DangerousDanR

Well, I did it! I went and bought a Time Scylon and had it built up by Wrench Science with a 1X13 Ekar group set. I added Winspace Hyper D67 wheels. So if you hate modern stuff you should really hate this bike, since it checks all the boxes:

1) Crabon frame & Crabon seat post!
2) Crabon wheels!
3) Crabon handlebars!
4) Tubeless tires!
5) Wider (28 mm) tires!
6) Brifters!
7) Disc brakes!
8) and finally, 13 lousy cogs on the cassette... and a road 1X
The only thing missing is electric shifting.

So first off, initial impressions: it is stable in a cross wind. Last night the wind did a 180 on me and I had 7 miles into a 20 sustained with gusts to 30 that was sometimes a cross wind. I don't know if it is the wheels, the frame, or some combination, but it was stable as fast as I could pedal into a wind like that.

Second, it is comfortable. I have done a 40 mile ride on it already, even though my hip sometimes really hurts. It is much better than the Lynskey going over the canyons expansion joints in Minnesota. The wider tires are no doubt much of the increase in comfort. I believe the frame, fork and seat post also deserve some of the credit.

Third, it seems to be faster than the Lynskey. Not by much, but recovering from having that big piece of Ti put in my femur anything helps. I have several loops that I have a good history on. On the 25 mile loop I set a new best time, even with one leg being at 50% lift strength.

This is my second Ekar bike (the first is a gravel/touring Lynskey) and I can now say I don't miss the EPS one little bit. The physical effort to shift the Ekar is not very great. Now, if the wind does a sudden 180 and I am rowing through the gears, I do need to make a couple of sweeps on the lever where the EPS I just hold it in the down shift position until my cadence is back in range. It is not even close to worth the $3K extra that I would have had to have spent to get EPS Super Record.

The gearing is very nice for a road bike. It is different than what Shimano or SRAM put on their gravel 1X groups. It is like you have a wide ratio 5 speed in the lower gears, then you have a close ratio 8 in the high gears. I am using a 38 tooth chain ring, and I do wish I had gone with a 40, but not enough to go out and buy one.

On the open road, the upper 5 gears are only for taking off, or maybe if we had some mountains. Or maybe if it is a howling wind like the 20/30 I rode in last night.

The disc brakes are superb. They do not rub at all. They are just plain wonderful. I have no issues with the Super Record, Chorus and Dura Ace dual pivot brakes on my other rim brake bikes. The Campagnolo brakes are better.

Not sure what to do with the Lynskey. Sell it? Take the EPS off and put it on the Ritchey Breakaway, then sell the frame? Keep it as a very nice backup? Spares? Hang it up next to the Peugeot as a second garage monarch?

And I know that many of you would not hold a frame by the top tube. If I was going to put torque into anything, maybe. As a rack, meh.

PeteHski

Very nice build! I very nearly built an Ekar road bike 18 months ago as I'm a big fan of 1x drivetrains. Only reason I didn't go ahead was because of pandemic parts delays at the time. I think these builds will soon become far more mainstream. An electronic 1x13 would be the icing on the cake for me, but I would have been fine with Ekar too.

I would still be very wary of holding it by the top tube as there is potentially a lot of leverage on offer there if somebody accidentally leans on it! I'm sure it's not super fragile, but that's the one thing carbon frames don't like at all.

Enjoy!

Broctoon

That's a cool bike! I would ride the dickens out of it.

Eric F 

Sweet!!! I put a lot of happy miles on my old Time VX, and would love to have a newer one. Enjoy the ride!!

Bah Humbug

Thanks for the review. Back when I rode I was considering Ekar for road - the first holdup was a lack of any way to get crank-based power until there was finally a chainring available that mounted to a Quarq. Then I couldn't find a suitable mechanic, and then crashed and that was that.

I kinda wish I could put it on my trainer bike for funsies, but the Garmin doesn't make a N3W hub for the Neo, so that's that. Totally unnecessary anyway.

tomato coupe

Which cassette are you using?

