Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Advocacy & Safety
Reload this Page >

Friend of A Friend Killed

Notices
Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

Friend of A Friend Killed

Old 07-13-22, 06:42 AM
  #1  
Paul Barnard
For The Fun of It
Thread Starter
 
Paul Barnard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Louisissippi Coast
Posts: 5,844

Bikes: Lynskey GR300, Lynskey Backroad, Litespeed T6, Lynskey MT29, Burley Duet

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2131 Post(s)
Liked 1,639 Times in 822 Posts
Friend of A Friend Killed

This was the second bicycle fatality in the Lincoln AL area in two weeks. I am trying to get details, but as you know, we rarely learn enough from these crashes to draw any lessons from them. I did google the road. It's an undivided 55 MPH 4 lane with intermittent shoulders that are in poor condition in most places and chip seal elsewhere.

https://www.cbs42.com/news/local/tal...struck-by-car/

While researching that one, I found this one.

https://www.wbrc.com/2021/07/02/linc...iding-bicycle/

Again, scant details, but I did come across something that is a peave of mine. The positioning of the rumble strips on this shoulder. If the strips were placed flush against the fog line that would leave a wide rideable portion of the shulder. As it stand the rideable part of the shoulder is so narrow that riders will have to focus pretty closely on not drifting off the shoulder or into the strips. That leaves them paying less attention to the big picture.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.6950...7i16384!8i8192
Paul Barnard is offline  
Likes For Paul Barnard:
Old 07-13-22, 07:47 AM
  #2  
fishboat
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 1,888

Bikes: Lemond '01 Maillot Jaune, Lemond '02 Victoire, Lemond '03 Poprad, Lemond '03 Wayzata DB conv(Poprad), '79 AcerMex Windsor Carrera Professional(pur new), '88 GT Tequesta(pur new), '01 Bianchi Grizzly, 1993 Trek 970 DB conv, Trek 8900 DB conv

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 750 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 799 Times in 467 Posts
Unfortunate, but it doesn't look like I road I would ride...basically have to ride in the road of a 55mph+ (most likely people are cruising 65mph) hwy with gravel shoulders.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5813...4!8i8192?hl=en
fishboat is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 07:55 AM
  #3  
Paul Barnard
For The Fun of It
Thread Starter
 
Paul Barnard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Louisissippi Coast
Posts: 5,844

Bikes: Lynskey GR300, Lynskey Backroad, Litespeed T6, Lynskey MT29, Burley Duet

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2131 Post(s)
Liked 1,639 Times in 822 Posts
Originally Posted by fishboat
Unfortunate, but it doesn't look like I road I would ride...basically have to ride in the road of a 55mph+ (most likely people are cruising 65mph) hwy with gravel shoulders.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5813...4!8i8192?hl=en

I would not feel comfortable on that road either. The shoulders look really rough. He was an avid cyclist. Who knows, he may have needed that road for a quick connector. I have to be on roads I don't love at times for short duration.
Paul Barnard is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 11:41 AM
  #4  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,240
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4221 Post(s)
Liked 1,321 Times in 916 Posts
Originally Posted by fishboat
Unfortunate, but it doesn't look like I road I would ride...basically have to ride in the road of a 55mph+ (most likely people are cruising 65mph) hwy with gravel shoulders.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5813...4!8i8192?hl=en
The shoulders aren't gravel (there couldn't be the rumble strips if it was gravel).
njkayaker is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 11:42 AM
  #5  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,240
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4221 Post(s)
Liked 1,321 Times in 916 Posts
Originally Posted by Paul Barnard
I would not feel comfortable on that road either. The shoulders look really rough.
Doesn't look very rough (outside of the rumble strip). It is a bit narrow.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.6947...7i16384!8i8192
njkayaker is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 12:22 PM
  #6  
Paul Barnard
For The Fun of It
Thread Starter
 
Paul Barnard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Louisissippi Coast
Posts: 5,844

Bikes: Lynskey GR300, Lynskey Backroad, Litespeed T6, Lynskey MT29, Burley Duet

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2131 Post(s)
Liked 1,639 Times in 822 Posts
Originally Posted by njkayaker
Doesn't look very rough (outside of the rumble strip). It is a bit narrow.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.6947...7i16384!8i8192
77 (the site of the second crash) looks good in the narrow space outside the rumble strips. My comment was about the shoulder on Speedway BLVD, the site of the second crash.
Paul Barnard is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 12:29 PM
  #7  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,240
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4221 Post(s)
Liked 1,321 Times in 916 Posts
Originally Posted by Paul Barnard
77 (the site of the second crash) looks good in the narrow space outside the rumble strips. My comment was about the shoulder on Speedway BLVD, the site of the second crash.
Some random sections of Speedway Blvd (the road in the first crash you mentioned).

