jjhabbs 

Hey guys,
Here is a bike I picked up a couple months ago. I never got around to doing a video till now. Pics below as well. LEt me know what you think.

cb400bill

Beautiful bike.

Slowride79

Seat clamp bolt is definitely not original. Replacements that actually fit are very difficult to find. Ask me how I know…

I agree it’s a beautiful bike!

Classtime 

Beautiful job on the bike. But this edition of the Professional, with those fastback seat stays? If I start liking those, I'll drift into liking the modern dropped seat stays on the carbon bikes. Not happening.

jjhabbs 

I was thinking about just getting one of those 19mm campy style bolts


JJ

jamesdak 

That is a real beauty!

steelbikeguy

The bike has seen a bit of use, as evidenced by the change of bar tape and tires, but that's about it. Remarkable condition! Raleigh paint jobs of that era are rather fragile (and perhaps that is true of other brands), so it's impressive that it has been spared the usual damage. It even has the original pump! Very cool!

Steve in Peoria

Schreck83 

Beautiful bike and nice video. Are the handlebars made by GB?
What letter(s) does the serial number start with?

steelbikeguy

at a glance, the bolt looks fairly similar to what is in the catalog....


high res version: https://live.staticflickr.com/8160/2...e060f_3k_d.jpg

what are the specs/details of the original bolt, and how does it differ from what John has?

One thing I like about the high end bikes of the era is that they usually go with "standard" Campagnolo parts, thus avoiding the weird proprietary threadings and dimensions of the brand, which Raleigh is somewhat infamous for. Well, that usually works..... It wasn't too long ago that I learned that my 1987 Hetchins (built by Bob Jackson) has a weird seatpost bolt with Whitworth thread (IIRC) and takes a 7/32" allen.

Steve in Peoria

Kabuki12

I just picked up a 1978 Mark V in the same color but in well patina'd state . I plan to make a rider out of it until I can get it repainted. Yours is beautiful and what's nice is that it is not too nice to ride. Probably as nice as can be found for a bike that can be ridden. I have an original Competition GS in that state that I have been riding off and on for over five years. I hope you enjoy at least a nice Sunday ride on it before hanging it up! Be careful, you may love it and start riding it a bit more! You have so many that I guess it would be tough to ride em all but , oh what fun trying. I showed my wife so she would not think of me as obsessive. Joe

Slowride79

Steve, nice detective work! I stand corrected ! I thought the ‘74 had the same fastener as my ‘72 which is in fact has the same weird one as your Bob Jackson. Did you find a source for replacements? Here is mine. Only tires have been replaced.

steelbikeguy

I haven't had to look for a replacement, but I assume that there must be fastener suppliers that could get the basic bolt.... although it might be a UK supplier.

My Hetchins has a black steel bolt that threads into the left seat stay. It has an allen head that is recessed into the right seat stay. Pretty low profile, and generally something that doesn't attract attention.....


This reminds me that I recently noticed another odd fastener dimension on one of my Raleighs. The GB stem on my '74 International has an allen head on the quill bolt that takes a 1/4" allen wrench. A standard 6mm wrench is just a bit loose. I've had the bike for 20 years and can't believe I didn't notice this earlier!



Steve in Peoria

verktyg 

jjhabbs Slowride79 steelbikeguy

Spectacular bike

The 1973 and 1974 Raleigh Catalogues show a Campagnolo seatpost bolt:



The 1975 and 1976 Catalogues picture a TA Ref 365 seatpost bolt.



TA Ref 365 Seat Post Bolt.



These TA Seatpost Bolts came on a lot of better quality French Bike Boom bikes like the Gitane TdF. They looked nice, problem was the hex sockets were not hard enough and would round out after only a few adjustments.

TA also made Ref 368 bolts for use with centerpull brakes.



verktyg

verktyg 

jjhabbs

In reference to some questions and comments in your video (well done BTW)... Here's the 1974 Catalogue Spec Sheet. The 1974 Pro was listed with a 13-26T 6 speed Maillard Freewheel but a lot of them came with 13-24T Regina D'Oro freewheels or something like that??? As always - Specifications subject to change...



Also the bike that you refer to as a 1980 Raleigh Pro Mark V has model changes that were first introduced in 1977. The lugs, seat stay attachment, fork crown and dropouts where updated from the earlier models plus there was no chrome plating on the frames. Also the geometry changed from the previous years to a more Italian style.

