dmeans2anend

Hi there,


Does anyone know which derailleur hanger is used on the 2017 Motobecane Fantom Cross Team Titanium Bike? In case, you have the same bike.


I checked DerailleurHanger.com and there are two (2) possible options for it: Hanger #49 and Hanger #345.

I know the answer will depend on the number of fasteners required.


#49




#345









In 2018, I converted a 2017 Motobecane Fantom Cross Team Titanium Bike that I bought used and converted into an affordable fantastic light weight touring bike to ride the Pacific Coast Route from Astoria, Oregon to San Francisco, CA. It road like a dream, fast and light. I had no issues with it at all. Not even a flat. Knock on wood.


I am planning to tour overseas when it is safe to do so again. In the interim, I am looking to buy a spare derailleur hanger for my repair kit.


I know the best way to confirm the hanger choice is to simply do a visual on it. However, the bike is currently installed with an "Old Man Mountain Sherpa" Rear Rack.

Since I also bought the rear rack used, it is a royal pain to remove. I think its because the extender on the rack (10") that mounts to the eyelets on the bike is a bit short so to get the rack fitted onto the bike, I have to use brute force to push it so that I can tighten the hardware on the eyelets.


Thought I check with you all to see if someone in the group might already know......


Thanks!

veganbikes

Uhhh how could you have two radically different derailleur hangers for one bike? Did you reach out to Bikes Direct the people who bought the Motobecane name. They would know if you aren't willing to look yourself or even take some useful pictures of your own bike.

You shouldn't need brute force to tighten a rack and that sounds like you have some issues that could cause problems down the line.

dmeans2anend

Hi Veganbikes,

I think you misunderstood my comment. There are two options but only one is correct.
Per the website "DerailleurHanger.com", you input the year, make, and model.
Two options were listed. In order to confirm the right one, you need to know "how many fasteners".
Hence, the visual check.

I have contacted Bike Direct in the past and have gotten no response from them.
Hence, I didn't think it was worth while to try again.

I have attached a "stock" photo of the same exact frame as my bike with actual detail of the "hanger" showing.
I'm not sure any photos that I might include showing my bike would show any additional information that I didn't already post.
BTW, I did try to include a photo of my bike but unfortunately, I don't know why but I keep getting an error after 50% of it was downloaded and then it stopped. (Maybe the file was too large).

I already explained why I have to use brute force to install the rack. The 'extender' on the "used" rack came with a 10" extender to attach to the eyelet.

Ideally, a longer extender like a 14" extender would be more ideal. However, I'm not worried about it. It has been well tested on the Pacific Coast Route over 900 miles with 30,000 feet climbing and 20 days camping. It's solid.

dmeans2anend

Here is my bike:

trailangel

You have the bike. Drop the rear wheel and look at the hanger.

dmeans2anend

Yup, I already know that is an option.

However, I thought to save some time and check here first in case anyone else has the same bike and know the answer already.

Isn't that the purpose of the forum?

Help each other out and minimize effort.

veganbikes

Nope I got the thread. I missed your photo though showing detail of the derailleur hanger, it looks like it got deleted or never was posted? Otherwise if you are talking about the BD photo you posted that doesn't show any detail of the hanger. Those two hangers are very different not even close to being the same so obviously that is a good sign that derailleur hanger dot com is not a reliable source but looking at your own bike is and it is not something we can do without decent photos of the hanger but in that case you would already have your answer and wouldn't need us. You could take your photo and put it on a photo hosting site but then that is a ton of work when you could have already pulled a wheel looked at the hanger and compared it to ones you have seen and boom you could have already purchased it.

Brute force is not SOLID. I am sorry but metal can fatigue and putting extra stress on it because "that is what the "used" rack came with" is not a good idea for touring. While the rack may have held up loading it with weight and putting even more stress on it than is on it already can lead to failures down the line and that is not something I want while touring. Bikes really don't need brute force unless something has seized and you are trying to remove it. A bottom bracket is probably the most brute force you would need and even there we have torque wrenches that can go to 30-40nm. Brute force is probably better used as a costumed wrestlers name or something like that.

