Looking for help to identify my dad's 1940's Bates bicycle
#1
RaeAnne
Thread Starter
Looking for help to identify my dad's 1940's Bates bicycle
I have my dads old Bates racing bike and would like to find out the model etc. I will attach some pics.
Thanks
Rae
Thanks
Rae
Last edited by RaeAnne50; 04-24-22 at 03:11 PM. Reason: need to fix photo
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#2
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could you please post some pics of the chain side and maybe a close up of the rear gear changer?
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#3
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I don't know anything either. But that front fork is interesting.
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#4
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Some info here.
https://www.classiclightweights.co.u...frame-numbers/
Pics show Diadrant fork and Cantiflex tubing. The tubing is larger diameter in the middle, tapers at the ends as well as being internally butted. Reynolds 531 special for Bates.
https://www.classiclightweights.co.u...frame-numbers/
Pics show Diadrant fork and Cantiflex tubing. The tubing is larger diameter in the middle, tapers at the ends as well as being internally butted. Reynolds 531 special for Bates.
#5
RaeAnne
Thread Starter
Sure I will post more pics but I believe my dad replaced most of the parts. The frame is the most interesting.
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I think the fork, like the Hetchins ‘Curly Stays’ and Hellenic stays (triple triangle) dates to era where advertising/endorsements were not allowed in racing so innovative designs to dampen the ride or stiffen the frame evolved which also happened to make the bike stand out from the crowd.
RaeAnne50 thanks for the extra pics. Maybe ijab can shed some light on this
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“One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"
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“One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"
Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
Last edited by Bianchigirll; 04-24-22 at 04:41 PM.
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#7
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the link provided by big-chainring would enable you to identify the model, and guide you to the period of manufacture. There are more frame numbers provided in the Readers bikes entries for 1944/5, 1948 and 1950 to help narrow down the year of the sequential frame numbers used by Bates.
A general guide to Bates cycles is at https://www.classiclightweights.co.u.../bates-cycles/
and there is the Bates Cantiflex Diadrant Classic Bicycles group on Facebook which is informative.
A general guide to Bates cycles is at https://www.classiclightweights.co.u.../bates-cycles/
and there is the Bates Cantiflex Diadrant Classic Bicycles group on Facebook which is informative.
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the three-pointed star symbol washer on the cycle's Juy Competition front gear mech is something which was only current ca. 1958; the mech's knob changed from metal to ivory coloured plastic ca. 1959-60
a companion Tour de France model rear mech with the three-pointed star is thought is have been current only 1959-61
the cycle's Gnutti splined cotterless chainset is a wonderful piece, rather cutting edge at its launch circa 1951
it was quite costly in the context of the time so only encountered on better model cycles
rare even when current
the machines wheel hubs look to be fitted with Campagnolo brand quick releases
if the hubs themselves are also Campagnolo brand then the axle locknuts will carry a date on their inner faces -
the machine's pedals are Lyotard brand model Marcel Berthet M23 -
the cycle's Weinmann Vainqueur 999 centrepull brake set is a model which was current 1957-1962 -
since several of the bicycle's components are of a date later than you suggested for the machine it is possible that is is a bit later than you thought...
...or it may be that it was upgraded with newer fittings along the way
the forum's experts shall be able to give you much more and better assistance
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the three-pointed star symbol washer on the cycle's Juy Competition front gear mech is something which was only current ca. 1958; the mech's knob changed from metal to ivory coloured plastic ca. 1959-60
a companion Tour de France model rear mech with the three-pointed star is thought is have been current only 1959-61
the cycle's Gnutti splined cotterless chainset is a wonderful piece, rather cutting edge at its launch circa 1951
it was quite costly in the context of the time so only encountered on better model cycles
rare even when current
the machines wheel hubs look to be fitted with Campagnolo brand quick releases
if the hubs themselves are also Campagnolo brand then the axle locknuts will carry a date on their inner faces -
the machine's pedals are Lyotard brand model Marcel Berthet M23 -
the cycle's Weinmann Vainqueur 999 centrepull brake set is a model which was current 1957-1962 -
since several of the bicycle's components are of a date later than you suggested for the machine it is possible that is is a bit later than you thought...
...or it may be that it was upgraded with newer fittings along the way
the forum's experts shall be able to give you much more and better assistance
-----
#10
Senior Member
Based on the frame number it is 1944/45 frame build, with later components.
Last edited by Big Block; 04-25-22 at 03:31 PM.
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thanks very much for this dating information.
the cycle appears to wear no fittings which go back to that time
so the two main possibilities would seem to be that either it hung in the racks for a long period unbuilt or received a complete reworking about 1958
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thanks very much for this dating information.
the cycle appears to wear no fittings which go back to that time
so the two main possibilities would seem to be that either it hung in the racks for a long period unbuilt or received a complete reworking about 1958
-----
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I see no reason why a Canadian rider would not follow along in that fashion for at least some time! The Bates looks well equipped and that's a lovely example. Other users have already filled you in on the details, so good luck with whatever you plan to do with it. Cheers!
-Gregory
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#14
RaeAnne
Thread Starter
Thanks for all the feedback. My dad raced for many years in Scotland, time trials and road racing?
He actually picked the bike up at a garage sale
I really don’t know what to do with it except sell it. My family doesn’t want it. I don’t really even know how to go about finding a collector.
Thanks again everyone for your input.
Rae
He actually picked the bike up at a garage sale
I really don’t know what to do with it except sell it. My family doesn’t want it. I don’t really even know how to go about finding a collector.
Thanks again everyone for your input.
Rae
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Thanks for all the feedback. My dad raced for many years in Scotland, time trials and road racing?
He actually picked the bike up at a garage sale
I really don’t know what to do with it except sell it. My family doesn’t want it. I don’t really even know how to go about finding a collector.
Thanks again everyone for your input.
Rae
He actually picked the bike up at a garage sale
I really don’t know what to do with it except sell it. My family doesn’t want it. I don’t really even know how to go about finding a collector.
Thanks again everyone for your input.
Rae
thank you for this additional information
if you are curious as to the cycle's value, salability, etc you could begin a discussion on it at the C&V Appraisals forum:
https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...th-appraisals/
in addition to value readers could make suggestions regarding where and how to list it for sale with the plusses and minuses of each
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Money shot
#18
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showing the GB hiduminium 'Spearpoint' stem, unknown steel handlebars with a GB Pelissier ferrule (separated from the intended GB Pelissier bend hiduminium handlebar)
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showing the GB hiduminium 'Spearpoint' stem, unknown steel handlebars with a GB Pelissier ferrule (separated from the intended GB Pelissier bend hiduminium handlebar)
Still pretty cool as I don't think I had seen a GB version ala Titan of that ferrule before, no surprise the bars gave up.
#20
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Source; 1949 Holdsworth Aids to Happy Cycling reproduced on Disraeli Gears site
I have the GB Spearpoint stem and GB Maes bend bars with ferrule on my 1948 Spearman.
Last edited by Big Block; 04-26-22 at 03:39 PM.
#21
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