They were pretty "spendy" in 1977 selling for ~$675+ USD. We sold a few to hard core Raleigh fans but you could get full Campy high end Italian bikes for ~$500-$550!



verktyg

Kabuki12

^^^ Interesting subtle changes from 1977 to 1978. This shows a pant guard on the chain ring like my 1977 three spoke crank came with on my 1977 Competition GS. I don’t think the 1978 had that. Also listed the color as Blue Mink, on the 1978 it is listed as Steel Blue., yet looks like the same color. The stem for 1978 listed as GB Biba. I am putting mine together now so I can ride it this winter and I went with the Allen head GB stem like my Comp. and the “British Isle” bars. Thank you for your info on this Verktyg.

Narhay

Be still, my beating heart.

steelbikeguy

thinking back to when I made my post, I think I looked at my two catalogs, a 1974 (I think) and a 1976, I think I went to the '76 because it showed the blue mink & silver paint scheme. Looking at the '74 catalog, I see that it shows the more common Campy style bolt....


high resolution version: https://live.staticflickr.com/8009/2...1baff_3k_d.jpg

As noted, "specifications are subject to change", so we shouldn't assume that a 1974 Raleigh Pro couldn't have come with the TA bolt.
Also, we shouldn't completely trust the catalog photos, as there are some weird things in the photos now and then. For instance, in this catalog photo, the left brake lever is hanging down a bit, and the front hub quick release lever is mounted on the right and oriented down. On the other QR's in the catalog, the levers are on the left... but always pointing down. Weird!

Steve in Peoria

Kabuki12

Also , weren't bikes assembled by the shop that sold them? That makes variations even more possible. When my wife bought her Townie , she didn't like the seat so the Trek shop put a different one on. My point is that some bikes were probably different than the brochure for various reasons. Early Porsches were similar in the way they were equipped. They could vary from one to the other from the factory. When I wrote Porsche in Stuttgart about certain anomalies on my car they replied / implied that this was the case AND that they had no idea that people would even care 50 years later! Joe

Prowler 

Congratulations John. Your '74 is a beauty. I do hope you get to ride many miles on it. Don't baby it. They are great bikes.

. I've seen that too but I believe they are different - the Steel Blue a bit darker shade. My Pro was made August 1976 and painted Blue Mink but has been repainted a bit darker blue, I think Steel Blue. Both the original and new paint are on the frame. When I bought it there are no signs, even ghosts of original decals anywhere. I added the very few there now. The original Blue mink was not removed. I suspect that, being one of the last in the line and prior to annual shutdown, my frame was stored at the factory, never built. It was later brought out, repainted and either shipped to Boston or built then shipped to Boston. Curious.




You'll find it has Bocama Super Professional HT lugs. I think there may only be one or two others. It has some of the stock Campy bits (correct date codes) and several aftermarket changes/upgrades. I believe the original owner rode this bike a lot in the many years he had it. I've made changes too to suit me. Most recent was swapping the small ring from 42T to 40T. That will help this old man. Oh, I also committed the major gaf of installing a proper Campy seat post bolt. I'm aware that I'll probably only get 2 or 3 more installs out of that but, as I rarely move the seat post and store this bike indoors and dry, the bolt should last me quite some time.

I felt the same way and only did some touch up on the TT and DT as sweat had damaged the paint. It's been in regular service for 8 years now and is a joy to ride, each time. As you see it, its set for dawn patrol tomorrow morning. Can't wait.

Kabuki12

My 1978 Steel Blue
I think mine is a bit lighter than yours , Prowler , at least what's left of it! It could be lighting I guess. Nice bike , by the way.

Prowler 

Yes, lighting, exposures and monitor calibrations make a difference. Its a totally overcast day here today. I've never actually been next to a proper Mk V but have been next to a proper Mk IV. That Blue Mink was the color of the first coat on mine. (When I first got the bike I carefully 'excavated' a bit of the original paint on the HT of mine so I could compare if the opportunity presented itself.) Clearly a difference.

BTW: The original silver on my HT is a bit lighter than the top coat as well. I wonder if they changed the "silver" for the Mk V as well as change the blue.

jjhabbs 

Thanks for all the feedback guys.

