Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Automoto Frame?

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Automoto Frame?

Old 01-08-23, 09:59 PM
  #1  
Yelbom15
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Yelbom15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Liked 107 Times in 46 Posts
Automoto Frame?

Is it true that you can never trust a frame by it’s lugs? I came across this and just wasn’t too sure. I’ve been on the look out for another Automoto for a while. I only assume due to me seeing a couple other Automotos out there with the same designed lugs at the head tube and seat cluster.

How does one know at all what frame they have when there’s so many that share the same design?

The frame looks to have been repainted? An odd faint silver covering it unless that’s from the flash.

Any guesses?







Last edited by Yelbom15; 01-08-23 at 10:06 PM.
Yelbom15 is offline  
Likes For Yelbom15:
Old 01-09-23, 03:37 AM
  #2  
smontanaro 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Evanston, IL
Posts: 5,859

Bikes: many

Mentioned: 61 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1434 Post(s)
Liked 1,362 Times in 747 Posts
You might ask on the framebuilders forum. There's a lot of lug knowledge there.
__________________
Monti Special
smontanaro is offline  
Old 01-09-23, 09:49 PM
  #3  
kroozer 
vintage motor
 
kroozer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Tepic, Nayarit, Mexico
Posts: 1,589

Bikes: 48 Automoto, 49 Stallard, 50 Rotrax, 62 Jack Taylor, 67 Atala, 68 Lejeune, 72-74-75 Motobecanes, 73 RIH, 71 Zieleman, 74 Raleigh, 78 Windsor, 83 Messina (Villata), 84 Brazzo (Losa), 85 Davidson, 90 Diamondback, 92 Kestrel

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 160 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 100 Times in 77 Posts
I don't think those lugs were specific to Automoto. Are there any other identifying marks? Looks pretty nice whatever it is.
kroozer is offline  
Old 01-09-23, 10:17 PM
  #4  
Manny66 
Senior Member
 
Manny66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Whittier
Posts: 862

Bikes: 1973 Colnago Super, Litespeed Classic , Automoto , Pinarello Gavia TSX,Eddy Merckx Corsa Extra,Eddy Merckx EMX-5 , 1982 Moser SL, Concorde TSX, Vitus 979 KAS. Diamant SLX,60's Meteor

Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 233 Post(s)
Liked 922 Times in 318 Posts




Automoto before and after pics.

The Clover lugs are the usual indicator,,but thats not always the case.

There is a French Website that can probably help you out .
Manny66 is offline  
Likes For Manny66:
Old 01-10-23, 05:37 AM
  #5  
smontanaro 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Evanston, IL
Posts: 5,859

Bikes: many

Mentioned: 61 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1434 Post(s)
Liked 1,362 Times in 747 Posts
Ah, yes, tontonvelo.com. And you'll get to brush up on your high school French.
__________________
Monti Special
smontanaro is offline  
Likes For smontanaro:
Old 01-10-23, 10:35 AM
  #6  
cinelliguy 
Full Member
 
cinelliguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Redwood City CA
Posts: 290

Bikes: 57 ExpressWerke, 58 CinelliB, 62 CinelliB Altenberger, 70 Cinelli SC, 71 Witcomb, 76 Masi, 77 C Laing, 80 Jack Taylor, 78 Ritchey, 82 Appel, 82 Davidson, 85 Ironman, 04 Peter Johnson, 91 Ed Litton, 11 Bianchi

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked 426 Times in 126 Posts
Need a head tube and badge image.

Guy
Redwood City CA
cinelliguy is offline  
Likes For cinelliguy:
Old 01-10-23, 10:43 AM
  #7  
smontanaro 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Evanston, IL
Posts: 5,859

Bikes: many

Mentioned: 61 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1434 Post(s)
Liked 1,362 Times in 747 Posts
Originally Posted by cinelliguy
Need a head tube and badge image.
OTOH, I just need a badge like the one shown. Anybody?
__________________
Monti Special
smontanaro is offline  
Old 01-10-23, 06:23 PM
  #8  
dddd
Ride, Wrench, Swap, Race
 
dddd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Northern California
Posts: 9,170

Bikes: Cheltenham-Pedersen racer, Boulder F/S Paris-Roubaix, Varsity racer, '52 Christophe, '62 Continental, '92 Merckx, '75 Limongi, '76 Presto, '72 Gitane SC, '71 Schwinn SS, etc.

Mentioned: 132 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1554 Post(s)
Liked 1,273 Times in 845 Posts
Might be Oscar Egg lugs there, which I recall came on the top-of-line Automoto bikes from the 1950's, but I suspect that those bikes were contracted out as some were also branded as E. Christophe.
These pro-level bikes didn't use Automoto's signature cylindrical fork crown or their clover-pattern headlugs, either.

Here's one branded as E. Christophe:

dddd is offline  
Old 01-10-23, 07:39 PM
  #9  
Feldman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,175
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Liked 70 Times in 50 Posts
Originally Posted by Yelbom15
Is it true that you can never trust a frame by it’s lugs? I came across this and just wasn’t too sure. I’ve been on the look out for another Automoto for a while. I only assume due to me seeing a couple other Automotos out there with the same designed lugs at the head tube and seat cluster.

How does one know at all what frame they have when there’s so many that share the same design?

The frame looks to have been repainted? An odd faint silver covering it unless that’s from the flash.

Any guesses?






The lugs are Nervex Legere from the 50's; I built a Columbus SLX frame with them for a friend about 15 years ago. Bought them fro. Ceeway.
Feldman is offline  
Old 01-14-23, 05:03 AM
  #10  
martl
Strong Walker
 
martl's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 1,316

Bikes: too many

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 332 Post(s)
Liked 481 Times in 252 Posts
Yep Automoto moved away from their clover leaf lugs and the barrel style fork crown roughly around the end of WW2, at least for the top line racing frames, I believe the utilitarian bikes kept them longer. Pre war Automotos are a bit complicated because it is hard to distinguish between a bike that was born as a racing frame, and a more lower end gents bike that has just lost the fenders, panniers and lighting... They all have huge wheel bases and clearance

As has been mentioned, the headbadge design can be used to date it, it changed frequently and is well documented. Here are mine:




martl is offline  
Likes For martl:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.