Is this the best explanation of chain stretch ever?
01-08-22, 07:59 PM
#1
Happy banana slug
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Arcata, California, U.S., North America, Earth, Saggitarius Arm, Milky Way
Posts: 3,694
Bikes: 1984 Araya MB 261, 1992 Specialized Rockhopper Sport, 1993 Hard Rock Ultra, 1994 Trek Multitrack 750, 1995 Trek Singletrack 930
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1532 Post(s)
Liked 1,527 Times
in
915 Posts
Is this the best explanation of chain stretch ever?
Yes. Yes it is.
Likes For Korina:
01-08-22, 08:05 PM
#2
On Your Left
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Long Island, New York, USA
Posts: 8,373
Bikes: Trek Emonda SLR, Sram eTap, Zipp 303
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3004 Post(s)
Liked 2,433 Times
in
1,187 Posts
They don't stretch... they wear.
01-08-22, 08:14 PM
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Mich
Posts: 7,354
Bikes: RSO E-tire dropper fixie brifter
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked 2,946 Times
in
1,906 Posts
pfffft... just file down that tool until it fits that seasoned chain.
__________________
-Oh Hey!
-Oh Hey!
01-08-22, 08:15 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,937
Bikes: Colnago, Van Dessel, Factor, Cervelo, Ritchey
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3942 Post(s)
Liked 7,284 Times
in
2,941 Posts
01-08-22, 08:17 PM
#5
On Your Left
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Long Island, New York, USA
Posts: 8,373
Bikes: Trek Emonda SLR, Sram eTap, Zipp 303
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3004 Post(s)
Liked 2,433 Times
in
1,187 Posts
01-08-22, 08:35 PM
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bastrop Texas
Posts: 4,464
Bikes: Univega, Peu P6, Peu PR-10, Ted Williams, Peu UO-8, Peu UO-18 Mixte, Peu Dolomites
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 955 Post(s)
Liked 1,619 Times
in
1,039 Posts
Another excellent vid from RT...
__________________
No matter where you're at... There you are... Δf:=f(1/2)-f(-1/2)
No matter where you're at... There you are... Δf:=f(1/2)-f(-1/2)
01-08-22, 08:42 PM
#7
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Mississauga/Toronto, Ontario canada
Posts: 8,721
Bikes: I have 3 singlespeed/fixed gear bikes
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4227 Post(s)
Liked 2,488 Times
in
1,286 Posts
Chains wear out and there is no magic lube that will increase the lifespan of a chain...Chain cleaning is also waste of time and does nothing to increase the lifespan of a chain. ..Just enjoy riding your bike and replace your chain when it's worn out.
Likes For wolfchild:
01-08-22, 08:54 PM
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Nor-Cal
Posts: 3,767
Bikes: lots
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1958 Post(s)
Liked 2,932 Times
in
1,489 Posts
01-08-22, 09:12 PM
#9
Guest
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 2,888
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1346 Post(s)
Liked 3,270 Times
in
1,439 Posts
01-09-22, 12:05 AM
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Mission Viejo
Posts: 5,801
Bikes: 1986 Cannondale SR400 (Flat bar commuter), 1988 Cannondale Criterium XTR, 1992 Serotta T-Max, 1995 Trek 970
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1943 Post(s)
Liked 2,164 Times
in
1,323 Posts
Likes For 70sSanO:
01-09-22, 05:49 AM
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Baltimore, MD
Posts: 5,363
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2479 Post(s)
Liked 2,947 Times
in
1,673 Posts
01-09-22, 06:22 AM
#12
Senior Member
"Chains wear out and there is no magic lube that will increase the lifespan of a chain...Chain cleaning is also waste of time and does nothing to increase the lifespan of a chain. ..Just enjoy riding your bike and replace your chain when it's worn out."
I believe there is something to this statement. A guy I ride with replaces his chain around the 4000 mile mark. All he does is lube it to keep it quiet. Runs the same cassette through 3 or 4 chain changes. The outer chain ring where he rides most of the time has never been replaced. This bike is about 14 years old now. He is not a masher, but does weigh around 200lbs. Terrain is relatively flat with a few steep hills along the way.
