New to disc brakes
02-23-21, 12:05 PM
#76
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With Shimano road, there is a Free Stroke adjustment, so that you can tweak the engagement point, but it's only available on Ultegra and above; the OP's 105 levers would have no such adjustment available. The pad/rotor gap will also be consistent, so nice dice there, either.
02-23-21, 12:33 PM
#77
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Has the OP called Trek, yet?
I would not waste any more time talking or arguing over this until the OP calls Trek.
I would not waste any more time talking or arguing over this until the OP calls Trek.
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02-23-21, 12:45 PM
#78
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thread derail: apparently you ride with a bunch of dunces and helpless snowflakes who have no business working in bike shops. I've been on disc brakes for over a decade and I've never, ever seen something like that happen. it took me ten minutes to figure out how to install and adjust a BB7, it's 100% intuitive and dead-simple. a few new riders have problems but disc brakes are not hard. you have a be a genuine moron to not pick up what to do after spending five minutes with a few basic tools and your bike. one of these days, take a long look at a bike with disc brakes and you'll see how simple it is. in the thousands of miles I have ridden on bikes with mechanical and hydraulic disc brakes, I've never seen much drama other than a Shimano SLX brake that kept leaking due to a worn master cylinder seal that failed after 6+ years of hard riding.
Again, were it so simple as bikeforums would have it, the shop should spend one or two minutes fixing the simple problem and send away a happy customer. They won’t
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02-23-21, 12:48 PM
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remove the wheel, pull the brake lever gently a few times. this will push the pistons out a bit and they'll reset to that position when the lever is released. this is how the pistons self-adjust for pad wear. it's a tricky process that takes some trial and error. I've done this on various hydraulic brakes without issue and I don't see how it would be a problem with Shimano 105, although I might be missing something. the bike shop where OP picked up the bike should be able to perform this task in a few minutes, assuming the brakes don't have any sort of leaks and air in the system.
Also, I not familiar with the kind of gaps you're working with, but the gap on road brakes is already pretty slim (Froome made headlines for *****ing about it just the other week) so, if that reset method does work, that'd make the system way more prone to rotor rub, squealing, etc. ...and they're already prone to rotor rub and squealing, etc.
02-23-21, 01:02 PM
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Have to agree with you, dunces and snowflakes is quite accurate. Where are the rides populated by the competent? Those are distant memories.
Again, were it so simple as bikeforums would have it, the shop should spend one or two minutes fixing the simple problem and send away a happy customer. They won’t
Again, were it so simple as bikeforums would have it, the shop should spend one or two minutes fixing the simple problem and send away a happy customer. They won’t
02-23-21, 01:22 PM
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This isn't quite making sense to me. If this process will effectively re-set the reset position, as opposed to the piston retracting a specific distance from its furthest position (during hard braking), why would you need to remove the wheel at all and what would prevent the pistons from inevitably resetting right on top of the rotors after any tentative lever squeezes?
Also, I not familiar with the kind of gaps you're working with, but the gap on road brakes is already pretty slim (Froome made headlines for *****ing about it just the other week) so, if that reset method does work, that'd make the system way more prone to rotor rub, squealing, etc. ...and they're already prone to rotor rub and squealing, etc.
Also, I not familiar with the kind of gaps you're working with, but the gap on road brakes is already pretty slim (Froome made headlines for *****ing about it just the other week) so, if that reset method does work, that'd make the system way more prone to rotor rub, squealing, etc. ...and they're already prone to rotor rub and squealing, etc.
this has always worked for me in a pinch on Shimano, Tektro, SRAM, Avid (old SRAM!), and Magura brakes. There might be some reason why it would not work on the brakes in question. it's a bit of a kludge but it should safely make the bike rideable for someone who wants a tighter bite point instead of the standard one that works for most people.
I've used TRP Hylex brakes before and never had problems with rubbing, sponginess, or excessive brake lever throw. I bled them once and they were always fine. all of my other hydraulic brake experiences have been on mountain bikes. it sounds like the bike shop should have tried something after they assembled the bike in question, or the rider needs to get used to how brakes are designed to feel.
