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How do these derailleurs work?

Old 04-11-22, 03:37 PM
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juntjoo
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How do these derailleurs work?

This is a Mongoose "snare" 24 speed. I'm using this derailleur I got off my Cannondale Bent 2 bike of same 8 speeds on the sprocket. Should it work? Mind you I had to manually bend the dropout since it bent when I broke the original derailleur. Not sure if I bent it 100% back original position. Anyway, it appears to have maxed out inwards an unable to reach the first gear. None of the those adjustment screws appear to be impeding its travel inwards. I was able to get to the 8th gear at one point but I also have issues with that. I'm wondering if even this derailleur is capable of changing gears across the whole gear assembly. Maybe it wasn't the original for the Cannondale?
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Old 04-11-22, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by juntjoo
This is a Mongoose "snare" 24 speed. I'm using this derailleur I got off my Cannondale Bent 2 bike of same 8 speeds on the sprocket. Should it work? Mind you I had to manually bend the dropout since it bent when I broke the original derailleur. Not sure if I bent it 100% back original position. Anyway, it appears to have maxed out inwards an unable to reach the first gear. None of the those adjustment screws appear to be impeding its travel inwards. I was able to get to the 8th gear at one point but I also have issues with that. I'm wondering if even this derailleur is capable of changing gears across the whole gear assembly. Maybe it wasn't the original for the Cannondale?
Trying to upload pics

Well it's a "s-ram" derailleur.
Can't get to 1st gear. Derailleur can't be put more inwards towards unless I bend the dropout inwards. Right now it comes down to where derailleur is attached straight. Could/should I bend it inwards to reach first gear?

Last edited by juntjoo; 04-11-22 at 03:45 PM.
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Old 04-11-22, 05:05 PM
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Some SRAM derailleurs are compatible with Shimano and other shifters but many aren’t. I would not recommend bending your dropout if the derailleur currently looks straight. Check out Park Tools website or Sheldonbrown.com for some help with the basics for derailleur adjustment.
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Old 04-11-22, 05:11 PM
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Does it have an "L" screw that can be backed out for effect?
SRAM
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Old 04-11-22, 06:04 PM
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Best way for noobs to let us see pics is to load them to imgur.com or some other hosting site and then type the sharing URL of them in the text of your message. You might have to delete the https:// from it and put a space before and after the . (dot). Some of us will figure out how to make that a valid URL again and will post them for you.

There is also a gallery here, but you still can't put them in your messages till after you get 10 posts. But if you tell us they are there, we can sometimes find them.

Welcome to BF.
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Old 04-11-22, 06:16 PM
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imgur.com/L1s9fxJ

imgur.com/lakngvk

thanks. IDK if there is much useful info in the pics
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Old 04-11-22, 06:17 PM
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Originally Posted by juntjoo
This is a Mongoose "snare" 24 speed. I'm using this derailleur I got off my Cannondale Bent 2 bike of same 8 speeds on the sprocket. Should it work? Mind you I had to manually bend the dropout since it bent when I broke the original derailleur. Not sure if I bent it 100% back original position. Anyway, it appears to have maxed out inwards an unable to reach the first gear. None of the those adjustment screws appear to be impeding its travel inwards. I was able to get to the 8th gear at one point but I also have issues with that. I'm wondering if even this derailleur is capable of changing gears across the whole gear assembly. Maybe it wasn't the original for the Cannondale?
Until you are sure the derailleur hanger is correctly aligned you are wasting time.
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Old 04-11-22, 06:19 PM
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none of the adjustment screws made a difference. I think maybe simply the range of this particular derailleur is not wide enough.

And I'm okay with that if it's the case, so long as I can get a lower gear from the front shifter. That's in my other thread.
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Old 04-12-22, 05:16 AM
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I’ve correct many bent RD hangers and many have needed small corrections, with a professional tool, to fix such problems. “Eyeballing” the alignment only works on BSOs.

Please clarify the problem. People trained on automobiles use “1st gear” when they climb a steep slope from dead stop. On a bike that would be the largest cog on the back - the lowest gear ratio on the bike. Others may consider “1st gear” to be the cog the chain rests on when the rear shift cable is fully relaxed (unless you’ve got a low normal RD, ugh). Post pictures and talk about the cog sizes on your “gear assembly” vs what “gear” the bike is in. Then we can help. Again though, you may need a proper alignment tool and know how to use it.
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Old 04-12-22, 06:11 AM
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Pic assist. It may just be the angle, but it appears that either your derailleur hanger or the derailleur itself is significantly tweaked. Notice how the derailleur cage hanging down points left towards the tire? It should be as close to perfectly vertical as possible. With something tweaked this badly, you'll never get the adjustment right, I'm afraid. That SRAM 5.0 derailleur should have plenty of range to shift an 8-speed cassette like that.

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Old 04-12-22, 06:15 AM
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Another pic assist. Despite the potentially bent derailleur hanger, your L limit screw doesn't appear very "backed out". It seems like there's still some room for that screw to back out more, no? Back that screw almost entirely out of the derailleur housing, until the inner body plate no longer contacts it when you manually push the derailleur fully inwards. It may help to loosen the shifter cable completely and start fresh using some of Park Tools' derailleur adjustment videos. They may some excellent how-to videos on this.