When riding with him he can't hear the squeaking chain so I have to tell him to lube it when he gets home. He never cleans it, just adds lube. It really baffles me as I replace my chain every 1000-1500 miles. I have yet to replace the cassette or chain ring, but the drive train has only seen 3 full seasons.
I believe there is something to this statement. A guy I ride with replaces his chain around the 4000 mile mark. All he does is lube it to keep it quiet. Runs the same cassette through 3 or 4 chain changes. The outer chain ring where he rides most of the time has never been replaced. This bike is about 14 years old now. He is not a masher, but does weigh around 200lbs. Terrain is relatively flat with a few steep hills along the way.
When riding with him he can't hear the squeaking chain so I have to tell him to lube it when he gets home. He never cleans it, just adds lube. It really baffles me as I replace my chain every 1000-1500 miles. I have yet to replace the cassette or chain ring, but the drive train has only seen 3 full seasons.
01-09-22, 06:43 AM
#13
Senior Member
Best explanation?
Maybe? My take is, knowing what causes elongation should make you Not use a "in between the rollers" chain gauge. Least if elongation is what you want to gauge. If overall wear is what you are after its fine, but just be aware roller wear adds a lot to apparent elongation.
From the video it appears as if the chain is "extremely worn" (he says) measured with the park tool gauge, but the same chain measured with the blue ruler shows less than 1/16" elongation in 12". That is at worst 0.5%. That doesn't qualify as Extreme. Not by a long shot.
Of course we can argue all day if roller wear should be included. I think it should, but implemented in the gauge to account for both true elongation and apparent elongation, to not cause you to prematurely discard the chain.
Maybe? My take is, knowing what causes elongation should make you Not use a "in between the rollers" chain gauge. Least if elongation is what you want to gauge. If overall wear is what you are after its fine, but just be aware roller wear adds a lot to apparent elongation.
From the video it appears as if the chain is "extremely worn" (he says) measured with the park tool gauge, but the same chain measured with the blue ruler shows less than 1/16" elongation in 12". That is at worst 0.5%. That doesn't qualify as Extreme. Not by a long shot.
Of course we can argue all day if roller wear should be included. I think it should, but implemented in the gauge to account for both true elongation and apparent elongation, to not cause you to prematurely discard the chain.
01-09-22, 06:53 AM
#14
Senior Member
"Chains wear out and there is no magic lube that will increase the lifespan of a chain...Chain cleaning is also waste of time and does nothing to increase the lifespan of a chain. ..Just enjoy riding your bike and replace your chain when it's worn out."
I believe there is something to this statement. A guy I ride with replaces his chain around the 4000 mile mark. All he does is lube it to keep it quiet. Runs the same cassette through 3 or 4 chain changes. The outer chain ring where he rides most of the time has never been replaced. This bike is about 14 years old now. He is not a masher, but does weigh around 200lbs. Terrain is relatively flat with a few steep hills along the way.
When riding with him he can't hear the squeaking chain so I have to tell him to lube it when he gets home. He never cleans it, just adds lube. It really baffles me as I replace my chain every 1000-1500 miles. I have yet to replace the cassette or chain ring, but the drive train has only seen 3 full seasons.
I believe there is something to this statement. A guy I ride with replaces his chain around the 4000 mile mark. All he does is lube it to keep it quiet. Runs the same cassette through 3 or 4 chain changes. The outer chain ring where he rides most of the time has never been replaced. This bike is about 14 years old now. He is not a masher, but does weigh around 200lbs. Terrain is relatively flat with a few steep hills along the way.
When riding with him he can't hear the squeaking chain so I have to tell him to lube it when he gets home. He never cleans it, just adds lube. It really baffles me as I replace my chain every 1000-1500 miles. I have yet to replace the cassette or chain ring, but the drive train has only seen 3 full seasons.
Likes For Racing Dan:
01-09-22, 07:16 AM
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 786
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 338 Post(s)
Liked 408 Times
in
252 Posts
I replace chains every 6500-ish km and they have more life in them at that point, but I have an important race coming up or something and want everything to be in perfect condition, or last time I changed my chain I installed an OSPW and hence had to put a longer chain in and so on.
Cleaning and lubing with quality stuff, and the chains are Dura-ace 11 speed. It absolutely matters - not all lubes are the same and chain quality differs.