Bob Ross

I don't hate modern stuff by any stretch, and most of the checkboxes on your list I either embrace, or, at worst, am indifferent to

...except for a pure road bike with a 1X drivetrain. I have yet to see any rider with a 1X on a fast cooperative group paceline ride (e.g., your typical recreational cycle club A or B group) who was not spinning out like a Buster Keaton clown show on the sprints or descents. Wrong tool for the job imho.

tbh I'm not even sure I see the appeal of 1X on mountain bikes, but at least there I'm so out-of-the-loop that I'm willing to chalk it up to my own ignorance. 1X for road cycling = no bueno



But that is a good looking bike ya got there! Enjoy.

DangerousDanR

Campagnolo calls it Gravel Race: 9-42T (9-10-11-12-13-14-16-18-21-25-30-36-42)

I rode 56 miles today into a 15 to 25 MPH wind and when the cassette needs replacing I will probably buy a 9-36 since I am not finding myself using the 42 for anything.

DangerousDanR

The appeal of this setup is that it has some very low escape gears for an old man who buys his cycling kit from Fat Lad at the Back, and who was told that recovering from a femur fracture and muscle injury will take a year

That, and that it cost a lot less than EPS Super Record, Record or SR, and even less than Chorus, while giving me the same gears for riding at speeds up to 40 MPH. I don't care for Shimano or SRAM ergonomics, so those were my choices.

​​​​​​If I find myself running out of gears I will switch to a 42 tooth chainring.

The Ekar cogs are not evenly spaced. It is a wide ratio cog set up to about 15 MPH and a close ratio cog set up to 40. I have no problem with the gaps at low speeds, and I have small gaps on the high end. Yes, to get back into A/B ride shape.

Eric F 

I used to feel that way, too. Then I bought a newer 1x MTB, and found that I really like it. I recently changed my gravel bike to 1x as well, and am liking it, even for events/races.

DangerousDanR

If an electric Ekar had been available for $200 more than I paid I might have gone that way. I already have a cable Ekar on a gravel bike, so I knew what it would be like.

But the SR EPS is at least $3000 more than the Ekar, so even for an old and overpaid Engineering manager that is just too expensive.

RCMoeur 

A 38/9 is roughly equivalent to a 51/12. 4.222 is a rather tall gain ratio.

PeteHski

So in other words you know diddly squat about modern 1x drivetrains.

There is actually very little compromise with a 1x13 road setup, especially if you are a flat-lander and don’t need a lot of lower gears. Even then it’s only very slightly less versatile than a 2x11.

But we know how conservative the road bike market is. It took most of my lifetime for compact 2x with gearing that works well for guys with a sub 400W FTP! So I expect it will be at least another decade before 1x road is accepted. But I think Ekar is a step toward that goal. SRAM are pushing in that direction too, but Ekar currently has better gearing options for road use.

delbiker1 

Nice bike, DDR, The Ekar and the new 12 speed groups are out of my price range, even if I actually wanted to try one. I am one that thought I would not try a 1 X, due to no need. However, curiosity won out in the end.

I just finished switching my Airborne Zeppelin Ti to a 1 X drivetrain. I got in the second ride on it this evening. I live in the flatland of the Delmarva Peninsula, and I am liking the 1 X, a lot. The first ride, I had a 46 tooth in front, with 11-40, 10 speed rear. Today, I switched to 44 tooth front and 11-36 rear, 11 speed. The bike has bar end levers set in friction mode, already had an 11 speed chain, all I had to do was switch the cassette. That gearing feels better to me, with it being a bit tighter. I also switched the crank set from 6750 with just one ring, to a Kuota carban fiber crank with the 44t. I weighed the bike today before re-mounting any of the accessories, 17.2 lbs.
After the few miles I have done, I feel like I am missing nothing in the gearing, I rarely used the small ring anyway, If I am going to take the bike where elevation is going to be a factor, I can easily switch the ring and the cassette to get lower gearing. I will likely be purchasing an 11 speed, 11-42 cassette, Shimano Deore CS-M5100. They can be acquired for as low as $47, with shipping.