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Old 04-12-22, 07:37 AM
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Good advice above. Also, what shifter are you using? That SRAM 5.0 derailleur will need one of the SRAM 1:1 shifters to index properly.
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Old 04-12-22, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Prowler
I’ve correct many bent RD hangers and many have needed small corrections, with a professional tool, to fix such problems. “Eyeballing” the alignment only works on BSOs.
For 7-8 speed, I’ve had success using a crescent wrench and a machinist square.

By BSO, do you mean Ben Serotta Offering?

John
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Old 04-13-22, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Prowler
I’ve correct many bent RD hangers and many have needed small corrections, with a professional tool, to fix such problems. “Eyeballing” the alignment only works on BSOs. Please clarify the problem. People trained on automobiles use “1st gear” when they climb a steep slope from dead stop. On a bike that would be the largest cog on the back - the lowest gear ratio on the bike. Others may consider “1st gear” to be the cog the chain rests on when the rear shift cable is fully relaxed (unless you’ve got a low normal RD, ugh). Post pictures and talk about the cog sizes on your “gear assembly” vs what “gear” the bike is in. Then we can help. Again though, you may need a proper alignment tool and know how to use it.
Thanks for all the info, yeah, when I say 1st gear I'm talking about the biggest gear(cog?) What's a BSO? And professional tool you talking about? That and an "alignment tool"?
Originally Posted by hokiefyd
Pic assist. It may just be the angle, but it appears that either your derailleur hanger or the derailleur itself is significantly tweaked. Notice how the derailleur cage hanging down points left towards the tire? It should be as close to perfectly vertical as possible. With something tweaked this badly, you'll never get the adjustment right, I'm afraid. That SRAM 5.0 derailleur should have plenty of range to shift an 8-speed cassette like that.
Come to think of it, as someone mentioned in my thread here my derailleur looks "tweaked" and as I mentioned I got it from my Cannondale Bent 2 after a mechanic gave it a new one with chains. If course I don't recall why I kept the derailleur but I just assumed it was good for something and stuck it in the closet. Maybe the fact it's tweaked was why the mechanic swapped it out.
Originally Posted by bboy314
Good advice above. Also, what shifter are you using? That SRAM 5.0 derailleur will need one of the SRAM 1:1 shifters to index properly.
Thanks. I'm using Shimano v-brake type shifters bikeforums.net/bicycle-mechanics/1249975-what-s-most-common-reason-front-shifter-won-t-grab-2nd-gear.html#post22470350 (have to remove html link cuz I'm new) which I'm having issues with too. Well, the front shifter. At the moment my rear shifting combo isn't horrible. I have a decent range I've been able to rig it for. I can get 2nd gear at least and matched with the 1st gear up front is perfect really for where I am, flat Florida. So based on all your feedback sounds like I have a Frankenstein of a configuration and prolly won't be able to get it perfect, but as suggested I will watch more vids and learn those adjustment screws. I'll report back as I progress with this.
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Old 04-13-22, 04:31 AM
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Originally Posted by juntjoo
Thanks for all the info, yeah, when I say 1st gear I'm talking about the biggest gear(cog?) What's a BSO? And professional tool you talking about? That and an "alignment tool".
BSO is bicycle shaped object, often sold at big box stores and have stamped rear dropouts with, shall we say, integrated derailleurs that cannot be removed from the hanger. Slip joint pliers and a sober eye are the tools for alignment. The alignment tool I’m most familiar with is the Park Tool DAG-2.2. For best results (RD hanger exactly parallel to the wheel rim/cog set) you start with a well trued wheel and use that wheel rim as the reference plane.

I cannot envision how to correct alignment with an adjustable wrench and a Machinist square. I’ve had some success with winding sticks but they’re only for wood workers/furniture makers.

Your photo sure makes it look like your RD hanger is still out of line. I only charge $10 to align a hanger. Further RD adjustment is extra. Talk to your LBS (oh sorry, independent Local Bicycle Shop). I’ve no idea what the corporate fleet bike shops charge.
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Old 04-13-22, 06:04 AM
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Good lord, this mystery was solved the moment the OP indicates SRAM 5.0 and Shimano shifter.

SRAM 5.0 rear derailleur won’t work with a Shimano shifter. You can tweak adjustments til the cows come home and it will still not work even remotely well.

Honestly, you are waisting your time with this component mis-match. Just get a shimano 8 or 9 speed RD.

Last edited by Kapusta; 04-13-22 at 06:13 AM.
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Old 04-13-22, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by juntjoo
I'm using Shimano v-brake type shifters which I'm having issues with too. Well, the front shifter. At the moment my rear shifting combo isn't horrible. I have a decent range I've been able to rig it for. I can get 2nd gear at least and matched with the 1st gear up front is perfect really for where I am, flat Florida. So based on all your feedback sounds like I have a Frankenstein of a configuration and prolly won't be able to get it perfect, but as suggested I will watch more vids and learn those adjustment screws. I'll report back as I progress with this.
Yes, this SRAM derailer requires shifters designed for SRAM 1:1 cable pull derailer. You can either change the shifters or change the derailer to a Shimano 6/7/8/9 speed MTB derailer to match your shifter. In addition to rear derailer shifting range, your indexing will also never be right (the amount the derailer moves with each 'click' of the shifter). In summary -- the drivetrain just won't work correctly with the current configuration.

Something like a Shimano RD-M310 or RD-M360 would work out very well for you here.
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