Dictatorsaurus

I have a 2011 Jamis Xenith Team carbon DA di2 with Reynolds carbon 44/66 wheels (rim brakes)

I've been tempted to get the 2021 Giant Defy Ultegra di2. They retail for $6,500 which is quite a bit. I don't know how much I would get for my Jamis.

A few things I'm considering

- I like disc brakes
- Whole internal cable routing on the Defy
- Allows for wider tires
- Wheels are tubeless
- Giant D-Fuse seatpost provides noticeable comfort with around 12mm swing.

My Jamis was top build over ten years ago. With technology changing, would the newer Defy be a noticeable upgrade?

Here's my Jamis:

RH Clark

Personally, I prefer my less complicated, cheaper, and easier to work on tech. Granted, I'm too old, slow, and non-competitive to get any real benefit from the newer tech. My best advice is to only upgrade when you can tell that some aspect of your current equipment is preventing you from doing exactly what you want to accomplish. On the other hand, life is short and if it's something you really want that won't cause undue financial hardship, go for it. I would not however sell my current bike until I had ridden the new one enough to know for sure that it was what I expected.

stevel610 

If you want to keep your current bike, it appears fine for you.

If you really just want a new bike, ask this question on the road bike forum and you'll get a number of answers explaining why your current bike is not satisfactory and how the 5 seconds you'll save on you current Saturday morning ride easily justifies the $7-12k you'll spend.😁

That said, nothing wrong with getting a new bike just because you want a new bike. Sometimes it's just time for one, and that's good enough reason. Good luck.

veganbikes

The D-Fuse would be a definite no for me, I see a proprietary seatpost I am generally out. I would keep the Jamis unless there is an issue.

Wider tires are a plus that is a hard one to beat. In terms of tubeless, I could take it or leave it but that is never a reason to buy a bike, I can buy a wheelset pretty easily that is tubeless ready if I really need that.

Internal routing is clean but a pain to work on generally, it is getting better-ish on some bikes but can still be a pain.

Disc brakes are nice but I can get great stopping power with good shoes, pads, cables and housing and if I really want to improve things and loose some weight eeBrakes for the win. My road bike has 11 speed Ultegra Di2 and eeBrakes and is fantastic and I built it in 2015-2016 and I don't feel it is old at all.

Dictatorsaurus

I actually think my old Jamis is faster than the new Defy

Dictatorsaurus

Having ridden the D-Fuse on my gravel bike, I absolutely love it. Super comfy and you can feel the slight movement. But I agree with you on the proprietary con.

ClydeClydeson

Disc brakes and wider tires are, in my opinion, the only actual improvements over your Jamis, but even these are only really relevant on rougher roads or more extreme terrain like very steep hills. Are you finding the rim brakes on the Jamis to be unsatisfactory? Are you finding the max tire size on the Jamis (What is the max? 25mm? 28mm?) ride too roughly, or you want to tackle some gravel or other loose surface roads?

IF you answered yes to any of these questions then you potentially will benefit from the new bike. Also if you are just really Jonesin' for a new bike and you've got the cash, then a new bike would be awesome.
Otherwise, you can refresh your older bike so it makes a real difference for a whole lot less than $6k. New handlebars, bar tape, saddle, seatpost, tires, pedals, cleats, shoes... and lots more... can easily be fit into a budget well under $6k.

Dictatorsaurus

I don't ride in the rain. But I did get caught the other day and might as well have used my feet to stop. Carbon rims and pads are nonexistent in the wet. It's only if I get caught its an issue.
Currently have a GP4000 25mm. If I can fit a GP5000 28mm I think I will be happy. Have to buy one and see if it fits.

veganbikes

Plenty of excellent seatposts with flex that are round and come in standard sizes. If you don't mind a little extra weight try the Kinekt seatpost (really comfortable) or just get a nice titanium post or one of the carbon posts or if weight is a concern but a little extra suspension is nice the eeSilk post from Cane Creek is another nice one.

DaveSSS 

I wouldn't buy anything that's not 12 speed. Your current bike may fit, but if it requires 40mm of spacer and a flipped up stem, it's not the right size.

