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Somehow getting cable-stop away from the frame

Old 08-14-22, 07:29 PM
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Somehow getting cable-stop away from the frame

hello -

i received some advice on this forum a couple of years ago about replacing the very hard-to-find Peugeot front deraileur with a simplex deraileur. the old Peugeot front derailer had something of a "built-in" cable-stop.

as you can see in this picture (SORRY IT APPEARS I CANNOT ATTACH A PICTURE YET), the derailleur cable is really being pulled at something like a 30-degree angle. all the cable-stops i have found assume the derailer cable arm is very close to the frame, which in this situation is nowhere close. this actually works, sort of. but i don't like the idea of a cable being pulled like that.

is there some way to somehow get the cable-stop a bit further away from the frame, like maybe at least an inch? i was tempted to try to fabricate something myself, but stuff like that never seems to turn out well for me.

the picture is where the cable-stop is really right against the frame, and the cable is pulled at a 30-degree angle. is there any way i can get special clearance to post the picture? it would be a lot easier to explain it that way.
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Old 08-14-22, 07:32 PM
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is there interference with the frame & cable?
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Old 08-14-22, 09:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Troul View Post
is there interference with the frame & cable?
no interference, but i figure pulling at a 30-degree angle is adding unnecessary friction, and also wearing out the cable-housing end and probably the cable itself.

if i could email a picture to somebody with higher privilege, they could post the picture here?
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Old 08-14-22, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by edwardsmarkf View Post
SORRY IT APPEARS I CANNOT ATTACH A PICTURE YET.
You now have 10 posts.
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Old 08-14-22, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
You now have 10 posts.
thank you all. if there was some way to have the cable-stop an inch or so away from the bike frame, then the cable would not be at such an angle.

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Old 08-15-22, 10:56 AM
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i'm not sure of a product to be effective at achieving your goal, but imo, the typical amount of use for a front der is most likely low. To which, it wouldn't warrant a smoother transition. It will have a shorter cable life, but again, small fish per the amount it is likely used.
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Old 08-15-22, 12:28 PM
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This cable guide is really bizarre to me. Definitely the wrong guide for that front derailleur. What does it look like in full? Need an expanded view.

Search catalog pics of your particular bicycle to see what it should look like.
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Old 08-15-22, 12:29 PM
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It appears that the cable housing is routed under the bottom bracket and a the cable (housing) stop is attached to the seat tube.

Most road bikes have a cable (housing) stop at the head tube or down tube, for older down tube shifter bikes. The bare cable(s) is routed under the bottom bracket using a cable guide. The angle is probable a less severe angle coming from just behind the bottom bracket.

You fix is to mount a guide to the bottom bracket shell to route the bare cable. I think there are older clamp-on guides that accomplish the same thing.

If by chance the cable is coming down from the top tube and the housing is looped to work with a bottom pull FD, you should change the FD.

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Old 08-15-22, 12:46 PM
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In addition to the strange cable stop problem, the cable is not attached correctly to the derailleur:




Here are the Shimano instructions, note the position of the cable:




As others have mentioned above, the ideal fix (if possible) is to replace that cable stop with a cable guide that mounts on the bottom bracket:

Shimano Bottom Bracket Cable Guide SM-SP17

I have one of these mounted on my bottom bracket, held in place only by cyanoacrylate glue (carbon frame). Works fine.
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Old 08-15-22, 03:19 PM
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this is a VERY INTERESTING idea to use the "Shimano-Bottom-Bracket-Cable" - thank you so much for the suggestion. what would happen with the cable housing? is there a cable-stop on the "Shimano-Bottom-Bracket-Cable" ?

i had to look at an installation video to determine it goes underneath the crank, but i guess i should have known that.





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Old 08-15-22, 05:48 PM
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Okay, that's definitely the wrong cable guide for your seat tube and the wrong front derailleur as well.

The short-term solution is to move the cable guide way down the seat tube close to or directly on top of the bottom bracket shell, so that angle to the front derailleur isn't as steep. You will need to trim the housing to fit.