02-23-21, 01:41 PM
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sorry, I was not clear because I thought it would be obvious. you remove the wheel so that the rotor is not in the way of allowing the pads to move past the default extension. if the rotor is in there, the pads will hit it, stop the pistons from moving any further, and allowing them to retract all the way back in. removing the rotor from between the pads and gently, carefully pushing the pistons in by an extra hair's width of extension sets the retract point a little closer. you're "tricking" the system into making the bite point closer.
this has always worked for me in a pinch on Shimano, Tektro, SRAM, Avid (old SRAM!), and Magura brakes. There might be some reason why it would not work on the brakes in question. it's a bit of a kludge but it should safely make the bike rideable for someone who wants a tighter bite point instead of the standard one that works for most people.
I've used TRP Hylex brakes before and never had problems with rubbing, sponginess, or excessive brake lever throw. I bled them once and they were always fine. all of my other hydraulic brake experiences have been on mountain bikes. it sounds like the bike shop should have tried something after they assembled the bike in question, or the rider needs to get used to how brakes are designed to feel.
this has always worked for me in a pinch on Shimano, Tektro, SRAM, Avid (old SRAM!), and Magura brakes. There might be some reason why it would not work on the brakes in question. it's a bit of a kludge but it should safely make the bike rideable for someone who wants a tighter bite point instead of the standard one that works for most people.
I've used TRP Hylex brakes before and never had problems with rubbing, sponginess, or excessive brake lever throw. I bled them once and they were always fine. all of my other hydraulic brake experiences have been on mountain bikes. it sounds like the bike shop should have tried something after they assembled the bike in question, or the rider needs to get used to how brakes are designed to feel.
Speaking of the Hylex, I've got this irrational desire to build a light, SS, disc brake bike and was looking at them not long ago... What kind of build did you do with them?
02-23-21, 03:40 PM
#83
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In my corner of the world there are no mountains. Almost no hills. There are mountain bikes but mountain biking requires driving somewhere and usually somewhere quite distant. So the commenters speaking of how they have been on discs for ten years does not apply locally. Discs appeared in sufficient numbers you might notice probably in 2017. Not until 2019 were they so common every mechanic should have known. 2020 kind of disappeared. There are still plenty who are way behind the mark and constant stories of endless trips to LBS hoping the brakes will finally get fixed. Above there is a suggestion to lift front wheel in air and squeeze the levers repetitively. I have tried that, just because it seemed like common sense and worth trying. The onlookers all panicked. It was like I had attacked the bike with a sawzall.
Everyone here knows everything. How many well maintained mechanically sound bikes do you ever see? Not counting your own of course. I see very few. There are lots who keep the bike spotless. Mechanically most are disasters. Including the ones that just came back from LBS repairs. Again, there are no mountains here. Bikes with marginally useful brakes are very common and it is possible to get by with ineffective brakes a long time.
02-23-21, 04:09 PM
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In best case the flat does get repaired. When the wheel goes back in the brake screams. Screams loud enough no one would ride it. Do not underestimate the number of bike owners who will look at a through axle and have no clue how the thing comes off. Or who will not trust it is secure after replacing. Same as most never learned that a quick release operates on a cam and is not a wingnut.
In my corner of the world there are no mountains. Almost no hills. There are mountain bikes but mountain biking requires driving somewhere and usually somewhere quite distant. So the commenters speaking of how they have been on discs for ten years does not apply locally. Discs appeared in sufficient numbers you might notice probably in 2017. Not until 2019 were they so common every mechanic should have known. 2020 kind of disappeared. There are still plenty who are way behind the mark and constant stories of endless trips to LBS hoping the brakes will finally get fixed. Above there is a suggestion to lift front wheel in air and squeeze the levers repetitively. I have tried that, just because it seemed like common sense and worth trying. The onlookers all panicked. It was like I had attacked the bike with a sawzall.
Everyone here knows everything. How many well maintained mechanically sound bikes do you ever see? Not counting your own of course. I see very few. There are lots who keep the bike spotless. Mechanically most are disasters. Including the ones that just came back from LBS repairs. Again, there are no mountains here. Bikes with marginally useful brakes are very common and it is possible to get by with ineffective brakes a long time.
