Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

For Want Of A Nail....

Search
Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

For Want Of A Nail....

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 10-06-21, 03:29 PM
  #1  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Thread Starter
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,960

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10424 Post(s)
Liked 11,895 Times in 6,093 Posts
For Want Of A Nail....

I recently acquired a 1985 Centurion Ironman in really good condition, but of course I stripped it down, cleaned it and am putting it back together - original stem and bars is one thing. Original grease in the BB and headset is something else entirely. It came with what I assume was the original front reflector, which puzzled me because it had none of the other reflectors. This one was one of those that fits into the headset under the locking nut.

It turns out, that is exactly why it was there. Without it, the lock nut bottoms out on the top of the steerer before contacting the top cup, so it doesn't lock up anything. "Oh, well," I thought, "I'll just run out to a bike store and pick up a spacer to replace it."

Yeah, right.

I'd figured any shop that's been in business more than 10 years would have a bunch of these. Turns out, not so much. So I turned to Ebay, where I discovered you could either buy a pack of 10 of them, or buy a single one from Europe and pay exorbitant shipping and wait a few weeks. So I ordered a 10 pack, and meanwhile used a hacksaw to cut the reflector mount down to a 3/4 circle I could use as a spacer in the meanwhile to complete the build, pending the arrival of the spacer I needed and 9 more that I don't.

So, first, where did all the spacers go? And second, have you ever been stymied by the inability to find what SHOULD BE a common-as-dirt part that EVERYONE used to have?
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is online now  
Likes For genejockey:
Old 10-06-21, 03:42 PM
  #2  
mprince
Dont fix whats not broken
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Mooresville, NC
Posts: 302

Bikes: Steelman Stage Race, Dura-Ace 9s

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked 166 Times in 93 Posts
I probably have a couple in my toolbox...
mprince is offline  
Old 10-06-21, 03:52 PM
  #3  
ThermionicScott 
working on my sandal tan
 
ThermionicScott's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: CID
Posts: 22,629

Bikes: 1991 Bianchi Eros, 1964 Armstrong, 1988 Diamondback Ascent, 1988 Bianchi Premio, 1987 Bianchi Sport SX, 1980s Raleigh mixte (hers), All-City Space Horse (hers)

Mentioned: 98 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3871 Post(s)
Liked 2,568 Times in 1,579 Posts
Originally Posted by mprince
I probably have a couple in my toolbox...
Pretty sure I do, too. Shoulda put out an ISO!

Incidentally, when the oddball headset on my Diamondback started having trouble staying in adjustment, I added a reflector bracket. With that, I had a visual indication whether the stack of headset nuts had loosened, and a convenient way to swat it tighter for the time being. (Now that I've ground down a headset wrench to 33mm, I can finally adjust it properly and the reflector bracket is now superfluous again.)
__________________
Originally Posted by chandltp
There's no such thing as too far.. just lack of time
Originally Posted by noglider
People in this forum are not typical.
RUSA #7498
ThermionicScott is offline  
Old 10-06-21, 03:52 PM
  #4  
noobinsf 
Senior Member
 
noobinsf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Oakland, CA
Posts: 3,265

Bikes: '82 Univega Competizione, '72 Motobecane Grand Record, '83 Mercian KOM Touring, '85 Univega Alpina Uno, '76 Eisentraut Limited

Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1088 Post(s)
Liked 1,205 Times in 701 Posts
Originally Posted by genejockey
So, first, where did all the spacers go? And second, have you ever been stymied by the inability to find what SHOULD BE a common-as-dirt part that EVERYONE used to have?
Third, if you are interested in selling a couple to offset your cost, I'm in. The stock headset on my Mercian bottoms out without a spacer, and while this was initially fine because I planned to use centerpull brakes, I have since changed plans to sidepulls, so I will deal with the same predicament in the very near future once I start assembling.

Send me a PM if having nine spares seems like too many for you...