That is cool you rode the PCH I have heard it is some good touring, I hope to make it out there sometime. I did ride the Coast Starlight and that was quite nice visually but going slow by bike you get to see a lot more.

trailangel

Faster to drop the rear wheel and look at the hanger from the inside for the 2 smaller bolts. Then you will know.
The southern oregon coast is the best! I hope you stopped at Cape Blanco campground....

dmeans2anend

Veganbikes,

I'm not sure exactly what your intent is in your comments. They seem more like criticisms which do not add anything constructive. If you can't offer any assistance to my specific question, may I suggest that you simply move on to the next thread? As I read your comments, it comes across as typical mansplain to me what is and isn't without full comprehension of my situation or background.

First, I'm in no rush. I'm not going to get on my touring bike for a while as I have another road bike that I normally train with. Hence, my touring bike will be sitting in the garage for a while as it is still the middle of winter with snow outside and also, I do not feel it is safe to tour IMHO due Covid. Hence, my thinking was to pose my question here to see if anyone knows the answer in the next few months or longer. If no one knows the answer, it's not a big deal. When I'm getting ready to tour, I'll do general maintenance on the bike and follow through then if necessary.

But for whatever reason, there are some folks here that seems to think there is ONLY ONE WAY and that is to pull the bike and rack apart right now. Well, I beg to differ. Based on my previous questions, I know there are some in this community that have the same exact bike so I'm hoping that they'll stumble onto this question and possibly help with an answer. I wish you could respect the fact that this is an open forum and anyone can ask a question. But please do not DICTATE the method in which I seek my answer.

Second, I beg to differ with you on your comment of 'brute force is not solid'. Brute force is a qualitative term. What is brute force for me may not be brute force to you. For example, I have to 'brute force' my Continental tire back onto the rim when I fix a flat. But, I know it's solid because I have ridden 5,000 miles on it since. For you, popping your tire onto the rim may be no big deal. It is all relative.

I ,one hundred percent, agree with your comment regarding metal can fatigue and stress. As an engineer, I have seen much of this in my line of work with chemical reactors, heat exchangers and pumps and having to redesign these things. However, in this instance, the majority of the load or weight on the rear rack is on the quick release skewer as the Old Man Mountain Rack is designed to use a quick release skewer or an axle mounting instead of the lower eyelets on the bike which can cause more sheer stresses. That is why Old Man Mountain Racks are superior in so many ways to other racks but they can be a hassle to install IMHO. The brute force that I used is on aligning the rear rack with the 'upper eyelets' which does not experience the majority of the load or stress. I am confident that the my rack as is will work just fine.

IMHO. If any bike tourers have the opportunity, they should try to experience the beauty and majesty of the Pacific Coast Route at least once in their life. I have travelled all over the world and this route is one of the greatest national treasurer. I'm hoping to ride the entire route again when I get the time. I'm addicted to it! I like going light and fast even on my tour bike because per my opinion, you go further and see more. There is no right or wrong way just each to their own. C'est la vie.

Trakhak

Well put. In case you're not aware of the fact, you can add any poster to your "Ignore" list in Bike Forums. I have only three names on mine, all serial blowhards.

trailangel

Just because another person has a 2017 Motobecane Fantom Cross Team Titanium doesn't mean it will have the same rear hanger as your bike. They may have had a manufacturing change in the middle of the run... we don't know. But you have the bike. You can check. This forum is not for you to ask others to do your own work... it's to guide you through.

dmeans2anend

Trakhak: Thank you for the info. I'll keep it in mind in the future since I wasn't aware you can do that. Wow, I didn't realize the community on BF has changed so much! In 2018, when I first started touring, I posted several questions in this community. I couldn't be more grateful of all the constructive tips and feedback that I got. The help was enormous and so positive. In fact, one person, Alan S, posted one simple sentence (less than 20 words) which got me to convert my rear gearing that made my trip a complete gamechanger!!! I am grateful to the community but I wish there was MORE TOLERENCE AND LESS JUDGMENT.