In my corner of the world there are no mountains. Almost no hills. There are mountain bikes but mountain biking requires driving somewhere and usually somewhere quite distant. So the commenters speaking of how they have been on discs for ten years does not apply locally. Discs appeared in sufficient numbers you might notice probably in 2017. Not until 2019 were they so common every mechanic should have known. 2020 kind of disappeared. There are still plenty who are way behind the mark and constant stories of endless trips to LBS hoping the brakes will finally get fixed. Above there is a suggestion to lift front wheel in air and squeeze the levers repetitively. I have tried that, just because it seemed like common sense and worth trying. The onlookers all panicked. It was like I had attacked the bike with a sawzall.
Everyone here knows everything. How many well maintained mechanically sound bikes do you ever see? Not counting your own of course. I see very few. There are lots who keep the bike spotless. Mechanically most are disasters. Including the ones that just came back from LBS repairs. Again, there are no mountains here. Bikes with marginally useful brakes are very common and it is possible to get by with ineffective brakes a long time.
02-23-21, 04:11 PM
#85
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In best case the flat does get repaired. When the wheel goes back in the brake screams. Screams loud enough no one would ride it. Do not underestimate the number of bike owners who will look at a through axle and have no clue how the thing comes off. Or who will not trust it is secure after replacing. Same as most never learned that a quick release operates on a cam and is not a wingnut.
In my corner of the world there are no mountains. Almost no hills. There are mountain bikes but mountain biking requires driving somewhere and usually somewhere quite distant. So the commenters speaking of how they have been on discs for ten years does not apply locally. Discs appeared in sufficient numbers you might notice probably in 2017. Not until 2019 were they so common every mechanic should have known. 2020 kind of disappeared. There are still plenty who are way behind the mark and constant stories of endless trips to LBS hoping the brakes will finally get fixed. Above there is a suggestion to lift front wheel in air and squeeze the levers repetitively. I have tried that, just because it seemed like common sense and worth trying. The onlookers all panicked. It was like I had attacked the bike with a sawzall.
Everyone here knows everything. How many well maintained mechanically sound bikes do you ever see? Not counting your own of course. I see very few. There are lots who keep the bike spotless. Mechanically most are disasters. Including the ones that just came back from LBS repairs. Again, there are no mountains here. Bikes with marginally useful brakes are very common and it is possible to get by with ineffective brakes a long time.
In my corner of the world there are no mountains. Almost no hills. There are mountain bikes but mountain biking requires driving somewhere and usually somewhere quite distant. So the commenters speaking of how they have been on discs for ten years does not apply locally. Discs appeared in sufficient numbers you might notice probably in 2017. Not until 2019 were they so common every mechanic should have known. 2020 kind of disappeared. There are still plenty who are way behind the mark and constant stories of endless trips to LBS hoping the brakes will finally get fixed. Above there is a suggestion to lift front wheel in air and squeeze the levers repetitively. I have tried that, just because it seemed like common sense and worth trying. The onlookers all panicked. It was like I had attacked the bike with a sawzall.
Everyone here knows everything. How many well maintained mechanically sound bikes do you ever see? Not counting your own of course. I see very few. There are lots who keep the bike spotless. Mechanically most are disasters. Including the ones that just came back from LBS repairs. Again, there are no mountains here. Bikes with marginally useful brakes are very common and it is possible to get by with ineffective brakes a long time.
Removing and replacing a wheel does not cause disc brakes to squeal. And even if it did, it would not prevent anyone from fixing the flat tire.
Claiming that "employed mechanics" can't figure out how to deal with thru-axles is a hoot. Anyone with two eyes and an IQ above 70 could figure out how to do it with zero previous experience. Your riding buddies must really be something.
The rest of your post has nothing to do with your original claim...Rather, you're just trying to criticize disc brakes, even though you and your friends apparently don't understand them at all.
You could just admit that you were talking out of your hat...That would be less embarrassing than your most recent post.
02-23-21, 05:35 PM
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In best case the flat does get repaired. When the wheel goes back in the brake screams. Screams loud enough no one would ride it. Do not underestimate the number of bike owners who will look at a through axle and have no clue how the thing comes off. Or who will not trust it is secure after replacing. Same as most never learned that a quick release operates on a cam and is not a wingnut.
You ride with people who never figured out how a QR works and now they don’t know how a TA (which is even simpler) works.
So they could not change a flat before, and now they still can’t.