JJ

verktyg 

In 1969 Raleigh introduced their Professional model (Mk I) in white with the black/redish/orangish seat tube stripes used by the German Ruberg team that rode those colours. Raleigh used that colour combo into early 1970.



Raleigh introduced the Professional DL-180 Mk II in their 1970 catalog in uber ugly brindle-s**t brown with a silver head tube and seat tube stripes. They had chrome plated sloping fork crowns plus chrome plated socks on the fork blades and rear stays. The seat stays were "fast back' or "shot in". The the colour was called Mink / Silver.




In 1971 they renamed the DL-180, the Mk III. There doesn't seem to be a 1971 Raleigh Catalogue showing the Pro posted on the internet. I've not seen any differences in the specs between the 1970 Mk II and the 1971 Mk III.

The 1972 catalogue shows the DL-180 Professional in a dark brindle brown colour. I saw a few Pros in the darker colour back in the early 70's. The catalogue list this as the Mk IV. The specs are the same as for the Mk II and Mk III bikes.



In 1972 there were some Professionals that came into the US with "bird's mouth" lugs shown below. I've seen these referred to as Brampton, Agrati and Carlton lugs???

The most likely story is there was a shortage of the preferred long point lugs that Raleigh and Carlton had been using on the top models since the late 60's. Carlton who was building the Pro frames had these lugs sitting on the shelf so that's what they used. They did the same ~1972 with their old stock birds eye Carlton lugs that they used on some Raleigh Competition and a few International frames.

These were the first "Mink Blue" / Silver painted frames. What's been confusing to many is the word MINK! It would seem that Mink would be brown! Well, Blue Mink was a popular colour for light blue dyed Mink fur coats back then. The name was even used as a colour on some luxury cars.




1973 Raleigh Professional. The down tube decals were changed from gold script to larger white and gold block characters. They also started using a larger Carlton decal on the seat and none of the old fashioned Carlton logos on the forks.




In 1974 Raleigh offered the Pro in Silver / Black as well as Mink Blue / Silver. They only made Silver / Black frames for one year. I finally scored one last year.



There were few changes between the 1974-1975-1976 Raleigh Pros. The Mink Blue colour was very consistent during those years but I remember seeing a few older models that were a little lighter shade. TYhey looked faded.

This is my 1975 Pro. The colour on my display is very close to the actual bike.



A number of responses in this thread have mentioned variations in the Mink Blue colour.

Prowler mentioned several possibilities for these differences. Without a properly calibrated monitor/display and video card especially one designed graphics work the colours are going to look different on everyone's screen.

Throw in the vagaries of ~45 year old printed material, differences in scanners, digital cameras plus lighting and there's not much that can be agreed upon.

On my graphics flat screen, jjhabbs spectacular frame looks a little dark!

I've hit my 10 photo limit so check out my stuff on the Mk V Pros in my next message.

verktyg

verktyg 

We took on the Raleigh line in 1977 because the local dealer was fading out of the picture and there were some loyal fans who wanted to buy Raleigh Pros and Team Pros. We also had a need for bikes in the ~$175 price range that the Grand Prix model filled.

We were a little surprised by the changes between the 1976 Mk IV and the 1977 Mk V. They had new style lugs with cutouts and side windows, a new fork crown and willow leaf caps on the seat stay tops.

The first 1977 Pros had a darker blue-gray colour than the previous Mink Blue Mk IV bikes plus a new style Raleigh down tube logo.



I think the lugs were Bocama Competition 83 style and the crowns were Bocama too.



Some of the new generation Pros and SBDU Team Pro frames used these slotted Haden BB shells. The walls were thicker than a lot of the BBs in use at the time and they were quite heavy even with the slots.



The 1978 Pros had a little brighter Mink Blue.



In early 1979 some yobs from Raleigh came to town unannounced, walked into our shop. They wanted us to drop all of our other brands and "floor plan" the complete Raleigh line. I think we showed the the way the door opened out. Shortly after that I left the bike business.

I've seen pictures of quite a few Raleigh resprays where the painters seem to have taken a lot of artistic license as far as not matching colours than probably any other C&V bike model!

verktyg

Prowler 

^^^^^^ Thanks Chas. Interesting that the 1978 blue paint may have been lighter than the 1977 Steel Blue.

Your accurate memories of the early to late '70s are far superior to mine. Although there is a whole college of people who would put forth the proposition that "if you can remember the '70s then you weren't there".