rubiksoval

My last eight months.

burnthesheep

Tonight is work night. Thinking of the 40/20 workout again but after re-reading the Trainingpeaks article, I think I got the work/rest intensities incorrect in what I wrote. The ratio in their article seemed to be 95% to 97% of hour power for the work and the "rest" was at 66% of the work. For example, it would be 300w and 200w.

The first time I did this I chose 322w and 140w. So, essentially 110 to 115% and 50% of that for rest.

What's some opinions on that? Less "high" and more "low" or is what I have there also ok?

rubiksoval

If your on-portion is only 95-97% of hour power, why break it up every 40 seconds? I'd just do 30-45 minutes or however long you want at 90-95% straight and be done. Maybe do a 10 sec surge every 5 minutes if you're bored.

If I'm ever doing anything like 30/30s or 40/20s or 20/40s, it's with big power at vo2 max levels or FRC. Otherwise I don't find any value in such short repeats.

burnthesheep

That's the source of my confusion, I agree with what you say there.

Just so we're seeing why I confused this, here is the article:
https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/w...0-20-workouts/

Hermes

IMO, that blog is sort of BS. The ideas seem correct and it uses the right buzz words and it is well written. It sounds good but the question is how to make an on / off interval set operational for an athletes objectives.

My coach has 5 different interval sets that focus on improving VO2/threshold. And he has a story about how he obtained the workouts from the East Germans and Soviets at Olympic Games and why the East Germans showed that 30/30 were the best workout to build threshold power. So that too sounds a little old school long in the tooth BS too until you try to do the workout.

His 30/30 is 2 sets of 3x(10 minutes of 30 on/ 30 off) 5 minutes rest between intervals and 10 minutes rest between sets. So his workout is 60, 30 second on intervals. I think Rubik could do this workout and maybe you could do it. I have done it and it is really hard but the key is getting the power levels correct. Too much power in the early intervals and the last set becomes almost impossible.

So I set the on period to 110% for the first 10 minutes and then try to hold and raise power as the 10 minute intervals progress. Also, I accelerate to the on power versus stomp it. And he likes these done on the track at Carson on the 45 degree banking. That means the 30 seconds of off power has to be enough to to keep from sliding down the banking. So on the road, the off power is maybe some higher z2 power.

If you think 40/20 is better have at it but keep the 10 minute duration and number of intervals and sets.

IMO, what I have provided coupled with a plan against a goal makes the workout operational.

Hermes

And I like the hour of power idea as well. That is why my wife and I are doing the 2x20k team time trials. We end up with an hour of power with intervals of FTP and VO2.

TMonk

First ride of week 2 in build 1 and man I freaking smashed today. It feels great after a week of mediocre workouts last week.

Interval duration / FTP target / actual:

• 3' / 120% / 130%
• 20' / 96-97% / 100%
• 10' / 105% / 110% (wow)
• 3' / 120% / 120%

The 10' was sort of weird and choppy. I was resting after the 20' and a group of roadies I recognized came onto the (Fiesta) island doing a decent paceline. I let them pass and then spent about 3/4 of a full lap (~7.5 min) chasing. When I caught them I wasn't going too much faster but got a second wind. The leading rider grabbed my wheel and I gave him 30s at 120%+ and then eased up and veered slightly left indicating that I wanted him to pass. They were a bit shattered but I slotted into 3rd spot. After the leading rider was done, second wheel didn't have the beans to pull through and I just sort of rode away without accelerating. I saw my average power was quite high with 90s left in my interval which kept me motivated to keep it up.

For the rest of the week - PTO tomorrow for a long one (6 hrs), SST on the TT bike Thursday, off Friday and then a moderate weekend. On Saturday I might get some TSS in with a planned 2 hrs on Zwift with a race or two. Sunday should be light and social hopefully. Also, on Saturday a local racer and buddy is going for a Master's hour record attempt at SDVA, I forget which age bracket. I plan on riding down to check it out and cheer/heckle, then riding back home and hoping on Zwift for a bit.

rubiksoval

That they mention Tabata, and then says it's done around your lactate threshold, is utterly bizarre. I'd ignore this entire article based solely on those two irreconcilable statements.

caloso

I like 30/30s because they're just simpler to keep track of when I'm cross-eyed.

hubcyclist

Did 11x2min vo2 intervals. I turned these down 3% and they were very doable, so I might going too easy on myself but I feel more like wins than gains lol

Hermes

Fiesta structured workout today 3x(12 minutes of 30” on, 1' off) and then two laps of constant power. Fun workout and another chain less day. Moderate wind at Fiesta with a headwind on the front stretch and a tailwind on the back.

ridethecliche

4 hrs riding on groomers on saturday.