Last edited by noobinsf; 10-06-21 at 03:57 PM.
noobinsf is offline  
Likes For noobinsf:
Old 10-06-21, 06:00 PM
  #5  
3speedslow
Senior Member
 
3speedslow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Jacksonville, NC
Posts: 9,338

Bikes: A few

Mentioned: 117 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1942 Post(s)
Liked 1,073 Times in 637 Posts
It does boggle the mind when you think a part should be a “sure thing” find. I have two bike shops in my town. One looks at me confused when i don’t want the latest and greatest thing...

The other one has a bone yard of parts decades old. Guess which one I hang out in!
3speedslow is offline  
Likes For 3speedslow:
Old 10-06-21, 06:07 PM
  #6  
Feldman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,177
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Liked 71 Times in 51 Posts
Wheels Mfg sells 1" spacers from 2.5 to 40mm, black or silver, US made.
Feldman is offline  
Old 10-06-21, 06:15 PM
  #7  
mprince
Dont fix whats not broken
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Mooresville, NC
Posts: 302

Bikes: Steelman Stage Race, Dura-Ace 9s

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked 166 Times in 93 Posts
Originally Posted by Feldman
Wheels Mfg sells 1" spacers from 2.5 to 40mm, black or silver, US made.
Those likely are for threadless, for a conventional headset the washer needs to be keyed to fit into the slot milled into the threaded steerer tube.
mprince is offline  
Likes For mprince:
Old 10-06-21, 06:15 PM
  #8  
52telecaster
ambulatory senior
 
52telecaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 5,998

Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.

Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1955 Post(s)
Liked 3,661 Times in 1,679 Posts
I've cut down so many of those spacers. The reflector brackets that are also cable hangers usually get modified by me too.
52telecaster is offline  
Old 10-06-21, 11:25 PM
  #9  
canklecat
Me duelen las nalgas
 
canklecat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Texas
Posts: 13,513

Bikes: Centurion Ironman, Trek 5900, Univega Via Carisma, Globe Carmel

Mentioned: 199 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4559 Post(s)
Liked 2,802 Times in 1,800 Posts
Yup, before the original Nashbar was sold out I bought an old style keyed spacer and, for bikes with cantilever brakes, a cable hanger that doubled as a keyed spacer.

Centurion may have changed that design later. My 1989 Ironman and early 1990s Univega came without the reflector mounts. On the Univega the reflector mounts also doubled as emergency catchers in case a straddle cable broke -- extremely unlikely considering how thick those cables are, so I never bothered replacing the cable catchers. Either those bikes didn't need the keyed spacer, or whoever removed the reflector mounts replaced them with their own keyed spacers which were probably readily available back then.
canklecat is offline  
Old 10-07-21, 12:47 AM
  #10  
Dfrost 
Senior Member
 
Dfrost's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 1,989

Bikes: ‘87 Marinoni SLX Sports Tourer, ‘79 Miyata 912 by Gugificazione

Mentioned: 166 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 500 Post(s)
Liked 466 Times in 256 Posts
Originally Posted by mprince
Those likely are for threadless, for a conventional headset the washer needs to be keyed to fit into the slot milled into the threaded steerer tube.
A keyed washer is nice, but certainly not required. And then there’s my headset that doesn’t have room for any washer. Been working fine for thousands of miles. @gugie added the integral cable housing stop to one of his clever decaleurs to work with the brazed-post center pulls added during Gugificazione!


Last edited by Dfrost; 10-07-21 at 12:57 AM.
Dfrost is offline  
Old 10-07-21, 02:06 AM
  #11  
dedhed
SE Wis
 
dedhed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 10,509

Bikes: '68 Raleigh Sprite, '02 Raleigh C500, '84 Raleigh Gran Prix, '91 Trek 400, 2013 Novara Randonee, 1990 Trek 970

Mentioned: 40 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2746 Post(s)
Liked 3,390 Times in 2,053 Posts
Originally Posted by mprince
Those likely are for threadless, for a conventional headset the washer needs to be keyed to fit into the slot milled into the threaded steerer tube.
The spacer does not need to be keyed, just the right diameter.
dedhed is offline  
Likes For dedhed:
Old 10-07-21, 04:04 AM
  #12  
Prowler 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Near Pottstown, PA: 30 miles NW of Philadelphia
Posts: 2,186