TrailAngel: In case you lack "situational awareness", your comment "This forum is not for you to ask others to do your own work... it's to guide you through." comes across as being very hostile. I wasn't asking anyone to do work on my behalf. I asked a simple question and if they know the answer, great. If not, it's not a big deal JUST MOVE ON. I did NOT ask anyone to wrench their bike to find me an answer. I do not appreciate YOUR false accusation and condemnation. And if the manufacturer has changed the bike frame in the middle of the run (very unlikely), it is a risk I am willing to take and not on you. So I'm not sure what you issues are. Pick on someone else. Better yet, take some time out. Go ride your bike.

veganbikes

Look I gave you useful info. You can call it "mansplain" even though I have not revealed to you any gender nor have you revealed yours nor does it freakin' matter. Gender is a really dumb construct designed to further categorize and subjugate people and not allow them to live as human beings and love who we wish to love and be who we wish to be. However I will digress from that to avoid going into P&R. I have worked in bicycle retail for almost 10 years now have managed a few shops and done some wrenching in them as well and am a bike nerd and also have done some bike touring. Nothing having to do with gender just with having worked with bikes in a professional setting for a long time and also just enjoying them beyond that.

You said you posted a useful photo of the detail of the derailleur hanger which nobody has seen yet. I said if you posted photos of your own set up that would help but if you had done that you would have had the answer. Nothing with negative intention there just a statement of fact. You would be able to see the hanger you currently have and could easily compare it to ones you have seen and find the correct one or use the info you gathered to search for the correct number of bolts and narrow it down quite easily. Two vastly different hangers couldn't be for the same bike unless they made significant changes which is possible and would then lead you to issues if someone had the same model year bike but of that different hanger. Rush or not you could still have taken off the wheel checked the hanger, ordered the hanger and installed the wheel quite easily while enjoying a beverage or watching a good show on the Netflix or Youtoobs.

If taking off the wheel is a pain, practice is then going to be really helpful and this will be good practice for when you really need it sitting on the side of the road in a rain storm fixing a flat in the middle of a foreign country with nobody around. The more you do it the easier it becomes and you are better prepared for world touring. If your goal is to never have flats you will run into problems very quickly but if you plan and prepare you will have an easier go at it.

In terms of brute force when someone says brute force it is a good sign they are having to struggle with it and exert a lot of pressure. It is not a good sign when someone says they need brute force to install something that would not require force unless someone had medical issues with hand strength. We aren't talking about a bottom bracket or massive bolt that requires a lot of strength. Yes brute force is certainly going to have some different values to it for different people but the connotations it has are certainly ones of extremity. It is not a term I would think of for a small bolt and if I did think of it for a small bolt it would be one of potentially stripping a bolt or threads or causing some damage.

In a situation like that I would want to make sure my equipment is not under that kind of stress regardless of where it is unless it is completely unavoidable but in that case it would be designed for that more than likely. Touring in the U.S. is a bit easier especially if you live in the U.S. traveling abroad can pose more issues in getting parts and finding shops in certain areas and in some cases compatibility. I would want to try to avoid issues especially with my rack. OMM makes excellent racks but still I would rather just fix the problem then adding stress to a system designed to carry a lot of weight without any shock absorption capabilities.

Conti tires for the most part are rather difficult to install for many folks especially on more modern tubeless compatible rims. Older rims can sometimes be a little easier sometimes but they can still be quite a task. Some mechanics have a gift but most that I have seen including 30 year veterans have had issues on one or another. If you want a real challenge, try Challenge open tubular tires. I literally spent an entire hour trying to install one of their tires for the first time. Granted now it comes off and installs easily after it has settled and stretched a bit but that initial time was tough and I popped at least 2 tubes.

There is no emotion seen or shown here just so you are aware. I am not attempting to be nasty towards you or anyone and if I was I would be clear about that. If I truly don't like someone I don't need to hold back I was raised to be honest so I try to do so in my daily life. Honesty can sometimes come across as negativity or something along those lines but I assure you I am not trying to do that. I hope we can move forward but if not have a great tour and good luck with your search.

dmeans2anend

Veganbikes,

For the love of this BF community, please just move on to another thread....

In all honesty, without any disrespect, I sincerely do not feel that I have received any useful feedback with respect to your comments. At this point, we are BOTH simply wasting time... I release you from any obligation to assist me any further with my question. There is no resentment or hard feelings but let us not beat this issue to death.

As for the need to practice working on the bike, I am quite capable and is very proficient. I don't need any additional time wrenching on my bike. I simply choose to spend my valuable time on other more important things that I have to do. These back and forth commentary are not one of them and definitely, NOT constructive or beneficial to either one of us.

