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Cyclocross and Gravelbiking (Recreational) This has to be the most physically intense sport ever invented. It's high speed bicycle racing on a short off road course or riding the off pavement rides on gravel like : "Unbound Gravel". We also have a dedicated Racing forum for the Cyclocross Hard Core Racers.

I don't get gravel bikes?

Old 08-23-21, 04:34 PM
  #76  
Metieval
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
I think endurance bikes came first, but they were fairly contemporaneous with gravel bikes. And endurance bikes have come to look a lot more like gravel bikes.
I think the new giant defy will fit up to a 35c.

For some that still ride mostly pavement, without all the bike attachments. Endurance bikes make sense.

Then again if I was mostly pavement I'd just ride on a gp5000 32c. But room for a reneherse bon jon isn't a bad thing either.
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Old 08-23-21, 04:39 PM
  #77  
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Let's muddy the waters some more.
The mfg ( DeVinci) calls the bike I bought last year - "Stellar Acera" - an XC- Sport model since it has XC-Sport geometry. No, I have no idea how that is defined.
But some would call it a Hard-tail MTB for the obvious reasons. 3x9 gear train, straight handlebar etc. I call it the perfect bike for all the riding I do. From pavement to gravel to a bit of single track.
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Old 08-23-21, 05:37 PM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by OldRailfan
Let's muddy the waters some more.
The mfg ( DeVinci) calls the bike I bought last year - "Stellar Acera" - an XC- Sport model since it has XC-Sport geometry. No, I have no idea how that is defined.
But some would call it a Hard-tail MTB for the obvious reasons. 3x9 gear train, straight handlebar etc. I call it the perfect bike for all the riding I do. From pavement to gravel to a bit of single track.
That looks like a fun bike! The stellar altus looks good too!
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Old 08-24-21, 08:53 PM
  #79  
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Gravel bike? Cyclocross bike? Vintage Mtn Bike?

Originally Posted by TheZip
What am I missing about riding drop bars on gravel? Is it just me or does it just seem like a novelty? It's like it's some new found invention to have clearance for wider tires with a bit of a knob on them... I have a road bike and then I have an older XC Mountain bike. The XC bike has nice knobby tires that rides great on rougher gravely roads and smaller diameter, more efficient tires are just a swap away if needed. It is a rigid frame, so it's very light. The handle bars are wider and more stable, and the gearing goes way lower if things become more of a slog fest. I just can't seem to see where a "gravel bike" would be advantageous.
Sort of agree. Same principal as with 27.5" and even 29". To sell more bikes. Suspect I could out-gravel "gravelers" with any moderately price cross bike or vintage mountain bike. Have held my own with these guys riding my old '86 Stump Jumper. And a lot more comfortable on that 35 yo Brooks Saddle . In the olden days did many gravel/dirt roads on a touring bike and sometimes on sewups, But if you want to spend your money... Keep in mind, this is just one opinion of one eccentric biker.
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Old 08-24-21, 09:37 PM
  #80  
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
I guess I'm missing something with smoked meat. Just never had the occasion to eat any
This is one of the most surprising statements I've seen on this forum! (unless, of course, you are vegetarian or vegan)
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Old 08-24-21, 09:43 PM
  #81  
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Originally Posted by sewupnut
Sort of agree. Same principal as with 27.5" and even 29". To sell more bikes. Suspect I could out-gravel "gravelers" with any moderately price cross bike or vintage mountain bike. Have held my own with these guys riding my old '86 Stump Jumper. And a lot more comfortable on that 35 yo Brooks Saddle . In the olden days did many gravel/dirt roads on a touring bike and sometimes on sewups, But if you want to spend your money... Keep in mind, this is just one opinion of one eccentric biker.
Sort of true. In some ways, gravel bikes aren't too different from first generation mountain bikes. But gravel bikes will almost surely be faster on pavement and random dirt roads. A gravel bike allows you to ride to trails, link trails, and pretty much ride on any surface in between. My typical gravel rides (I've only been doing it about 6 months) are about 25-30% pavement, 40-60% dirt fire roads (ranging from hard pack to loose sand to rutted), and the rest single-track or double-track trails that would be super-easy on a modern MTB but are nice and challenging on a gravel bike. On the road segments, I'm almost as fast as on my road bike.
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Old 08-25-21, 08:49 AM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by sewupnut
Sort of agree. Same principal as with 27.5" and even 29". To sell more bikes. Suspect I could out-gravel "gravelers" with any moderately price cross bike or vintage mountain bike. Have held my own with these guys riding my old '86 Stump Jumper. And a lot more comfortable on that 35 yo Brooks Saddle .
First off, 'gravelers' probably encompasses a very wide range of cyclists. Secondly, how does one 'out-gravel' gravelers?...do they ride faster?...or farther?...or both?...or smile more?
Congrats on out gravelling gravelers. <---I cant believe I managed to type that.