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5801628,-86.0761416,3a,75y,222.75h,85.94t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sXWSB9nlEPwi2x73akxq_bQ!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DXWSB9nlEPwi2x73akxq_bQ%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.g ps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D303.6082%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en&authuser=0

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.579147,-86.0281473,3a,75y,219.01h,55.7t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1szfFMgu0d824f4t8HmOpJQQ!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DzfFMgu0d824f4t8HmOpJQQ%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.g ps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D334.95905%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en&authuser= 0


Looks OK (if not as smooth as the pavement). Not much different surface-wise from A77. It's not gravel, there are no rumble strips, and it's really wide.
njkayaker is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 12:42 PM
  #8  
fishboat
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 1,888

Bikes: Lemond '01 Maillot Jaune, Lemond '02 Victoire, Lemond '03 Poprad, Lemond '03 Wayzata DB conv(Poprad), '79 AcerMex Windsor Carrera Professional(pur new), '88 GT Tequesta(pur new), '01 Bianchi Grizzly, 1993 Trek 970 DB conv, Trek 8900 DB conv

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 750 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 799 Times in 467 Posts
Originally Posted by fishboat
Unfortunate, but it doesn't look like I road I would ride...basically have to ride in the road of a 55mph+ (most likely people are cruising 65mph) hwy with gravel shoulders.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5813...4!8i8192?hl=en
Originally Posted by njkayaker
The shoulders aren't gravel (there couldn't be the rumble strips if it was gravel).

...reading for comprehension.. per the CBS42 report(Op first link) the guy that was killed "was riding his bicycle in the 1000 block of Speedway Boulevard"

My link was 1122 Speedway Blvd. Your link was 3014 Speedway Blvd. The OP also posted a second incident in a different location that apparently had rumble strips of some sort. You tend to keep lots of folks "honest" here, however if you're going to do that you need to avoid shooting from the hip.
fishboat is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 12:57 PM
  #9  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,240
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4221 Post(s)
Liked 1,321 Times in 916 Posts
Originally Posted by fishboat
...reading for comprehension.. per the CBS42 report(Op first link) the guy that was killed "was riding his bicycle in the 1000 block of Speedway Boulevard"

My link was 1122 Speedway Blvd. Your link was 3014 Speedway Blvd. The OP also posted a second incident in a different location that apparently had rumble strips of some sort. You tend to keep lots of folks "honest" here, however if you're going to do that you need to avoid shooting from the hip.


The OP should have provided the link.

Your link seems a bit rougher but it doesn't look like gravel to me (and there are no rumble strips and it's wide).

Your link also shows two lanes in both directions and it appears to be a low traffic road with good sight-lines.

It was 8am. Was the cyclist going eastbound or westbound?

==============

Paved (but rough).

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5812791,-86.1084539,3a,75y,324.05h,79.06t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1suX-hA-OCwbGzZSYk6Zgsqw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.581252,-86.1162688,3a,75y,228.37h,81.86t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s7ouoRkLBPqbD_zNeaddzwQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en


Here's an intersection where the shoulder is gravel.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5813...4!8i8192?hl=en

Last edited by njkayaker; 07-13-22 at 01:08 PM.
njkayaker is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 01:09 PM
  #10  
fishboat
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 1,888

Bikes: Lemond '01 Maillot Jaune, Lemond '02 Victoire, Lemond '03 Poprad, Lemond '03 Wayzata DB conv(Poprad), '79 AcerMex Windsor Carrera Professional(pur new), '88 GT Tequesta(pur new), '01 Bianchi Grizzly, 1993 Trek 970 DB conv, Trek 8900 DB conv

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 750 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 799 Times in 467 Posts
Originally Posted by Paul Barnard
This was the second bicycle fatality in the Lincoln AL area in two weeks. I am trying to get details, but as you know, we rarely learn enough from these crashes to draw any lessons from them. I did google the road. It's an undivided 55 MPH 4 lane with intermittent shoulders that are in poor condition in most places and chip seal elsewhere.
Originally Posted by njkayaker


Your link seems a bit rougher but it doesn't look like gravel to me (and there are no rumble strips and it's wide).

Your link also shows two lanes in both directions and it appears to be a low traffic road with good sight-lines.
I'm done..you'll have to figure it out from here.
fishboat is offline  
Likes For fishboat:
Old 07-13-22, 01:11 PM
  #11  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,240
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4221 Post(s)
Liked 1,321 Times in 916 Posts
Originally Posted by fishboat
I'm done..you'll have to figure it out from here.
It's also not likely they would construct the road so differently in places that are so close.
njkayaker is offline  
Old 07-13-22, 03:33 PM
  #12  
Korina
Happy banana slug
 
Korina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Arcata, California, U.S., North America, Earth, Saggitarius Arm, Milky Way
Posts: 3,752

Bikes: 1984 Araya MB 261, 1992 Specialized Rockhopper Sport, 1993 Hard Rock Ultra, 1994 Trek Multitrack 750, 1995 Trek Singletrack 930

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1524 Post(s)
Liked 1,513 Times in 906 Posts
I'm so sorry for your friend's loss.