Since they are in reasonably good condition still, I didn't toss the last couple or so in the garbage. Might use them for kids' bikes or something.
Cleaning and lubing with quality stuff, and the chains are Dura-ace 11 speed. It absolutely matters - not all lubes are the same and chain quality differs.
Since they are in reasonably good condition still, I didn't toss the last couple or so in the garbage. Might use them for kids' bikes or something.
01-09-22, 07:23 AM
#16
SE Wis
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 10,500
Bikes: '68 Raleigh Sprite, '02 Raleigh C500, '84 Raleigh Gran Prix, '91 Trek 400, 2013 Novara Randonee, 1990 Trek 970
Mentioned: 40 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2741 Post(s)
Liked 3,388 Times
in
2,051 Posts
Likes For dedhed:
01-09-22, 07:45 AM
#17
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Mississauga/Toronto, Ontario canada
Posts: 8,721
Bikes: I have 3 singlespeed/fixed gear bikes
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4227 Post(s)
Liked 2,488 Times
in
1,286 Posts
During winter season when the roads are heavily salted and sanded, all it takes is one short ride to mess up a clean chain. It's is pointless to use any type of special chain cleaning devices...All I do is wipe the chain with a rag and keep it well lubed and replace it after it wears put...Chain cleaning won't increase the lifespan of the chain when a bike is ridden frequently in very dirty conditions, the best thing to do is just to keep it lubed and replace it when it wears out..
Likes For wolfchild:
01-09-22, 07:48 AM
#18
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Mississauga/Toronto, Ontario canada
Posts: 8,721
Bikes: I have 3 singlespeed/fixed gear bikes
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4227 Post(s)
Liked 2,488 Times
in
1,286 Posts
During this time of the year it's impossible to keep the chain shiny and clean...unless all you do is ride your bike in your basement on your indoor trainer...because if you do any type of riding outdoors your chain is going to get messed up daily.
01-09-22, 07:50 AM
#19
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 39,217
Mentioned: 211 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18397 Post(s)
Liked 15,494 Times
in
7,317 Posts
Unless you live somewhere like the San Diego area, FL, etc.
01-09-22, 07:50 AM
#20
Full Member
Gotta say, I really like the approach of using oversize models to help show what surfaces are wearing, and how that wear results in an increase of the chain pitch.
That wasn't news to me, but I appreciate it as a resource that might be useful when trying to explain it to someone else.
That wasn't news to me, but I appreciate it as a resource that might be useful when trying to explain it to someone else.
01-09-22, 09:30 AM
#21
Guest
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 2,888
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1346 Post(s)
Liked 3,270 Times
in
1,439 Posts
You seem to be operating under the misconception that everyone in the world lives and rides where you do.
01-09-22, 10:25 AM
#22
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Mississauga/Toronto, Ontario canada
Posts: 8,721
Bikes: I have 3 singlespeed/fixed gear bikes
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4227 Post(s)
Liked 2,488 Times
in
1,286 Posts
...Just ride your own bike and don't worry what others are doing.
01-09-22, 10:28 AM
#23
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Mississauga/Toronto, Ontario canada
Posts: 8,721
Bikes: I have 3 singlespeed/fixed gear bikes
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4227 Post(s)
Liked 2,488 Times
in
1,286 Posts
......That's it I give up,
01-09-22, 10:30 AM
#24
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 786
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 338 Post(s)
Liked 408 Times
in
252 Posts
If I lived somewhere with real winters where roads were salted I'd have a cheaper winter bike with fenders. I've taken my road bike with me on winter holidays in snowy areas, if I don't wash it right after a ride the metal bits start to corrode, and riding in the snow, the cables freeze after a while. It is just a lot of faff cleaning and lubing everything after every ride in snow.
Much prefer winter here, where I was wearing shorts today (a bit chilly for that but fine for an intense ride).
Much prefer winter here, where I was wearing shorts today (a bit chilly for that but fine for an intense ride).
01-09-22, 10:55 AM
#25
Should Be More Popular
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Malvern, PA (20 miles West of Philly)
Posts: 43,030
Bikes: 1986 Alpine (steel road bike), 2009 Ti Habenero, 2013 Specialized Roubaix
Mentioned: 560 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22574 Post(s)
Liked 8,919 Times
in
4,153 Posts