rasmubur000

Hi, my bike has an Alfine 11 gear hub that I bought used and has probably 3-4 years of use, riding many times a week commuting for the 2 years I have owned it.

The past month, it has started to get more apparent that the rear wheel makes a "shhk" sound once every rotation of the wheel. It is more pronounced when I am riding it rather than spinning the wheel when I have it upside down.
I took it into the bike shop last week, and they were able to confirm that it wasn't anything else but the hub.
I don't have any bike shops around that are able to do a full rework if it needed something replaced, so is there anyone who has had this issue or could point me to any resources on how to diagnose the hub?

It's my only form of transportation, so shipping the hub away for repairs isn't very viable or cheap, so I'd like to be able to learn how to fix it myself.

Thanks for any help!
-Burton

aggiegrads

Have you verified that the hub is adjusted properly (Yellow tabs aligned in 4th gear)?

sweeks

This is interesting because I have a similar issue. I'm not sure it's a "problem", because the hub (Alfine 11) works perfectly. It has almost 9,000 miles on it, and has been well-maintained (oil changes every 700-1,000 miles). Ever since the last oil change (approximately), the hub has been making a soft "chirp" once per revolution. I've checked fenders and stays, and brake alignment and ruled those out. The sound is actually a bi-modal sort of thing, more like "CHIRP chirp", the frequency of which does *not* change with wheel speed, i.e., the rate varies with wheel speed, but the pitch of the chirp is constant. Also, like your noise, it only occurs when I am seated and riding the bike. This would seem to point toward the tire, but there is clearance everywhere. If I pump the tire up to the maximum pressure (60 psi), the sound is markedly reduced... again, suggesting the tire. Aside from verifying the clearances, I would think that a tire contact would change its pitch with increasing speed. So I'm mildly puzzled. Could this be a spoke tension thing? The spokes all "ping" about the same when tapped with a screwdriver. I will eventually have to try removing the fenders completely, and checking the spoke tension quantitatively. Anyway, FWIW!

BTW, the Alfine 11 marks align in gear 6, not gear 4. (Post #2)
Of course, with an Alfine 11 that's "new-to-you", you should change the oil so you can rule that out as a potential issue.
EDIT: I guess it's not new to you, but if you haven't changed the oil for a while, that would be a good place to start. FWIW, I've been using Royal Purple "MaxGear" gear oil, 75W-140. This oil is very similar to the "official" Shimano oil, but much less expensive. 75W-90 would work as well.

veganbikes

I would get the hub serviced. If you are a regular rider and complaining it is your only transportation not taking care of it is not an option. You may need to leave it at a shop and let them tune up the bike and replace oil at the very least.
Yes it could just be misaligned and need adjustment but 2 years of known heavy riding and another 2 years of potentially unknown riding which could have been worse or better not that it matters would require some servicing.

If you only ride a bike and cannot fathom getting around without it you need a second bike so you can drop off your bikes for service and leave them and get them properly serviced regularly. Problems don't get better they just get worse and worse until they get really expensive and the bike is quite dangerous to ride. I know it is tough to think about but either you need to leave the bike and have a backup bike or you need to have other ways to get around.

Keep your bike in good condition and take really good care of it and it will last a long time and serve you well.

sweeks

I'm hoping to get a response from Dan Burkhart and others with experience with the Shimano Alfine-11 hub. Mine has started making a disturbing (and embarrassing) noise.
The hub has 10,500 miles on it and has had the oil changed every 600-700 miles since it was new.
The shift cable adjustment has always been on the mark.
The oil was changed recently (on schedule) but after the noise started. No metal bits were noticed or anything else unusual. The amount of oil recovered has always been close to 25 ml.
The hub shifts normally (ie, flawlessly) at all times.
The noise is a rapid sequence of low-frequency "knocking" sounds when the hub is under load. It happens with pressure on either pedal. It sounds like the chain is running over a frame element or other solid part of the bike. It isn't. I can feel the vibration through the pedals. The noise is present is all the gears and sounds the same, as long as the hub is under load. The bike coasts silently and smoothly, and there is no lateral play in the wheel. I have never opened the hub.
I've ruled out the pedals and their couplers. The bottom bracket is relatively new, and the cranks spin smoothly with the chain off (not tested under load though). The chain is not worn out, and the chainring and rear cog are relatively un-worn. The chainring bolts are tight. The chain is not rubbing on the cassette joint.
The weird thing is that the noise got markedly worse after I removed the wheel to repair a flat... this makes me hopeful that the noise is not from the hub, but as I've said the chain path is free of interferences and I've tried to account for all other possible sources.
I am prepared to remove the hub and open it to inspect for worn parts. I have a serviceable Nexus 8 red-band hub and shifter that I can put on the bike, but obviously I'd rather not.
It seems unlikely (to me) that there could be something inside the hub that's so wrong that this noise is produced without interfering with the shifting.
Any suggestions as to what I could try to sort this out will be most appreciated.
Steve