Bikes: 2 Trek Mtn, Cannondale R600 road, 6 vintage road bikes

Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 472 Post(s)
Liked 1,028 Times in 404 Posts
Originally Posted by dedhed
The spacer does not need to be keyed, just the right diameter.
I'll submit that a spacer without the bitty key are better even. I've seen plenty of those key nubs turned and ground away, which makes life harder and damages the steerer tube. I've filed them off when in doubt. I believe the key's interface was only a manufacturing convenience. File the key off the spacer, put it all together and use two wrenches properly.
Prowler is offline  
Old 10-07-21, 05:03 AM
  #13  
SurferRosa
señor miembro
 
SurferRosa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Pac NW
Posts: 6,623

Bikes: '70s - '80s Campagnolo

Mentioned: 92 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3886 Post(s)
Liked 6,480 Times in 3,206 Posts
Originally Posted by genejockey
... meanwhile used a hacksaw to cut the reflector mount down.
Use it to cut the steerer, and you wouldn't need a spacer!

Seriously, there's not a bike shop in all of San Francisco that has a conventional (aluminum!!) HS spacer for free???
SurferRosa is offline  
Old 10-07-21, 06:24 AM
  #14  
repechage
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 20,305
Mentioned: 130 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3464 Post(s)
Liked 2,829 Times in 1,995 Posts
Originally Posted by SurferRosa
Use it to cut the steerer, and you wouldn't need a spacer!

Seriously, there's not a bike shop in all of San Francisco that has a conventional (aluminum!!) HS spacer for free???
not for free
i would have gone to American Cyclery
they were on Fremont, closed during an earthquake retrofit but last I read were back up snd running.

the typical reflector brackets were to withstand a 50 lb load without bending. Usually just above 1mm thick, so depending you might need one or two washers.
repechage is offline  
Old 10-07-21, 06:26 AM
  #15  
repechage
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 20,305
Mentioned: 130 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3464 Post(s)
Liked 2,829 Times in 1,995 Posts
Now 756 Stanyan street
repechage is offline  
Old 10-07-21, 08:08 AM
  #16  
mstateglfr 
Sunshine
 
mstateglfr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 16,612

Bikes: '18 class built steel roadbike, '19 Fairlight Secan, '88 Schwinn Premis , Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara Trionfo

Mentioned: 123 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10955 Post(s)
Liked 7,484 Times in 4,186 Posts
SF area has to have plenty of bike collectives/co-ops. Anywhere that still deals with threaded headsets should have tons of spacers.
mstateglfr is online now  
Old 10-07-21, 08:42 AM
  #17  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Thread Starter
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,960

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10424 Post(s)
Liked 11,895 Times in 6,093 Posts
Originally Posted by SurferRosa
Use it to cut the steerer, and you wouldn't need a spacer!

Seriously, there's not a bike shop in all of San Francisco that has a conventional (aluminum!!) HS spacer for free???
San Mateo, actually. And what actually happened is that I called two places and got "Sorry!", and the third said, "Yes, we have them", but when I went there and asked back in the Service Department, the guy looked for a good 5 minutes without finding one.

So I decided that phoning was no good, and I'd have to actually physically go to every shop, if I wanted to find one. So I ordered the bag of 10 and broke out the hacksaw. Shakedown cruise should be tonight.
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is online now  
Old 10-07-21, 08:44 AM
  #18  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Thread Starter
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,960

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10424 Post(s)
Liked 11,895 Times in 6,093 Posts
Originally Posted by repechage
not for free
i would have gone to American Cyclery
they were on Fremont, closed during an earthquake retrofit but last I read were back up snd running.

the typical reflector brackets were to withstand a 50 lb load without bending. Usually just above 1mm thick, so depending you might need one or two washers.
It measured closer to 2mm.
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is online now  
Old 10-07-21, 08:46 AM
  #19  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Thread Starter
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,960

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10424 Post(s)
Liked 11,895 Times in 6,093 Posts
Originally Posted by mstateglfr
SF area has to have plenty of bike collectives/co-ops. Anywhere that still deals with threaded headsets should have tons of spacers.
SF is 20 miles away, plus you'd think the older bike shops on the Peninsula that do a lot of business servicing old bikes would have them. But you'd be mistaken. I was.
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is online now  
Old 10-07-21, 09:32 AM
  #20  
gugie 
Bike Butcher of Portland
 
gugie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 11,634

Bikes: It's complicated.