I'd look into models with SRAM Rival or Force 12 speed. Proprietary posts don't bother me if the clamp works well.

I've built up two Yoeleo R12 frames this year that are real bargains. Every part is exactly what I wanted to use.

One big improvement is 23-25mm internal width hookless rims and 28-30mm tubeless tires. Tubeless isn't just flat protection. It allows me to run 52/56 psi for big improvement in ride.

freeranger

Seeing as my most "modern" bike is a 2006 model, I sure don't see a need for a more modern bike than your current one. And seems internal cable routing isn't so great when it comes to changing them, and other than aesthetics, I don't see the advantage. I don't ride much in rain, and don't have a problem stopping so long as the pads aren't old and worn (I'm using Kool Stop salmon). Nice bike ya have, I'd be keeping it! But that's just me. If you want or need the new tech, go for it.

mstateglfr 

A gp4k 25mm is like 27.5mm actual when installed in an 18mm internal rim.
Just saying that the increase to a gp5k 28mm tire may not be significant.

Your Jamie's is neat- top build on a smaller brand- that's cool.
That is a lot of spacers- maybe a new bike would allow you to resize the frame so you have a higher stack height and fewer spacers. This isn't just aesthetic- it's commonly recommended that no more than 40mm of spacers be used on a carbon steerer.

If you want disc and the dfuse seatpost, seems your choice is to buy the giant.

Dictatorsaurus

The bike came stock with those spacers and steerer tube.

Dictatorsaurus

Thanks for the info. Hopefully the 28mm will fit and solve most of my needs.

ClydeClydeson

I can't see the picture of your bike, but others are commenting on the way your stem is set up, and they very well may be right - having to add a large number of spacers, or to use an extra long seatpost, or other non-standard parts to get the bike to fit, generally indicates the bike is NOT a great fit for the rider, and this is a bigger concern than 11 vs 12 speed, or disc vs rim brakes, or 28mm vs 32mm tires. If it's just the stem spacers and you have many thousands of happy and comfortable miles on this bike then don't listen to us, but if you have struggled to ride comfortably or have neck or back or arm pain during or after riding, then finding a bike that fits better is also a good reason to get a new one. However, even if the Giant you mentioned has all the features you want, this doesn't mean it's a good fit for you. I would check the online geometry charts for the Giant or any other bike you are considering and compare to measurements taken of your own bike, and use your existing bike as a model for how it should be, or make some estimations of how you would want your existing bike to fit and compare that to the new bikes you are looking at.

Another option, if the Jamis is comfortable as you have it set up, is to get either a set of aluminum wheels, or (if they still make these) carbon wheels with alloy brake tracks to improve braking.

79pmooney

I'm another who will stick to round seatposts (and preferably bikes that take or can be shimmed to 27.2mm). Seatposts have to work or the bike is completely unrideable. (I rode my first Cycle Oregon on my newish custom with an old Avocet head pressed onto a ti tube for the post. (Avocet for its big setback.) The head broke on day one. Fortunately 3 miles from the finish and I just rode it out-of-the-saddle. A mechanic lent me a Kalloy that I used for nearly a year while I had a custom post made. Simple fix. Not perfect. It was a real blessing to get my seat position back when I go the new post! but it worked and was fully rideable and nothing makeshift about it.

This on a bike with large diameter tubes but they were round and the builder had no issue at all with providing the 27.2 shim.

Iride01 

As long as everything works on the old bike and it does everything you want it to do, then no reason to get another. But if you start to think you are better than the bike, then maybe you should look to solve that with a new bike. Even if you are just bored with the color.

veganbikes

I would agree on buying the newer stuff at this point if buying a new bike. However must disagree on the spacers and stem part. In some cases yes it may not be the right size but some people want a more upright set up. I know my back likes to be more upright and with a larger bike the rest of the fit is off on some bikes so most of my bikes have spacers. Typically on a carbon steerer they don't recommend more than 40mm of spacers. Now not being an actual fitter (went to school...) as probably 99% of the folks on this forum aren't and not having seen the OP on their bike it is tough to tell if they are in an optimal position for their body which is the important thing here.