What I get from those two news stories is that the first car had no driver, and the second cyclist should have had a sturdier helmet? The press, man. ::shakes head in despair::

Rumble strips in the middle of the shoulder is the stupidest thing I've seen all week. Maybe get some folks together and (try to) get it fixed? Nah, me either.
Korina is offline  
Likes For Korina:
Old 07-14-22, 06:03 AM
  #13  
mr_bill
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 4,529
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2111 Post(s)
Liked 663 Times in 443 Posts
There are several Speedway Boulevards in the US. They are essentially driveways from interstate highway interchanges to NASCAR tracks. Like this one at Talladega Superspeedway.

Outside of race day, traffic is very very very light on such roads.

BTW, at 8:00AM, the sun *might* have been a factor from Route 77 to just past Alfred Road (~700 Speedway).

And on that brief stretch it pretty much doesn't matter if they were travelling ENE or WSW.
Travelling ENE, the driver may have difficulty seeing a person on a bike, but the person on the bike should be able to see the approaching car.
Travelling WSW, the driver should have no difficulty seeing a person on a bike, but the person on the bike might have trouble seeing the approaching car.

But in the 1000 block at 8:00AM? Nope.

p.s. It was cloudy.

Paul, take good care of yourself and your friend. You are part of a community of mourners right now.

-mr. bill
mr_bill is offline  
Old 07-14-22, 06:57 AM
  #14  
GhostRider62
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Posts: 4,083
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2332 Post(s)
Liked 2,094 Times in 1,311 Posts
I looked into rumble strip guidelines state by state since I hate those things. Alabama has the worst "rule".....they suggest 24 inches of shoulder and the rumble strip does not have to be placed at the flogline (white line); rather, it is suggested to provide 13 inches to the right of the rumble strip for cycling. If I am focused and fresh, 13 inches is almost enough but that is not much pavement. The TransAm route in Kansas has similar sections, except the speed limit is 70 mph and they go 80-90 mph.
GhostRider62 is offline  
Old 08-01-22, 03:32 PM
  #15  
JoeyBike
20+mph Commuter
 
JoeyBike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: New Orleans, LA USA
Posts: 7,491

Bikes: Surly LHT, Surly Lowside, a folding bike, and a beater.

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1422 Post(s)
Liked 315 Times in 210 Posts
[QUOTE=fishboat;22573090]Unfortunate, but it doesn't look like I road I would ride...

If I were on a cross-country bike tour I would ride that highway ONCE for sure. As a regular daily commute or workout route, I would avoid it.

Whatever road we choose, it just takes one dummy to put us in the hospital or the ground.

Sorry about your friend. That sucks.
JoeyBike is offline  
Old 08-02-22, 06:19 PM
  #16  
Gyro
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: lost
Posts: 538
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 128 Post(s)
Liked 98 Times in 49 Posts
Originally Posted by GhostRider62
I looked into rumble strip guidelines state by state since I hate those things. Alabama has the worst "rule".....they suggest 24 inches of shoulder and the rumble strip does not have to be placed at the flogline (white line); rather, it is suggested to provide 13 inches to the right of the rumble strip for cycling. If I am focused and fresh, 13 inches is almost enough but that is not much pavement. The TransAm route in Kansas has similar sections, except the speed limit is 70 mph and they go 80-90 mph.
Don't know the guideline in my state. The only rumble strip I've seen is almost on the flog line.
Gyro is offline  
Old 08-03-22, 04:38 AM
  #17  
GhostRider62
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Posts: 4,083
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2332 Post(s)
Liked 2,094 Times in 1,311 Posts
Originally Posted by Gyro
Don't know the guideline in my state. The only rumble strip I've seen is almost on the flog line.
Those indentations flog me too.
GhostRider62 is offline  
Old 08-09-22, 08:54 AM
  #18  
CheGiantForLife
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 287
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 526 Post(s)
Liked 72 Times in 41 Posts
Originally Posted by fishboat
Unfortunate, but it doesn't look like I road I would ride...basically have to ride in the road of a 55mph+ (most likely people are cruising 65mph) hwy with gravel shoulders.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5813...4!8i8192?hl=en
Agreed. It's reckless for a bike to drive on basically what is a highway.
I'd only ride the shoulder, and even then, not safe feeling to get passed by 65mph cars.
CheGiantForLife is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.