Dan Burkhart 

Well, it sounds like you have at least considered most of the possible external sources if not completely ruled them out.
I really don’t have any thoughts on what could be an internal cause of your symptoms.
Do you have another bike you can swap the wheel into? I’m thinking it could still be an external issue such as cranks, bottom bracket, pedals, or even saddle or seat post. Those types of sounds are elusive and often very difficult to isolate.
Or you can swap in the Nexus wheel and see if the issue persists.

sweeks

Thanks for the reply, Dan.
I am going to put the bike up on the stand this weekend and give it another very close look. If I don't see anything obvious, I plan to take the wheel off and take the sprocket off and inspect the shift mechanism hoping to find something. It stands to reason that the noise comes from outside the hub because it changed so drastically by simply taking the wheel off and replacing it. But if nothing is obvious, I'll probably go to the 8-speed hub. If I do that, then I'll probably take a look inside the Alfine-11 and see what it looks like. I will post any interesting findings.
This just occurred to me: I can swap in the 8-speed wheel and *not* change the shifter... yet. The Nexus hub will be in its lowest gear, but I will be able to hear the noise if it's from any place but the hub.
Thanks again!
Steve

tcs

Hours of entertaining reading on Alfine 11 faults, problems and solutions:

https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=64432

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/alfine-11.html#reliability

Outrider1

Brilliant thread jack.

sweeks

Preliminary report is in. I installed a wheel with a Nexus 8-speed ("Red Band") hub and the noise is absent. The hub is in its lowest gear, as I didn't want to commit to the re-fitting an 8-speed shifter, but stomp as I would, the noise would not appear. With the Alfine 11, the noise was present in all gears.
So I'm going to finalize the conversion from Verge S11i to Verge S8i. If the 11-speed hub can be repaired, I can go back at my leisure.
FWIW, I'm not complaining about the Alfine hub; it has up until now been dead-reliable, and it has 10,600 miles on it.

When I took the chainring off to clean it, I noticed some pretty severe wear on the teeth. The chainring is rather thin, IMO, for a bike that uses a single-speed chain. I was sort of hoping the noise was somehow due to the chain sliding from side-to-side. No such luck.
I'll post findings of anything I notice when I open the Alfine.

Dan Burkhart 

One thought that occurs to me is that the 11 speed has helical gears on the low range drive. This creates end thrust which could and probably would wear on contact points over time.
Truth is, I have never been inside an 11 speed unit, so I can't really offer much more.

sweeks

I'll take pictures and post them. If you have any particular views you'd like to see, just let me know!

sweeks

Well... the Nexus 8-speed hub I switched to was making its own unhappy noise. Less loud and less gritty than the alfine, but clearly not healthy, or so I thought. The nexus hub had about 9,000 miles on it with annual oil dip and greased bearings. Like the 11-speed, it was shifting perfectly... just making worrisome noises under load.
Luckily, I have yet another Nexus 8-speed hub, which has been used on my "winter" bike. Its total mileage is less than the other. I installed it today and took it for a shakedown ride; it is smooth and silent.
Now that I have reliable transport, I can look into the problems with the other hubs.

sweeks

I finally got around to opening the Alfine 11-speed hub. Inside everything looks pristine. There is no visible wear on the bearing surfaces. I haven't done any disassembly of the gear cluster as yet. It seems to me unlikely that there wouldn't at least be metal bits visible if the grinding noise was coming from inside the hub. I'm thinking of putting it back together.
Any thoughts are welcome!


Non-Drive-Side hub seal and bearing.



View from the Drive Side. Outer race shows no wear after 10,600 miles.



Non-Drive-Side inner race nicely polished but otherwise un-worn.



Oblique view of the NDS end of the gear cluster.



Side view of gear cluster.

sweeks

This morning I decided to look a little deeper inside the hub, so I removed the "Jesus clip" and took the top gear module off for inspection. I didn't see any metal bits, worn gears or sticking or misaligned pawls, so I decided to just put it back together (no bearing free play ) and trust that the noise was from something outside the hub. The sprocket was pretty well-worn, as seen in the image below.

Inner gears, clutches, bearings all look good.



More clean and unworn gears.



Inside view of one of the modules.



Old sprocket (top) and new one.