Let just agree that you and I have different approach to doing things. As an engineer, I am trained to think outside of the box and I am a bit more analytical about 'processes' for tackling a problem. I don't necessary feel the need to jump right in to 'wrench' on something to solve a question. If I can sit back and figure a way for getting a problem solved more efficiently, I will do that. If this means, asking the community of BF for help with their knowledge and experience with this specific question so be it. That however, does not mean that I expect someone to work on their bike to get me that information. For experience bike tourers, having a 'spare derailleur hanger' in their repair kit is not usual. I'm hoping someone in the community with my same bike have already explore this question and would know the answer.

It's that simple. Let's not complicate things.

Hence, I am seeking that rare unicorn for information.

And if you don't have it, move on..... There is no offense taken for not being able to answer my question.

I wish you peace, joy, and many happy hours on your bike.

Troul 

can you post some closer pictures from the non drive side look towards the hub section, but far enough back that it shows the chain stays & seat stays?

veganbikes

WOW! So much to unpack, holy moly pizza cannoli this is loaded. However it sounds like you are all set in life when a problems comes along you can always figure out a really complicated way to do it that circles around the problem but never solves it because you don't like anyone else's advice. Also if you travel to a country and ask for help and they speak in a different language they probably either don't understand you or maybe actually trying to help even if you don't like what they say. Good luck on your tour!

To anyone else looking to figure out what derailleur hanger they need; you will need to remove your rear wheel and look at the current derailleur hanger and compare that to ones you have looked up for your model and year of bicycle. WheelsMFG is a good help especially once you know how many bolts it has and have a good knowledge of what the old one looks like.

If you are someone riding your bike often especially farther away from your home and you find removing your rear wheel difficult as some people in this thread have found, it is a good thing to practice. Not practicing and figuring out the best way to make it easy will make it difficult when you need to fix a flat on the side of the road. Typically a flat tire comes at the least opportune time and with racks and chainguards and other things that could complicate things you want to be able to do it quickly and easily so you can get back to riding. The more you do it the easier it becomes and if you do it at home or in a easy no stress environment or have to do it for some other purpose (like looking at your derailleur hanger or cleaning your frame) it will help for the inevitable time it is pouring rain, your tire is flat, there isn't shelter and you are cold and want to get moving quickly.

dmeans2anend

VeganBikes,

Now that you touted how much knowledge you have, made false presumptions about me and my level of bike experience and knowledge, and is still not able to answer my original question, can you move on now?

Or is it your intention to hold this thread hostage?

I give up. You win. You're so wise, you're so capable, and you're so experienced. I'm definitely not worthy. Satisfied?

To All You All that had the Misfortune of Reading this complete thread:
I sincerely apologize for wasting your time. I didn't realize that when I started this thread with my question that it would illicit this type of 'drama' and BS. It is all a bit ridiculous. I take responsibility for not having the wisdom to heed Trakhak's advice early on and simply 'ignore'. I got pulled down the rabbit hole to justify myself in the belief that there are those that was truly trying to help. I will refrain from further comments unless positive or relevant to the original question. Nameste to you all.

Camilo

I don't understand why an extended discussion (or even a single post!) and the effort of taking and posting pictures is more efficient or easier than just looking at your derailleur hanger and deciding for your self. I just can't imagine any better way of figuring this out. - how can anyone possibly help you better than you could figure it out for yourself? The two hangers are just so distinctively different from each other that it should be obvious which to order. If neither seems to match yours, that would be the time to post decent pictures and ask the question. Oh well, that's social media in the 21st century I guess.

Camilo

I agree with your basic advice that seems so controversial: just look at it!

Being inspired to get some derailleur hangers before I actually need them, I took a quick look at the website and then at my wife's bike hanging in the garage. It's so easy to tell if it's a single or multi bolt attachment, I could tell from a distance and didn't need to take off the wheel to look at how the hanger's attached and see the two tiny mounting holes. On the other bike, it's just as easy to see that it's a single bolt. I'm not an engineer, but that's the only way I'd trust to figure this out.

BillyD

I’m going to close this to curtail any further animosity. Some people just never find an argument they don’t like, especially if it makes them feel more knowledgeable than someone else. Always a pissing contest. smh