sbhikes

Spotted in Santa Barbara gasoline for $4.09 a gallon.

Bockman

cruentus

I gassed up one of the cars the day before yesterday, premium was $3.05 -- this is in North Jersey. As far as I can tell, no one around here is cutting back on driving. Neither is there any evidence of fewer monster SUVs on the road. I wonder how high the price will have to get before it starts to affect people around here.

LCI_Brian

If the price increases gradually, it could go up to $10 a gallon and no one would change their driving. It's only if the price jumps significantly in a short period of time will people think of alternatives to driving.

Bekologist

Fluctuations in energy futures prices in the world market are manipuated by devious oil execs and politicos, princes and CEOs and boards of corporations intent on wringing as much lucre possible out of petroluem driven societies.

There is 'spin' putting the legitimacy of rising prices to the consumer, all the while bending them over at the pumps. Prices have not begun to spike wildy, but 'shortages' of gasoline are already being reported in areas across the country. My prediction, look for 'average' gas prices to be $3.40 by late summer....

Future global political instabilities will of course effect rising consumer prices, no matter how fungible oil is as a commodity. The industry is geared towards raising prices; Boone Pickens, texas oil futures trader alludes as much when he admitted in a recent interview how 'once oil hit 50 bucks a barrel, [traders] were never going to let it go back' to lower levels.

Locally, there was a morning tv news blurb about people pawing their worldly goods to get money to fill the gas tank; social anarchy is surely not far behind. People will be going without food to put money in the tank. Might have slimming consequences.

-=(8)=-

Vt.'s Leahy is calling for an emergancy meeting between many useless and
profiteering agencies to try to get a handle on it. This will be the straw
that literally breaks the back in pushing many of Vermonts already very
low incomed families and farm businesses into poverty. Conicedentally, the
oil companies are enjoying the highest profits they ever have.
When the regime gets ousted and the normal status-quo type authoratarian-
for-profits get in, I would suggest controls on cost but tax vehicles according
to mileage and type. Ie: the bicycle rider who has an old 3 cyl. Geo Metro and
drives 3000 miles or less a year pays signifigantly less than the SUVer who drives
12,000 a year. business vehicles would get their own statndard also.....

Guest

It'll never affect driving. The prices of everything will just go up, and everyone will go on with their gas guzzling lives.

Koffee

DavidLee

^^^ +1 ^^^

It's kind of like smokers who say "if the price if cigarettes go up any more I'm gonna quit smoking." A half a dozen or so tobacco taxes and price hikes later you still see them smoking and saying the very same thing.

Az B

In Europe, vehicles are generally taxed by displacement. This is an effective passive reinforcement for people to choose smaller, more fuel efficient cars. And remember, this is a luxury tax, not a road tax, so it's perfectly reasonable to tax less practical vehicles.

Road use taxes are generally paid for by gas taxes (freeways) and local sales taxes for local roads.

Az

Roughstuff

Good! Finally an incentive to economize on fuel mileage, vehcile size, and vehicle weight! CAn nirvana be far behind?

Finally a reward to the oil companies who have deservedly profited from investments in new crude capacity and sources in recent years.

Finally a kick in the balls to Californians who have been at the forefront of resisting refineries and now are paying top dollar for gasoline. Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of hypocrites.

To all us walkers, bikers, cyclists, and onwers of high fuel efficiency cars....more power to us!


roughstuff

rando

doesn't bother me much, since I commute to work. but my wife's business is mobile (she's a dog groomer)with a large van. costs a ton to keep that thing filled up!

-=(8)=-

Roughstuff = "Finally a reward to the oil companies who have deservedly profited from investments in new crude capacity and sources in recent years.
Finally a kick in the balls to Californians who have been at the forefront of resisting refineries and now are paying top dollar for gasoline. Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of hypocrites."

^^^^ I cant beleive you are from New England and say this kind
of stuff.......Out-of-touch is an understatement.

Roughstuff

Believe me, I wanted to say the SAME thing about new england, since are at the nay-saying forefront on the refinery issue, also. My apologies for not pointing that out as well. Its just so AWESOME to see Ted Kennedy and John Kerry leading the fight against wind turbine farms off the cape cod coast. And people still think Massachusetts people are 'intellectual' snobs!