02-23-21, 05:49 PM
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The reason I prefer instant engagement is because I use the same technique for driving/motorbiking that I do for riding bicycles. I set my corner entry speed by getting the majority of my braking done while upright, then trail the brakes as I enter the corner. I'm assuming cyclists -on average- brake more conservatively by ramping up brake force to apex; I could be wrong, but it seems like cyclists don't mind the excessive lever travel because of this style of braking.
02-23-21, 06:05 PM
#88
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What a total non-answer. Absolute nonsense.
Removing and replacing a wheel does not cause disc brakes to squeal. And even if it did, it would not prevent anyone from fixing the flat tire.
Claiming that "employed mechanics" can't figure out how to deal with thru-axles is a hoot. Anyone with two eyes and an IQ above 70 could figure out how to do it with zero previous experience. Your riding buddies must really be something.
The rest of your post has nothing to do with your original claim...Rather, you're just trying to criticize disc brakes, even though you and your friends apparently don't understand them at all.
You could just admit that you were talking out of your hat...That would be less embarrassing than your most recent post.
Removing and replacing a wheel does not cause disc brakes to squeal. And even if it did, it would not prevent anyone from fixing the flat tire.
Claiming that "employed mechanics" can't figure out how to deal with thru-axles is a hoot. Anyone with two eyes and an IQ above 70 could figure out how to do it with zero previous experience. Your riding buddies must really be something.
The rest of your post has nothing to do with your original claim...Rather, you're just trying to criticize disc brakes, even though you and your friends apparently don't understand them at all.
You could just admit that you were talking out of your hat...That would be less embarrassing than your most recent post.
If you think average riders know how to fix bikes or that bike shops always know what they are doing ——
I have not attacked discs. Keep making up more.
02-23-21, 06:10 PM
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In best case the flat does get repaired. When the wheel goes back in the brake screams. Screams loud enough no one would ride it. Do not underestimate the number of bike owners who will look at a through axle and have no clue how the thing comes off. Or who will not trust it is secure after replacing. Same as most never learned that a quick release operates on a cam and is not a wingnut.
In my corner of the world there are no mountains. Almost no hills. There are mountain bikes but mountain biking requires driving somewhere and usually somewhere quite distant. So the commenters speaking of how they have been on discs for ten years does not apply locally. Discs appeared in sufficient numbers you might notice probably in 2017. Not until 2019 were they so common every mechanic should have known. 2020 kind of disappeared. There are still plenty who are way behind the mark and constant stories of endless trips to LBS hoping the brakes will finally get fixed. Above there is a suggestion to lift front wheel in air and squeeze the levers repetitively. I have tried that, just because it seemed like common sense and worth trying. The onlookers all panicked. It was like I had attacked the bike with a sawzall.
Everyone here knows everything. How many well maintained mechanically sound bikes do you ever see? Not counting your own of course. I see very few. There are lots who keep the bike spotless. Mechanically most are disasters. Including the ones that just came back from LBS repairs. Again, there are no mountains here. Bikes with marginally useful brakes are very common and it is possible to get by with ineffective brakes a long time.
In my corner of the world there are no mountains. Almost no hills. There are mountain bikes but mountain biking requires driving somewhere and usually somewhere quite distant. So the commenters speaking of how they have been on discs for ten years does not apply locally. Discs appeared in sufficient numbers you might notice probably in 2017. Not until 2019 were they so common every mechanic should have known. 2020 kind of disappeared. There are still plenty who are way behind the mark and constant stories of endless trips to LBS hoping the brakes will finally get fixed. Above there is a suggestion to lift front wheel in air and squeeze the levers repetitively. I have tried that, just because it seemed like common sense and worth trying. The onlookers all panicked. It was like I had attacked the bike with a sawzall.
Everyone here knows everything. How many well maintained mechanically sound bikes do you ever see? Not counting your own of course. I see very few. There are lots who keep the bike spotless. Mechanically most are disasters. Including the ones that just came back from LBS repairs. Again, there are no mountains here. Bikes with marginally useful brakes are very common and it is possible to get by with ineffective brakes a long time.
02-23-21, 09:04 PM
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holy cannoli! thru axles are difficult? how freaking hard can loosening and tightening a damn bolt be? what planet are these people from that they can't figure that out instantly by just looking at it? I suggest they are more intuitive than a QR lever. many people use those like a wing nut, which is not very secure, or they never tighten them enough. at least a thru axle just just a bolt that you tighten just like every other inclined plane wrapped around a cylinder that's humans have used to hold things together for centuries.
