terrymorse 

So this wonderful sealant material doesn't work inside a tube?

prj71

The pros outweigh the cons...

https://www.realbuzz.com/articles-in...n-a-road-bike/

prj71

Oh my...you clearly are obtuse.

terrymorse 

Alas, I may never "get it".

One of the downsides of relying on data to make decisions.

PeteHski

How do you know they are bad ideas? Despite working in F1 motorsport engineering for 20+ years I always thought ICEs were, at best, a bit of a mediocre solution for powering a car. Such a crude, inefficient way of generating power, despite a century of turd polishing. EVs are only barely getting started and the near future possibilities are already mind-blowing.

Tubeless tyres are not so revolutionary, but have proven to be the evolutionary end game in most other applications, so why not bicycles? Anyway they work for me and I wouldn’t use them if they really were a hassle. For me flats are the main hassle with bicycle tyres, so I’m up for anything that reduces the chances of having them.

prj71

The data is there as to why it's the better idea. You are just one of the many hold outs that refuse to accept change and progress.

terrymorse 

TUBELESS GUY (continued): The truth is out there, dude! You just have to "get it".

Progress is great when it solves a real problem.

prj71

You'll get there eventually. You either lead, follow or fall behind.

https://www.gearpatrol.com/outdoors/...er-going-back/

Then again...maybe you are still using downtube levers to shift gears, toe clips, cup and cone bearing systems, rim brakes and QR axles.

Generally speaking... The road cyclist consumer market is full of laggards when it comes to accepting new/better technology...

Cougrrcj

Naaaah, not considering going tubeless - BUT I sure would like to lose my 'spare tire'!

AlmostTrick

The one reason I'm avoiding going tubeless is I never ever want my bike or myself sprayed down with sealant, or have it all over my hands, wheels, tires or garage. Or take on the extra maintenance of adding/cleaning goop. Running tubes is not a hassle in the least. Okay, at least three reasons.

DiabloScott

That was uncalled for. My only point is that folks should be a little skeptical when they read the pro-tubeless propaganda by the fan boys (tubeless is superior in every way and the only reason to disagree is if you're a coprophilic luddite masturb8or). Anybody who says there aren't any hassles is lying (even if they haven't experienced those hassles first-hand). The same would be true for tube proponents if they were to say there are no hassles with them.

I'm glad the option is available; the objective is to determine how beneficial it would be for any particular rider and their riding. For lots of people, tubed tires are preferable; especially if going tubeless would require a new set of wheels that they don't really need. I'd like to help people determine what's right for them, and I offered my suggestions very early in this thread.

PeteHski

Flats have always been a problem with tubed bicycle tyres.

terrymorse 

Yes, bicycles tires go flat, which is a problem. But:

TUBELESS GUY: Tubeless solves the flat tire problem, dude!
ME: I'm pretty sure that tubeless tires aren't puncture proof.
TUBELESS GUY: You just don't "get it"!

Eric F 

I have found that the hassle of setting up tubeless tires in the beginning easily outweighs the hassle of my average amount of flat tires in a year, and making those repairs roadside, either having been dropped from the group I was riding with, or forcing others to wait while I make my repairs. The one flat I have had on tubeless was a gashed sidewall that would have wrecked a tubed tire similarly. I booted the gash with a dollar bill, stuck a tube in the rim, hit it with C02, and finished my ride. For me, there's isn't a downside to tubeless on the road. The flats that I'm NOT getting is the bonus. (IMO, YMMV)

prj71

That's the part that SOME people aren't getting. Those pin hole flats would be sealed by the sealant so you can keep on riding or maybe just quickly stop and add a little air. It makes tubeless way less of a hassle than roadside repairs.

Eric F 

Other than bicycles and wheelbarrows, I'm tying to think of another inflated rubber tire vehicle that uses tubes....and coming up empty. Disc brakes and tubeless tires have been the standard in the car and motorcycle world for a very long time. Zero surprise that the bicycling industry is adapting to the same technology.

Eric F 

That's the benefit I see. I still have not had to do a roadside top-off, but was riding with a guy who did. It was so quick, part of the group never needed to come to a full stop.

terrymorse 

And this sealant inside the tire somehow wouldn't provide the same benefit if it were inside a tube?

I know, you don't have to say it. I don't "get it".

Eric F 

What does a tube and sealant gain you, except weight and rolling resistance?

terrymorse 

Compare a tubeless tire to an equivalent normal tire and latex tube.

They weigh about the same, and the rolling resistance is very similar.

Advantage: neither one.

DiabloScott

OK now... how many average flats in a year is the break even point?

Eric F 

Right. However, adding sealant to a tubed tire setup adds weight. The additional weight inside the tube increases rolling resistance.

Eric F 

For me, in the 2-3 range. YMMV.

terrymorse 

Rolling resistance isn't caused by weight. It's caused by hysteresis losses from the flexing of the rubber in the contact patch and sidewall.

But for the sake of argument, let's say that adding liquid sealant to the inside of a inner tube somehow increased rolling resistance.

Wouldn't this sealant also increase rolling resistance inside a tubeless tire?

Eric F 

Thanks for the correction. I'm probably wrong on the rolling resistance part.

My thought is that the friction between the tube and the inside of the tire would be increased with more weight in the tube. You don't get that same rub between the inside of a tubeless tire and sealant.