Lets turn off the spigots and let the goddam yankee bastards freeze in the dark!

roughstuff

-=(8)=-

^^^^ you dont feed an alcoholic by giving them alcohol.
More refineries are not the answer. Getting lazy, selfish and ignorant masses
to start to use thier minds more than their remotes and cars is the answer.
Vermont is in a state of emergancy over the cost of living. the oil
companies would be called racketeers under any other administration and thier
heads would be tried accordingly. Wind farms are not the answer. New Hampshire
makes a signifigant amount of state money from tourest who want to visit thier rural
state....Vermont is the same way. The wind farms will detract from that not to mentoin
that what they put out is not even worth the effort to build them.
Thank goodness for Ted Kennedy, Schumer, et al....our only hope for the future.

MarkS

Its amazing how many people want to attribute the current rise in prices to "oil company conspiracies". We've known for 40 years that the supply of oil is limited. We passed peak oil production in this country in the 70s. Yet we go on like there's no tomorrow, wasting 45% of our national energy balance on transportation -- most of that being personal transporation -- the least efficient method of transporation known to man, with the possible exception of space travel. We've had 30+ years of warning, and yet have built more highways, torn out railways, built no high-speed trains, eliminated the national speed limit, and even provided tax/tariff incentives for people to drive oversized vehicles.

And this doesn't even get into the devastating effects that global warming is already having. The last time the planet raised its temperature only 3C, the Florida pan-handle was under water. Yet some estimates say that global temperatures may rise much more than that by the end of this century.

Gas is (still) too cheap.

-=(8)=-

Agreed...or 'a greed' as it were...there is no conspiracy.
The only policy that has worked for our current administration
is fattening corprate bank accounts at the expense of the working people.
the Bush regime was bought and paid for by big oil and he is dutifully
seeing to it that they maintain the highest level of profit they ever have
in history. Very simple. Repbulicans in office = working people sufferage.

John E

Buy a reasonably fuel-effiicient car, cut out unnecessary driving by consolidating trips, carpooling, bicycling, and riding transit, and invest the savings in energy company stocks. Works for me!

In the short term, those who complain about price manipulation are probably correct. In the long term, those who cite "peak energy" and global supply versus demand are correct. The price of gasoline is a series of fluctuations superimposed on an inevitable gradual upward trend.

John E

That is still rather cheap, given the value received and the environmental and social externalities associated with consumption.

Roughstuff

Now, lets be careful on this thread not to argue with one another about things we agree on. For MY part...I am happy to see gas (and oil/heating oil etc) prices as high as they are because it finally provides a solid incentive to conserve, explore for alternatives, economize, and all that.

And for you poor Ben and Jerry's vermonters, it gives ya even more reason to economize! Back in the colonial days Green Mountaineers used to close the rooms with exterior walls in order to conserve heat, huddling in the interior rooms all winter long. If they could do it....

I just am getting a kick at the ilks of Kennedy and all the 'alternative energy' people suddenly discovering that alternative energy schemes in their own backyard might have drawbacks. After hearing about how great wind energy is for so many decades, it is a pity to have Teddy telling us the turbines off the cape (Whcih would provide enough electricity for something like 10,000 homes) will 'affect property values adversely, and interfere with navigation.

This from a guy who can't drive across a bridge.

Roughstuff

John E

"I would rather go hunting with Dick Cheney than riding with Ted Kennedy."

Bikepacker67

If that's true, we're Flucked.

-=(8)=-

^^^ Teds 75 years old....
He is not going to be around much longer, politically.
Im not Dem or Repub....Im for whoever is for workers,
Sanders, Stern etc. Someone HAS to start to consider the plight
of working people in rural and low income areas. This is most of
America now. How can the 'Haves' understand what its like for
the 'have-nots' if they have never been there ??

sbhikes

I suppose California opposes refineries and all that but when I go to the beach I see oil wells and refineries, when I drive north I pass a refinery, when I drive south I pass more refineries. The sight of giant plumes of flames coming out of a rig or pipe as they burn off the natural gas isn't a surprise to me. It's about as boring as seeing dolphins riding waves with the surfers.

In any case, I was pretty surprised to see $4 gas. I haven't bought any gas for several weeks, but I have been paying about $3.50 or so. Wow! I had no idea! Who would have thought?

trackhub

Good points all around. Weren't there similar reports last September and October, about people not buying fresh vegetables for their kids, and people pawning things, just for gas money?

In Boston and the suburbs, gas station managers are reporting more "drive aways", where people drive off without paying for the gas they just pumped. Apparently, folks don't realize they're on camera the entire time they're at the pump island.

During the gas shortages of the 70's, there was a popular rumor that WWII style rationing books had been printed and were stored in warehouses around the country, just waiting to be used. Heh, wonder if we'll see that before too long?

trackhub