ussprinceton

first time I've seen a 1x13

Bob Ross

Reading comprehension = 0

What part of "I have yet to see any rider with a 1X on a fast cooperative group paceline ride (e.g., your typical recreational cycle club A or B group) who was not spinning out like a Buster Keaton clown show on the sprints or descents" did you miss? Nevermind, this is bikeforums.net, everybody is a moron.

mschwett 

i think the point is more that what you may or may not have observed bears zero relationship to the possibilities.

practically speaking, the difference between a modern 1x13 and your typical road 2x11 or 2x12 is the size of the steps, not the range. 42 or 44 up front and 9-42 in back is essentially identical to the 52/36 up front and 11-34 in the back that 12 speed dura ace gives you today. or are people spinning out like clowns on those too? because if they are, on either setup, it’s because they’re in the wrong gear. not because 1x isn’t capable.

42:9 = 4.67:1
42:42 = 1:1

52:11 = 4.73:1
36:34 = 1.06:1

incredibly close, and the 1x can be further tweaked to be a little lower or a little higher, which is much harder with a dual. fewer choices. it’s a very interesting option.

mschwett 

DangerousDanR sweet build!! thank you for the build report, love it.

DangerousDanR

I am not saying that you are a "moron", but as my leg heals and I get stronger I can switch to a 42 or a 44 tooth chainring. And with a 44 I can pedal to 39 MPH at 100 RPM, which is a pretty fast pace line on flat ground. Or do you consider 100 RPM to be "spinning out like a Buster Keaton clown show?" My max cadence on my ride today was 140 RPM, which is well into clown show territory, but I mostly run from 90-105 RPM.

Eric F 

Just because you haven’t seen it, doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. It would seem that your ignorance of 1x drivetrains is not limited to just MTBs.

It comes down to simple math, and the 9T cog of 1x Ekar is significant in balancing the equation when compared with a traditional 2x road drivetrain. A 44T ring would actually give you a bigger top gear than a 53x11.

SpedFast

I really like the looks of your new bike, but I would need a 43T chainring even with that 9t cog. With that 38t I would constantly be looking for another gear. I do like the idea of a 1X and now that 13s are coming into being, it might be an option even for an old fart like me. Alas, I can dream.

Eric F 

Why? Just shift up or down to suit your terrain, same as any other drivetrain. A gear ratio is a gear ratio. The only limitations will be if you need more at either end of the cassette, and a little bigger jump between gears at the low end.

PeteHski

That was my point. You clearly don’t understand how 1x road can work. Those guys you have observed were probably on lower gravel 1x gearing, but it would not be difficult to configure Ekar for a fast group ride. The only limitation is if you need closely spaced ratios over a very wide range and even then it is very marginal with 1x13. The way Ekar cassettes are stacked actually favours a fast paceline ride with 1 tooth gear spacing across the high half.

Russ Roth

Sweet build.

As to the old bike, sell it or donate to a youth organization. After building my cross bike I found I enjoyed it more than the road and while 48/11 isn't an ideal paceline gear I only ever used bigger on the downhills where getting lower allows for faster anyways. As a result, I rode the road bike maybe a half dozen times in the last 3 years so I just sold the road bike. No point in keeping something for the sake of having it when its better off being used by someone.

SpedFast

I think that's what I said. The 38t would be too limiting for my style of riding. Although I've tried to retrain myself, I still fall into a slower cadence and mash the pedals. On the trainer I can maintain 80RPM for 30 miles with 2% grade equivalent resistance no problem. But when I get out on the road, I find myself settling down into a 70RPM cadence in high gear all the time, a pace that I can maintain all day. I've replaced my large chainring (52t) and the 3 smallest cogs and have yet to replace any others since the bike was new. That's just the way I roll.