You being able to out gravel gravelers on a cross bike is hardly something to brag about(whether that means faster, farther, or both) since many moderately priced cross bikes can handle wide enough tires to make gravel riding a perfectly doable affair.
And if what you want is an old Stumpy for gravel riding- thats cool. Bragging about how you dont need what others enjoy is a really odd brag.



I would absolutely love to have this bike- its an iconic bike built by an iconic builder. But I look at it and have 0 interest in using it or something similar to ride gravel roads. I want a road bike with wider tires for that. I would take this Ritchey over a Penny-farthing for gravel riding, so I guess its all a matter of perspective.
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Old 08-25-21, 09:55 AM
  #83  
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I enjoy my n+1. Road, gravel, vintage, and Mtn all get miles.

This fall, my family is road tripping to the southeast for a 3 month contract. In this case, space is limited and there is no question which bike to bring. The gravel bike with a spare set of wheels.

The gravel bike can certainly handle the roads and paths in my new temporary city, is capable of exploring outside of town, can handle a lot of Mtn biking albeit with a bit more effort, I can commute on it depending upon secure storage at this job, and I can bring my trainer depending on how full the car is.

That’s a lot of use.

Currently it’s an adventure/epic ride bike only but I’m looking forward to the varied uses.
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Old 08-25-21, 11:26 AM
  #84  
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr
First off, 'gravelers' probably encompasses a very wide range of cyclists. Secondly, how does one 'out-gravel' gravelers?...do they ride faster?...or farther?...or both?...or smile more?
Congrats on out gravelling gravelers. <---I cant believe I managed to type that.

You being able to out gravel gravelers on a cross bike is hardly something to brag about(whether that means faster, farther, or both) since many moderately priced cross bikes can handle wide enough tires to make gravel riding a perfectly doable affair.
And if what you want is an old Stumpy for gravel riding- thats cool. Bragging about how you dont need what others enjoy is a really odd brag.



I would absolutely love to have this bike- its an iconic bike built by an iconic builder. But I look at it and have 0 interest in using it or something similar to ride gravel roads. I want a road bike with wider tires for that. I would take this Ritchey over a Penny-farthing for gravel riding, so I guess its all a matter of perspective.
Beautiful bike indeed. Not bragging about nuthin. Point is except perhaps for low pressure tubless tires and an over-priced single chain ring, I think a lot of us already have a more than adequate bike or two for riding on gravel.
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Old 08-25-21, 01:40 PM
  #85  
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To use a bit of a metaphor, I kinda see a gravel bike like a rally car…..

You can have a formula 1 car (or indie car, if you want to keep things more “stateside”). They’re way faster and most compatible with the road - road bike.

You can have a 4x4 Land Rover (or Jeep, etc). They’re capable of going places off-road that pretty much no other vehicles can - MTB.

A rally car. A car that was ultimately designed for road use & still quick on road, but can also go quick on off-road courses. But not quite as off-road as a jeep can.
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Old 08-25-21, 06:34 PM
  #86  
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Originally Posted by Simonix
I kinda see a gravel bike like a rally car
That’s as apt an analogy as I’ve seen.
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Old 08-25-21, 06:40 PM
  #87  
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Originally Posted by Simonix
To use a bit of a metaphor, I kinda see a gravel bike like a rally car…..

You can have a formula 1 car (or indie car, if you want to keep things more “stateside”). They’re way faster and most compatible with the road - road bike.

You can have a 4x4 Land Rover (or Jeep, etc). They’re capable of going places off-road that pretty much no other vehicles can - MTB.

A rally car. A car that was ultimately designed for road use & still quick on road, but can also go quick on off-road courses. But not quite as off-road as a jeep can.
Road bike = Ferrari
Mountain bike = 4X4 Truck
Gravel Bike = Subaru
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Old 08-25-21, 11:37 PM
  #88  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Road bike = Ferrari
Mountain bike = 4X4 Truck
Gravel Bike = Subaru
Yep.