The long-term solution is to find a front derailleur with a housing stop like those that Suntour is known for. Then you can remove that ridiculous cable guide from the seat tube altogether.
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Old 08-15-22, 05:50 PM
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Also, the right/rear shift cable housing is not long enough. It should have a nice bend in it that touches or nearly touches the bottom bracket shell.
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Old 08-15-22, 07:58 PM
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The long-term solution is to find a front derailleur with a housing stop like those that Suntour is known for.
yes, that is what i was wondering in my original question, and i have yet to find a front derailer that attaches to the frame AND has a built-in cable stop. when i look for Suntour, all i see is front derailers on ebay.

Then you can remove that ridiculous cable guide from the seat tube altogether.
huh, at the time i did this, i thought it was rather ingenious of me. 😅
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Old 08-15-22, 08:37 PM
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Old 08-15-22, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by edwardsmarkf View Post
i have yet to find a front derailer that clamps to the frame AND has a built-in stop for brake cable housing.
There's a ton of them. Here's a cheap one:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/30459382250...Bk9SR6Sg-MnUYA
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Old 08-15-22, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
There's a ton of them. Here's a cheap one:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/30459382250...Bk9SR6Sg-MnUYA
thank you so much surferRosa - i take it there is no way to find a new one? they are all used on eBay?
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Old 08-15-22, 11:07 PM
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You can also get clamp on cable guides that fit just above the bottom bracket.

No need for the cable housing. You will need a cable stop near the rear derailleur, and probably on top of the chainstay.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/255463602766

Several brands should have made them.
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Old 08-15-22, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by edwardsmarkf View Post
I take it there is no way to find a new one? they are all used on eBay?
It's a used bike. Why not a used front derailleur? I guess you could pay $$$ for a n.o.s. one. But why?

Personally, I would go here and ask for a good, all-aluminum Suntour fd with housing stop, like a V series, Blueline, Cyclone, etc:

https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...t-5-a-205.html

Using an additional cable guide for the front derailleur or routing the cable under the bb is a kludge.
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Old 08-16-22, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
It's a used bike. Why not a used front derailleur? I guess you could pay $$$ for a n.o.s. one. But why?
Because new is almost always better than used? I always try to replace my stuff with NOS if I can; some stuff is used, but is impossible to tell. That works too.
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Old 08-16-22, 07:40 AM
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If the kickstand doesn’t completely block that space, you could just run a bit of cable housing from that housing stop on the lower downtube and under the BB and just long enough to keep the cable from rubbing the BB. Then the cable can run free and straight up to the current derailleur attachment. But there may not be room.

Otto
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Old 08-16-22, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by smd4 View Post
Because new is almost always better than used? I always try to replace my stuff with NOS if I can.
How is it "better"? It's a front derailleur on a vintage bike fer chrissake.
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Old 08-16-22, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
How is it "better"? It's a front derailleur on a vintage bike fer chrissake.
Less wear? Better finish? I'd personally prefer to put the wear and scratches on the derailleur myself. My bike is "vintage," but I still try to replace parts with new when I can.

However, I get that having a nice looking, clean, well-maintained bike isn't for everyone.
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Old 08-16-22, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by smd4 View Post
Less wear? Better finish? I'd personally prefer to put the wear and scratches on the derailleur myself. My bike is "vintage," but I still try to replace parts with new when I can. However, I get that having a nice looking, clean, well-maintained bike isn't for everyone.
Might look at his photos before you advise him to spend $$$ on something completely unnecessary.

I've never bought a nos fd. Have you seen my bikes?
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Old 08-16-22, 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
Might look at his photos before you advise him to spend $$$ on something completely unnecessary.

I've never bought a nos fd. Have you seen my bikes?
Not sure I "advised" him to do anything. Just said what I'd so. I saw the pics. But he could begin to make his bike into a showpiece starting with a new FD!

I don't remember if I've seen your bikes, but the way you say that, not sure if I want to...Do they look like crap?

Last edited by smd4; 08-16-22 at 09:04 AM.
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Old 08-16-22, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by smd4 View Post
Not sure I "advised" him to do anything. Just said what I'd so.
It's not a Cinelli Super Corsa.

I don't remember if I've seen your bikes, but the way you say that, not sure if I want to...Do they look like crap?
You can decide. Here are three of them:

https://www.bikeforums.net/22226958-post2979.html

The other two are in similar condition. I've refurbished about 70 that look/operate the same. Never bought a nos fd.
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