear to get more while not really. Small and large frames tended to come on higher end simi custom bikes and the quality leads to a lot of the higher price. As said above and numerouse times slightly smaller high end nice front diamond triangle basically womens road bikes draw somewhat of a primium.
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That same bike in a 63cm frame could take a couple of weeks to find a buyer at 25% less than the 50cm frame. From my experience anyway.
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I bought a 50cm Miyata 710 last year, including a nice indoor trainer, on Craigslist for very little $ after it had sat for weeks. I went to see it and told the owner that it was too small for me and wished her well and that if she got desperate to dump it I would take it off her hands. She was moving to Europe and she finally called and told me to come get it (and the trainer). I don't think she rode it outside very much, for a 1985 bike it looked like it had seen about a year of light riding- no rust, no wear, original rubber. So I found the perfect donor bike, I guess. Really nice components, wheels, etc., and with hardly any mileage on any of it. I'm still scouting the perfect frame to make the switch.
I'm not sure what that adds to the discussion, but that's my experience. Smaller frames seem to carry fewer miles.
I'm not sure what that adds to the discussion, but that's my experience. Smaller frames seem to carry fewer miles.
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Um, good vintage 175s (non-ATB ones, anyways) are scarce and pricey, especially the older they get. 170s fall from the sky every day, like rain, it seems. Sell me all of your mint vintage 175 mm road cranksets!
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Statistically, different prices for varying sizes doesn't make sense. Production of bike frames, like everything else, is set to match demand - there are fewer people over 6'4", therefore there should be fewer larger frame sizes available for those folks. Everything equaling out, which it should on a large enough scale, should result in no real statistical difference between bike frame prices based on size. It just doesn't make sense.
However, anecdotal evidence from others on this forum (as well as myself), suggests there really is a price differential - and that may be due to the popularity of female riders on "men's" bikes, and of course demand in places like Japan.
However, anecdotal evidence from others on this forum (as well as myself), suggests there really is a price differential - and that may be due to the popularity of female riders on "men's" bikes, and of course demand in places like Japan.
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It’s a demographic question of average height you ask. I think for craigslist purposes, 54cm frames are probably the center point. Very small and very large frames get an extra value point because of the smaller market group. However, If you’re a flipper trying to pay your rent, I’d concentrate on 54cm or lower frame sizes. If you’re trying to maximize profit margin, go big and have patience.
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Thats interesting. The vast majority of cranks I've stopped to check the size of have been 170.
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It’s a demographic question of average height you ask. I think for craigslist purposes, 54cm frames are probably the center point. Very small and very large frames get an extra value point because of the smaller market group. However, If you’re a flipper trying to pay your rent, I’d concentrate on 54cm or lower frame sizes. If you’re trying to maximize profit margin, go big and have patience.