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Old 09-01-21, 10:35 AM
  #89  
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Which bike would be best suited to tackle this?

chinogrinder.azgravelrides.com
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Old 09-01-21, 03:24 PM
  #90  
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Originally Posted by Gravel Rider
Which bike would be best suited to tackle this?

chinogrinder.azgravelrides.com
The Cervelo Aspero would be about right.
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Old 09-01-21, 06:21 PM
  #91  
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'gravel bikes are just road bikes that don't suck."

WELL SAID!
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Old 09-03-21, 06:47 AM
  #92  
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Originally Posted by dwmckee
'gravel bikes are just hybrids that don't suck."

WELL SAID!
Fify
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Old 09-09-21, 12:57 AM
  #93  
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When I was knee high to a grass hopper you had a bike, if your saw a bike race they had extremely focused Racing bikes, and a few boy racers would put drops on their normal bikes to give them the cool look…this was the 60/70’s, and like was simple… we only bought things in ones, wore then out then bought another…

Then in the 90’s, like everything else in life, the marketers convinced us all we needed specific bikes/motorcycles/car/boats for specific purposes…. They created things we didn’t even know we needed…

These specialized types of things were also more expensive… because.. well.. they were specialized.. So a manufacturer no longer had a kids bike, a normal bike and a heavy framed couriers bike.. he had six bikes… now he has 36 bikes..

..and “YOU SIR/MADAM” have four or five or six of these things in your garage…. Now the crazy thing is, before you had the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th & 6th… (for those that have more.. go look in the mirror and give yourself a slap..) you only had one you hardly had time to ride it… so not only have the marketers (and your mates) convinced you, you need more specialized bikes.. Someone has found the time for you to ride them!!!! Or more than likely you now ride all of them very infrequently!!

Now, gravel is kind of the weird one… it really is a road bike with slightly wider tires and slightly lower gears…and here’s the thing.. group sets that are slightly XT orientated (like Deore or Altus) yet the bike cost more than similar road bikes with a lower standard group set….. I smell a rat.. I do think the manufactures are taking the proverbial.. and a lot of people have been sucked in…

The other point I have issues with about “gravel” bikes is the gearing…. You have to be seriously fits to go off road up hills with a 25 GI granny gear, and many Gravel bikes are high 20’s or even low 30’s… seriously!!

For me the “Gravel bike has its place, with the granny in the low 20’s and call it a gravel packing bike, or adventure bike… a lightweight but capable light tourer.

Before all you gravel boys jump on me, I do add, I have absolutely nothing against the niche that is gravel…. I have something about the marketing guys dreaming up segments then filling it with new types of bikes to convince us we need to add to our stable.

And…. To add to my ‘add’ I have four bikes… but I only really bought 2, and it was 10 years apart and I live in in two different countries 3,231KM apart.! They are a road bike in KL (Giant TCR3) and a low geared hybrid in Taipei (Giant FCR)….. my daughter gave me a Canyon Urban that her boyfriend bought and didn’t want.. she thought of me because it was XL and I use XL t’shirt…. At 5’9” it’s a tad tall…. And I have a Bruno Tour 700, which is a Japanese retro classic bike that was just so pretty I bought it to put on the wall in my man cave!!!

Enjoy your gravel bikes, I may just turn my TCR into such a bike, a 44/30 crankset, Deore M6000 SG rear derailleur, and a 11-40 cassette, 700x28 tires, would give me a 20.07 GI… and cost me about $200-250… and my TCR would get more use I guess….. I'd only do tracks and light touring, no grass.. to old for that...
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Old 09-09-21, 05:25 AM
  #94  
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Originally Posted by deaninkl

Now, gravel is kind of the weird one… it really is a road bike with slightly wider tires and slightly lower gears…and here’s the thing.. group sets that are slightly XT orientated (like Deore or Altus) yet the bike cost more than similar road bikes with a lower standard group set….. I smell a rat.. I do think the manufactures are taking the proverbial.. and a lot of people have been sucked in…

..
Huh?

XT is on par with Ultegra.
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Old 09-09-21, 05:43 AM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by Kapusta
Huh?

XT is on par with Ultegra.
sorry I meant Mountain oriented not specifically the XT level gear… my point being, call a bike gravel an manufacturers add $500 to the price.. I’ve spent the last couple of months looking for one…. Only to find (ironically) few are available here in Taiwan… even Giant only sell the Revolt Advanced 0 and Advanced 2, where as in the UK there are 10 Revolt models…
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Old 09-09-21, 05:46 AM
  #96  
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Originally Posted by deaninkl
sorry I meant Mountain oriented not specifically the XT level gear… my point being, call a bike gravel an manufacturers add $500 to the price.. I’ve spent the last couple of months looking for one…. Only to find (ironically) few are available here in Taiwan… even Giant only sell the Revolt Advanced 0 and Advanced 2, where as in the UK there are 10 Revolt models…
Yes, make a more useful product that there is more demand than supply for, and you can get more money for it.

