tetonrider

yes---so sorry. my point about "the old finish" is correct.

a while back they told us we would be racing CCW around bachelor (like last year) but finishing at the new snow park (i.e. not doing the long drag back to bachelor). the cat 2 map posted online was still live (and wrong) last i checked. it was confusing to have conflicting information.

i just checked now and the map on the website now matches the description.

all other ridewithgps files show us going clockwise around bachelor (as in the link you posted).

sounds like all is now settled.

so....do you prefer this year's (/pre-2014) finish, last year's finish, or what they originally told us the finish would be for this year? i think i like this finish, but i think the 3rd option would have produced the most interesting race.

hack

The email that went out last night helped clarify things a bit. So, they had planned to run the course similar to last year, but with the finish coming before left at the new snow park. However, some road construction on the descent was kicked off earlier than expected and the organizer deemed the descent to be too unsafe to have us race down. So, they changed the direction of travel, which makes sense and they said we'd see why when we're climbing up from the lakes to Bachelor.


With all that said ... last year was my first time out racing that course. It seems that the courses set up similar, but instead of a long 3-5 % slog we get two pitchier climbs to the finish. I think this year's route could make for some dynamic racing and from what I've been told this year's route is a better course for racing.


Are you coming out to race?

tetonrider

it will be very different than what you saw last year. sorry, i thought you'd raced it in years past.

lots of people did not like this year's course due to the way it generally plays out, but people also complained about last year's course. i think the proposed new course for this year would have been the most interesting race, even though it was not the one that suited me best.

planning to come out. i'm suddenly scrambling because i might go race boise twilight then head to bend early. haven't packed a thing and won't get to before tomorrow, at least. we'll see what happens!

be cool to see you out there. i have to remember to register before the deadline. is that tomorrow?

hack

No clue on the deadline to be honest ... I'll need to check because I've been hounding our last cat 2 to reg. We'll have 6 guys in the 2s, but one of them will be pretty beat up (Jr that will have just wrapped up guest riding at Jr Tour of Ireland). We'll have a solo guy in the 1s and then a solo guy in the 35+.


I'll keep an eye out and say hello.

mattm

Deadline is this Sunday.

But don't take my word for it - sign up!!

tetonrider

mattm's right -- sunday @ 9pm PT, actually.

i'll probably wait; i might race a couple crits on saturday, so i'll hold onto the $$ just in case.

weird that the masters stage 1 RR is so short (same as women 3/4 -- quoted as 58 miles but actually 53 or so), and then the men 3/4 race only 3 loops on sunday.

hack

Well ... shoot. Tech guides are up and the Cat 2 guide has last year's map in it. I am assuming this in an oversight and the Cat 2's will be racing the same direction as everyone else like the map shows on the website? I'd have thought the tech guide would rule the roost, but who knows.

mattm

Now that this is basically the "Cascade 20xx" thread...

Cascade is a UCI race this year, and they're axing the masters category races.

Which means I can't even go if I wanted to... I was never strong enough to compete in the pro/1 field, and now you need to be UCI (and on an invited team) to race as a cat 1.

So it goes - lots of people are complaining on FB, but I think it's good for US cycling to have more UCI races, so I'm ok with it. Still, I'll miss Bend!!

Wylde06

They don't have a 1/2 race? Im not familiar with how Stage races are run but I know with Tulsa Tough they have the P/1 which was invite (from what I know anyways) then the 1/2 which I thought was open

hack

Saw that and the comments on facebook. Sucks to have the fields drop, but if the coordinator can justify it, I guess that's how they'll proceed. I think if the masters fields had been deeper the past couple of years, they'd have kept them around.


One of our 1's has moved on to Mikes's, so he's good to race. Our other 1 would have done the 35+, so he's pretty bummed. We may have a group go up and just do the 2/3 race to do it (I need some personal redemption after 2016 anyway).

mattm

A lot of stage races have P/1 and 1/2, or Pro & 1/2 - Gila does, I believe.

But yeah not Cascade 2017; like @hack said if us olden guys had bigger numbers maybe they'd include us. Last year they combined the 35+, 45+, and 55+ all in to one field (of like 50 people).

tetonrider

there's an opportunity for many of those masters who never do P/1 races to drop down to a 2 and do the 2/3 race. that suggestion is never popular.

while i joke around with it, *most* cat 1 masters i know never race anything that requires the 1 (if they do non-masters races, they are usually p/1/2 events). too bad the license doesn't note the highest category someone attained.

i ran the #s and posted on FB. masters #s were pretty solid. i'm guessing there is more to it. maybe the masters racers had a high nuisance-factor (/whiners)?

personally i think it would have been cool for a p/1 race (UCI, by invitation -- but allow guest riders), 1/2 (covers amateurs & masters) and a 3/4 race.

quality events like cascade are what hooked me on cycling when i was a 4; they set the bar high. it's unfortunate those guys won't get a chance to race, though realistically they were part of the smallest field.

hell, even the cat 2 #s have been falling over the past few years. just a couple years ago there were ~120 starts; last year was ~100.

personally, i think the change in status for the pro race is really a non-thing. no one is going to turn up downtown to watch the crit who would not have because it was "just a regular p/1 race", like 2016.

if the costs to run this level race mean excluding like 350 of the 500 amateurs who were able to participate in 2016, then honestly i say 'screw the pro race.' it's not like the CCC is turning into AToC or ToU, with some real WT/Euro pros coming to race. no one really cares that much about the domestic pro scene, and it (IMO) does more damage to the sport when the amateurs get bumped.

just one opinion for discussion.

i always tell people to race these events while they have the chance -- you never know when they'll go away. i know more than a few people who, if this sticks, will have missed their shot because they did not go the past few years and are now shut out. sad.

mattm

In my opinion most of the guys in the masters race last year would get dropped from the 2's - maybe 10 of them would be competitive there. But they're all 1's anyway.

Yeah the fans won't know or care - but having bigger pro teams doing something in the US ups the ante for racing here overall.

Indeed, like you said - race it when you have the chance.. never know when race will go away!

Anyway I'm hoping that they can add something back next year to support people like me (amateur 1/2 or masters).

Hida Yanra

huh - I hadn't heard.

I'll ask around town, it shouldn't be too hard to get the answer of why that happened.