Most road bikes are designed for a more aerodynamic position and a shorter headtube so some of us do compensate for it using spacers and stems which you can do to a degree. If I had my way and a much much larger bank account Tom Sturdy would be building me a few dream bikes to my specs so I wouldn't need as many spacers. I would probably also spread some money in the U.S. as well and get some steel stuff and maybe a few back up ti frames from Firefly, No.22, Moots and Sklar just to make sure I am not understocked in bikes but that is a dream I am unlikely to achieve.

In terms of SRAM, with AXS I like the shifting but mechanical SRAM DoubleTap I cannot abide by and would not want DOT fluid brakes. Shimano or death or Campy Ekar would be cool for a dropbar 1x all-road/gravel dealy. Though for a flat bar build a AXS build with Magura or Shimano brakes would be pretty nice.

pdlamb

I think buying a new bike because of new technology is kind of like buying a new computer or phone. On the one hand, it's new! and bling!

OTOH, there was a surprising article a few months back about how many techies are buying old laptops. The laptop is dirt cheap; plug it in to the charger, a nice display, and a good keyboard, and it does everything work-wise you need to do.

Should I mention that until I bought a bike that will handle 42 tires this summer, my newest bike was from 2009?

Kapusta

Wider tires is the main reason to upgrade, and maybe the only one that would justify it for me personally. Disc sort of goes along with wider tires.

Everything else? Meh.

Lombard

Bikes depreciate faster than cars, so probably not a whole lot. I would keep the Jamis as a backup if you buy a new bike.

What do you like about them? Yes, they have awesome stopping power, but then so do recent generations of rim brakes. If you normally ride in rain and on wet roads, disc brakes are definitely an advantage. If you are a dry weather rider, you won't notice a lot of difference.

Since the bike is Di2, there are no shifter cables, just hydraulic brake hoses. I personally curse internal cable routing every time I have to change a chewed up shifter cable, but for Di2, it's a non-issue.

This would be the only advantage I can see. Not a $6500 advantage IMHO, but I'm not you.

Considering I ride 3000+ miles per year and get less than one flat a year, I don't see the advantage to tubeless. YMMV.

Proprietary parts like this would be an immediate dealbreaker for me. You can never use a different seatpost if you decide you want one with a different setback, etc. You are stuck going through Giant.

How many bikes have you test ridden? Have you tried different brands?

tFUnK

I think that Jamis looks great and one hack for those of us with older frames and wanting wider tires is to put some 25mm GP4K tires on a modern, wider rim, which should balloon out to about 26-27mm true width.

Disc brakes are whatever in my opinion. To be fair I haven't ridden anything modern but in the early days of disc brakes on MTBs I just thought they were heavy. I still ride rim brakes on road and MTB and feel they stop fine. I think the biggest advantage of disc brakes is actually saving wear and tear on your rims.

Hidden cables, now that's something that's silly on paper but actually nice to have. I ride with a top tube frame bag and while I'm able to get my bags onto my frames without issues, it would have had a cleaner look and be easier to install or remove if my frames had hidden cables. Hidden cables also make it easier to clean or wipe down the bike after each ride. I have considered drilling holes on my frames and running full length cable housing, but then I'd still have the cable stops left over.

icemilkcoffee 

Of course. A new bike always comes with the maximum length of steerer tube and a whole lot of spacers. For the same reason that the seatpost comes measuring 35cm long- it doesn't mean you have to use that whole length up to the 'min insertion' mark. You are supposed to adjust it to the right position and then cut the excess steerer tube and throw away the unneeded spacers.

Ironically though- that long exposed seatpost on your Jamis probably made the ride cushier. The physics of it is simple- the longer the exposed seatpost, the more room it has to flex and absorb vibrations. So if and when you get a new, right-sized bike with less exposed seatpost, the ride will probably be a little worse.

PeteHski

From looking at the setup of your current bike, the relatively high stack of the Defy should suit you very well. I think you would also notice a decade's worth of incrmental improvements in bike tech. Wider, tubeless tyres in particular would be enough of a reason for me to upgrade.

datlas 

I am a thrifty retrogrouch. Would keep what you have. But that’s me.