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Old 09-09-21, 06:41 AM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by deaninkl
When I was knee high to a grass hopper you had a bike, if your saw a bike race they had extremely focused Racing bikes, and a few boy racers would put drops on their normal bikes to give them the cool look…this was the 60/70’s, and like was simple… we only bought things in ones, wore then out then bought another…

Then in the 90’s, like everything else in life, the marketers convinced us all we needed specific bikes/motorcycles/car/boats for specific purposes…. They created things we didn’t even know we needed…

These specialized types of things were also more expensive… because.. well.. they were specialized.. So a manufacturer no longer had a kids bike, a normal bike and a heavy framed couriers bike.. he had six bikes… now he has 36 bikes..

..and “YOU SIR/MADAM” have four or five or six of these things in your garage…. Now the crazy thing is, before you had the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th & 6th… (for those that have more.. go look in the mirror and give yourself a slap..) you only had one you hardly had time to ride it… so not only have the marketers (and your mates) convinced you, you need more specialized bikes.. Someone has found the time for you to ride them!!!! Or more than likely you now ride all of them very infrequently!!

Now, gravel is kind of the weird one… it really is a road bike with slightly wider tires and slightly lower gears…and here’s the thing.. group sets that are slightly XT orientated (like Deore or Altus) yet the bike cost more than similar road bikes with a lower standard group set….. I smell a rat.. I do think the manufactures are taking the proverbial.. and a lot of people have been sucked in…

The other point I have issues with about “gravel” bikes is the gearing…. You have to be seriously fits to go off road up hills with a 25 GI granny gear, and many Gravel bikes are high 20’s or even low 30’s… seriously!!

For me the “Gravel bike has its place, with the granny in the low 20’s and call it a gravel packing bike, or adventure bike… a lightweight but capable light tourer.

Before all you gravel boys jump on me, I do add, I have absolutely nothing against the niche that is gravel…. I have something about the marketing guys dreaming up segments then filling it with new types of bikes to convince us we need to add to our stable.

And…. To add to my ‘add’ I have four bikes… but I only really bought 2, and it was 10 years apart and I live in in two different countries 3,231KM apart.! They are a road bike in KL (Giant TCR3) and a low geared hybrid in Taipei (Giant FCR)….. my daughter gave me a Canyon Urban that her boyfriend bought and didn’t want.. she thought of me because it was XL and I use XL t’shirt…. At 5’9” it’s a tad tall…. And I have a Bruno Tour 700, which is a Japanese retro classic bike that was just so pretty I bought it to put on the wall in my man cave!!!

Enjoy your gravel bikes, I may just turn my TCR into such a bike, a 44/30 crankset, Deore M6000 SG rear derailleur, and a 11-40 cassette, 700x28 tires, would give me a 20.07 GI… and cost me about $200-250… and my TCR would get more use I guess….. I'd only do tracks and light touring, no grass.. to old for that...
That was quite the rant. You managed to reference 'back in my day times were simpler', criticize consumers, accuse brands of being rats, ramble on about gearing, and boast that you could make something equal for less. Thats a really impressive rant. Forcing even 3 of those key points into a thread can be tough, but you got 5 in!

In Realityville, I have multiple bikes because I like having multiple bikes. Marketers didnt convince me I need them, I chose to want them and even recognize 2 are very much redundant because they are my back up road bikes which are both 80s steel frames with modern components. If my main road bike were to burst into flames I could just use my gravel bike, yet here I sit with 2 extra road bikes. I may sell one, or maybe not.
Cycling is a hobby and you seem to think there is a right way and many wrong ways to participate in the hobby. Its unfortunate you view a hobby in that manner.

Some people have 1 bike because all they do is participate in one type of cycling. OK then, cool.
Some people have 1 versatile bike and use it for multiple types of cycling. They like to use the trendy term 'quiver killer' for their bike. Ok then, cool.
Some people have multiple bikes because they dont think a road bike would do well on the single track they ride, and they dont think a full suspension mountain bike would do well on the roads they ride. Ok then, cool.