3-4 hrs riding in powder on monday evening coupled with 7 hours of a combination of being stuck and having to dig myself out, being stuck after being plowed in by a snow plow, or being stuck behind a stuck snow plow.

2 hrs of slightly packed powder moguls yesterday. No crowds, so take a run and get right back in the lift line. Repeat leg blasting routine.

I am very tired, but surprisingly not sore.

Gonna take out a new to me carving deck tomorrow morning after calling out sick from a lecture day. A bit nervous about it, but it should be amazing. Can't wait for my vacation riding in NH next week and this is just about as perfect of a lead up to it I can imagine. Haven't been on the bike in almost a month since right after my FTP test where it spit out 242... guessing that's gonna be way lower when I get back on again lol.

waterrockets 

35 miles road SST yesterday morning
14 miles of XC race simulation last night with Thing 3's HS MTB team (super fun figure 8 course on a technical set of trails -- 1100 ft climbing total)
25 miles road tempo this morning on some damned tired legs

2x workouts again tomorrow (road intervals morning, dirt intervals evening with HS team). Earning those upcoming Saturday AM breakfast tacos.

furiousferret

Day 3 of recovery, I'm hoping my legs will be fresh tomorrow.

caloso

Ramping up the intensity with some VO2max intervals this morning. "Rest" periods were short and not really rest. A tough set, but I like the idea of having to go hard after an incomplete recovery.

burnthesheep

Anyone ever drop their key to their car or house (with no other way back in) while out on a run? I had a hole in my pocket and the key went through it nearly 1/2 way into the run. Only option at the time was to lower the pace a LOT and backtrack. I found it.

It was NOT in the cards for me to run nearly a 1/2 marathon today. I backed the pace looking for it way way slow, but still...............dangit man.

caloso

Ugh. That sucks. Are you able to stash a hidden key in your back yard? That's what we do.

burnthesheep

I drive about a mile off-site from our manufacturing plant and park roadside in a safe spot. It was during a run from there.

Otherwise if it was the house at home our neighbor has a key and is always home.

In the future I'll make a copy of that car key as a "dumb" one just to unlock the door. Then take that with me and hide the real one in the car. That way if I lose the cheapo dumb key it is just a quick lock-pop and I've got my real key.

Lesson learned the hard way!

TMonk

Man oh man I needed another hour of sleep and a big breakfast before my ride this morning. It was just 1x30' at 85% on the TT bike, but it was a bit haggard, and I think I'm just now starting to feel normal. I don't think I had recovered enough after VO2 intervals Tuesday and a 98 mi, 5,000', 6 hr solo jaunt yesterday.

Looking forward to this off day tomorrow then a more moderate weekend. Feeling strong though!

cmh

A long time in the past (about '93, I think), I was ~7 hours from home to visit some friends for a weekend and we loaded our mtn bikes in my truck and went for a 12 mile out and back ride (6 mi each way). When we got back to the truck, we found that my key had worked its way through a tiny hole in my seat pack and fell out. So, its Sunday afternoon, 7 hrs by car from a spare key and my key is somewhere along 6 miles of singletrack. I slowly rode the whole trail again, leaning far over the bars of my rigid fork stumpjumper and not more than 30 yards from the end of the trail, I found my key.

cmh

Really? You didn't recover in a day from a 98 mi 5000' solo ride? Sheesh.

TMonk

cmh it does seem kinda silly in retrospect. During base, I put in more than a few 3 hr z2 trainer rides (Zwift) the day following a 6hr ride was just fine. I figured some SST wouldn't be too much, but I guess not. I do think that my sleep and caloric intake weren't adequate this time around, which of course doesn't help.

TMonk

I've also generally been building TSS and fitness for a few years as well. The thought of doing three hard(ish) workouts in consecutive days (with a century in the middle) would have sounded totally wild 5 years ago, but now isn't so out of reach for me.

I had initially planned on getting about twice as much time in position (SST on the TT bike) this AM for about ~1hr total and 2hr ride time, but I slept in past my first alarm.

gsteinb

I've actually been doing a lot of four and five day blocks, with our travels to FLA. Last week when we were down there I took two days off for the drive, trained five days, then took the two days home off. Granted, they're 90-120 minute affairs. But indeed, hard.

cmh

Tmonk - Hope you know I intended that as a light hearted ribbing. You put in a ton of work and seem to know what you can handle pretty well. I know it would take me several days to recover from a 98 mile ride especially the day after VO2 intervals.