Mentioned: 1299 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4678 Post(s)
Liked 5,795 Times in 2,281 Posts
@genejockey,

Had I seen this earlier I would have PM'ed you and mailed you one. Sorry about that!
__________________
If someone tells you that you have enough bicycles and you don't need any more, stop talking to them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
gugie is offline  
Old 10-07-21, 10:10 AM
  #21  
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 24,784

Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.

Mentioned: 153 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3587 Post(s)
Liked 3,400 Times in 1,934 Posts
Originally Posted by mprince
Those likely are for threadless, for a conventional headset the washer needs to be keyed to fit into the slot milled into the threaded steerer tube.
They don't strictly need to be keyed; it just helps hold the adjustment while you tighten the locknut. With a non-keyed spacer, you can use one of your headset spanners to hold the adjustment while you tighten things down.
JohnDThompson is offline  
Old 10-07-21, 12:08 PM
  #22  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Thread Starter
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,960

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10424 Post(s)
Liked 11,895 Times in 6,093 Posts
Originally Posted by Prowler
I'll submit that a spacer without the bitty key are better even. I've seen plenty of those key nubs turned and ground away, which makes life harder and damages the steerer tube. I've filed them off when in doubt. I believe the key's interface was only a manufacturing convenience. File the key off the spacer, put it all together and use two wrenches properly.
Yes, I've seen that, where the key doesn't hold in the slot very well. Luckily it didn't ruin the threads, at least not so badly that the top cup wouldn't be removed and reinstalled.
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is online now  
Old 10-07-21, 12:11 PM
  #23  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Thread Starter
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,960

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10424 Post(s)
Liked 11,895 Times in 6,093 Posts
Originally Posted by gugie
@genejockey,

Had I seen this earlier I would have PM'ed you and mailed you one. Sorry about that!
'Sokay! When I posted this, I had ALREADY ordered the Bag-O'-Spacers and cut down the reflector. The bike's all put together now - put on the bar tape last night. Now the bike's in my trunk, and I'm impatiently awaiting the shakedown cruise I plan for after work!
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is online now  
Likes For genejockey:
Old 10-07-21, 01:00 PM
  #24  
Bianchigirll 
Bianchi Goddess
 
Bianchigirll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Shady Pines Retirement Fort Wayne, In
Posts: 27,858

Bikes: Too many to list here check my signature.

Mentioned: 192 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2930 Post(s)
Liked 2,923 Times in 1,491 Posts
Is it that they don't have the spacer or the employee just didn't understand what you were looking for because you had a threaded headset?

Working at a well known Boston shop around 1995 or so I saw an employee refuse to sell someone a freewheel for an older Fuji (something like an '85ish Team or Ravoli) but anyway the customer asked for a Suntour freewheel and since we didn't have any Suntour freewheels on the shelf this guy wouldn't sell him anything despite my repeatedly telling him a Sachs FW would work even better than the Suntour. He said NO since it had a Suntour RD it had to have a Suntour FW to shift properly. I think it has been down hill for shop service since that day.
__________________
One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"

Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
Bianchigirll is offline  
Likes For Bianchigirll:
Old 10-07-21, 02:24 PM
  #25  
SwimmerMike 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Saratoga, CA
Posts: 825

Bikes: 1981 Bianchi Specialissim, 1976 Colnago Super. 1971 Bob Jackson. 2012 Kestrel 4000. 2012 Willier. 2016 Fuji Cross 1.1

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked 952 Times in 389 Posts
@genejockey for anything vintage there's a really good chance that Cupertino Bike Shop would have it. If you go there for anything, W,TH, & Fr are the best days since Greg Davis, their Vintage Mechanic, works those days. On other days the knowledge of where the different vintage parts are located is a little more hit and miss.
SwimmerMike is offline  
Likes For SwimmerMike:


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.