The judges have tallied up their scores for your rant-
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Old 09-09-21, 07:55 AM
  #98  
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr
That was quite the rant. You managed to reference 'back in my day times were simpler', criticize consumers, accuse brands of being rats, ramble on about gearing, and boast that you could make something equal for less. Thats a really impressive rant. Forcing even 3 of those key points into a thread can be tough, but you got 5 in!

In Realityville, I have multiple bikes because I like having multiple bikes. Marketers didnt convince me I need them, I chose to want them and even recognize 2 are very much redundant because they are my back up road bikes which are both 80s steel frames with modern components. If my main road bike were to burst into flames I could just use my gravel bike, yet here I sit with 2 extra road bikes. I may sell one, or maybe not.
Cycling is a hobby and you seem to think there is a right way and many wrong ways to participate in the hobby. Its unfortunate you view a hobby in that manner.

Some people have 1 bike because all they do is participate in one type of cycling. OK then, cool.
Some people have 1 versatile bike and use it for multiple types of cycling. They like to use the trendy term 'quiver killer' for their bike. Ok then, cool.
Some people have multiple bikes because they dont think a road bike would do well on the single track they ride, and they dont think a full suspension mountain bike would do well on the roads they ride. Ok then, cool.



The judges have tallied up their scores for your rant-
Yeah, I have to agree. After a high of 7 bikes, I'm now down to four, and one of them, an '85 Centurion Ironman that I use on my trainer, is up for sale. I'm left with my gravel bike, a 2018 Kona Rove NRB that I bought used a few months ago, my fat bike, a 2017 Carbon Mukluk frame (cool story, this frame has won the Arrowhead Ultra twice and the ITI once) that I built up using parts stripped from a 907 Whiteout AL, and an '08 Salsa Mariachi that I bought a year ago and turned into a 10 speed 1x. I was a bit skeptical about the Rove, but for the price I paid it was worth it to dip a toe in the gravel category. It has been a revelation. I've been a roadie for 40 years, but I am tired of fighting cars. The Rove has allowed me to get off the beaten path and still ride fast. The bonus is that it handles well the pavement that connects all the gravel loops in my area. I'm sold. It's a bit of an overlap with the El Mar, but the El Mar just fits me so well and is such a great commuter that I can't really imagine wanting to sell either. The fat bike goes where neither of the other two can go, and I ride a lot in the winter (I'll be doing the Arrowhead in January for the third time). Marketing didn't convince me to buy any of these bikes. I bought them because I like the riding they allow me to do. If I were to purchase a new gravel bike, I would probably look at the under $1K "regular" Rove. There have always, ALWAYS, been more expensive bikes, and some people have always bought them. But just like in the past, there are less expensive bikes out there that are suitable for the great majority of riders.
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Old 09-09-21, 08:00 PM
  #99  
deaninkl
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr
That was quite the rant. You managed to reference 'back in my day times were simpler', criticize consumers, accuse brands of being rats, ramble on about gearing, and boast that you could make something equal for less. Thats a really impressive rant. Forcing even 3 of those key points into a thread can be tough, but you got 5 in!

In Realityville, I have multiple bikes because I like having multiple bikes. Marketers didnt convince me I need them, I chose to want them and even recognize 2 are very much redundant because they are my back up road bikes which are both 80s steel frames with modern components. If my main road bike were to burst into flames I could just use my gravel bike, yet here I sit with 2 extra road bikes. I may sell one, or maybe not.
Cycling is a hobby and you seem to think there is a right way and many wrong ways to participate in the hobby. Its unfortunate you view a hobby in that manner.

Some people have 1 bike because all they do is participate in one type of cycling. OK then, cool.
Some people have 1 versatile bike and use it for multiple types of cycling. They like to use the trendy term 'quiver killer' for their bike. Ok then, cool.
Some people have multiple bikes because they dont think a road bike would do well on the single track they ride, and they dont think a full suspension mountain bike would do well on the roads they ride. Ok then, cool.



The judges have tallied up their scores for your rant-
Having reread my "rant" you are indeed correct sir.., and for the life of me I am trying to remember what I was on at the time of writing it...I need to buy some more. It was been one of those weeks.. and to top it off my favorite parts supplier has told me they can no longer ship Shimano to Taiwan as Shimano are forbidding retailers in one country shipping to another.. Shimano don't seem to care that Asia does not have the online network that the US and Europe has....

I will reframe from rants, and leave you in peace... and just to confirm.. I do see the gravel bike segment growing, as it offers road'ish bikes with lower gearing that is useful to us oldies even if we wont be going near gravel...
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