02-23-21, 11:03 PM
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Congratulations, you have identified the most incompetent bike mechanics and shop owners on the planet. As a public service, you probably should list the shops(s) they are associated with so everyone on the forum can steer clear.
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03-01-21, 12:57 PM
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I'd find another shop to use. That Trek dealer sounds sub standard. Any competent bike mechanic can set up a bike and deal with the brakes properly. If you're going to pay for service, find a shop that's worth what you're paying. Not properly setting up brakes as part of a new bike assembly/set up sounds crazy to me.
It took me 3 tries to find a shop I was comfortable with. And they were all owned by the same local company. Just different personalities.
Finding a new shop isn’t easy. But I think it worth the effort here.
03-01-21, 02:55 PM
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Did you buy the bike from an authorized Trek dealer new? If so, you should have a look over of your warranty and contact Trek. https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/warranty_policy/
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03-01-21, 03:28 PM
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I recently acquired a brand new 2021 Trek Emonda. I noticed that the lever pulls nearly all the way to the handlebar before the brake is fully engaged. It also has brake rub on the front wheel. I have not rode the bike yet. I feared that brakes needed bleeding. The service advisor told me this is how the brakes come from the factory and that it's normal, especially considering that it's using short-reach levers (size 52 frame). I just did a brake bleed, although I am unsure if I did it correctly. After bleeding the brakes and buttoning everything back together, the lever still has the same pull-stroke and brake rub. I will test the bike on the road tomorrow to bed the brakes in. I just wanted to know if this is par for course with disc brake bikes.
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03-01-21, 03:30 PM
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Shimano 105 hydraulic
I did take it back. They told me they would have to charge me ($60). I accepted. They are flooded with business so they didn't get to my bike in time. I took the bike home to do the brakes myself because they didn't seem to care for my small-fry business.
I did take it back. They told me they would have to charge me ($60). I accepted. They are flooded with business so they didn't get to my bike in time. I took the bike home to do the brakes myself because they didn't seem to care for my small-fry business.
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03-05-21, 10:01 PM
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Next disc brake question:
What brake pad(s) have better initial bite and resistance to brake fade than the Shimano LC04 pad? I have been able to put in more miles recently. I did a ~20 mile ride that had a 5-7% avg grade. I was able to descend pretty quickly, but I was caught off-guard the first time I engaged the brake firmly and for an extended period. I felt the pads reach their maximum friction, trail off a bit, then maintain the lowered friction coefficient. Does a company like SwissStop produce a better pad with more power and resistance to fade?
What brake pad(s) have better initial bite and resistance to brake fade than the Shimano LC04 pad? I have been able to put in more miles recently. I did a ~20 mile ride that had a 5-7% avg grade. I was able to descend pretty quickly, but I was caught off-guard the first time I engaged the brake firmly and for an extended period. I felt the pads reach their maximum friction, trail off a bit, then maintain the lowered friction coefficient. Does a company like SwissStop produce a better pad with more power and resistance to fade?
03-05-21, 10:38 PM
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Next disc brake question:
What brake pad(s) have better initial bite and resistance to brake fade than the Shimano LC04 pad? I have been able to put in more miles recently. I did a ~20 mile ride that had a 5-7% avg grade. I was able to descend pretty quickly, but I was caught off-guard the first time I engaged the brake firmly and for an extended period. I felt the pads reach their maximum friction, trail off a bit, then maintain the lowered friction coefficient. Does a company like SwissStop produce a better pad with more power and resistance to fade?
What brake pad(s) have better initial bite and resistance to brake fade than the Shimano LC04 pad? I have been able to put in more miles recently. I did a ~20 mile ride that had a 5-7% avg grade. I was able to descend pretty quickly, but I was caught off-guard the first time I engaged the brake firmly and for an extended period. I felt the pads reach their maximum friction, trail off a bit, then maintain the lowered friction coefficient. Does a company like SwissStop produce a better pad with more power and resistance to fade?
03-05-21, 11:31 PM
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I can live with the performance of the pads. I just wouldn't mind a higher performing one.