flangehead

The tailgating thread reminded me of a recent observation.


To go straight at a red light with a right-turn-only lane, I pulled in behind a Tesla; dunno model/year. I could see a big screen in the center console and it was showing animated cars moving around, but did not pick me up.


Does anyone know if that is normal or if I was just exceptionally stealthy that day?


I've thought it through and I don't think the answer will change my behavior any, but as machines replace human capabilities, I like to know what the machine's capabilities are.

Leisesturm

What I know is that the technology CAN pick you up. I don't have nearly enough information to say anything about the actual Tesla in question. Not all Tesla's are self driving. I'm not sure ANY are. They are driver ASSIST. Those back-up cameras to keep people from backing up over toddlers can't PREVENT a driver from doing it. They can show you what is behind you. Maybe even provide some kind of audible warning. They can't actually prevent the car from moving dangerously. You say the cars display showed cars MOVING around the stopped vehicle. Was that actually the case? Were you also moving? Why should it display you if you were not actually a moving hazard that the Tesla operator should know/care about?

I-Like-To-Bike

Just a guess, but perhaps the Tesla console display is designed to provide information to the driver, not passersby, and be viewed from the front seat by the driver (or front seat passenger) and not by people at a distance and location somewhere outside the car.

Hypno Toad

I don't know about Tesla, but I've had a few Volvos that have collision avoidance that includes IDing people on bikes (see promo video). I've had the car auto brake for deer, but never a bike (I'm looking for the bike-folks out-and-about). The guy driving the car, he reaction at the end of the commercial is kinda mild ... I've let out some loud profanity when it's happened.

livedarklions

That wouldn't explain why he was able to see the animated cars from behind, so probably not a great guess.

Cyclist0108

I'm wondering if the other vehicles have to be moving in order to show up?

I also wonder how much of a distraction it is to have something that looks like a 17" Macbook Pro screen open while driving?

flangehead

I was stopped about 5-10 feet behind and the big screen caught my attention. I'd never seen such a thing before. I remember seeing animated "cars" on the screen both moving and stopped (at various times) in the lanes to the right and left, and it was showing what I was seeing happen "in real life". It displayed no vehicle behind.

It may be that since I posed no threat to the Tesla or its operator, the machine chose to ignore my presence. That may be an oversight in the programming.. I would think that the potential for scratched paint or lower range due to dragging my body along under the car would be a potential hazard.

I-Like-To-Bike

Did the OP claim that he detected anything "picked up" on the driver's screen display about vehicles behind the Tesla, animated or not ? I must have missed that.

Of course we will just have to guess what the display was supposed to be displaying. Presumably nothing intended for bicyclists peeking inside. A driver planning on moving in a forward direction from a traffic signal has little need for an electronic display to see vehicles stopped directly behind; if he is curious about that, an old tech rear view mirror still should fill that need.

livedarklions

OP wasn't asking for guesses, but I have seen video of Tesla screens that do show traffic behind the car. Maybe stick to educated guesses?

sarhog

No more of a distraction than all the gauges, dials, and lights on your dashboard.

I-Like-To-Bike

Or it may not be an oversight in the programming for vehicles with the transmission set for forward direction (ie. not in reverse.) Displaying vehicles that are stopped behind on a screen is not likely to ever reduce the alleged "potential for scratched paint" or change the alleged "potential hazard" for a bicyclist somehow getting dragging forward under the Tesla as the Tesla proceeds forward from the traffic signal.

livedarklions

Right, there has to be some selection in what items are shown and what aren't.

There's definitely a potential question of information overload and I'm wondering if anyone reading this thread actually has seen one of these screens in operation.

tomato coupe

Why would it?

tyrion

The Tesla bicycle visibility software upgrade costs an extra $2000. Not everyone cares about bicycle visibility, so no need to pay for something you're not going to use.

/s

Hypno Toad

It is a guess ... but I use the Garmin Varia (radar), it doesn't report vehicles that are stopped, moving at the same pace, or going in the other direction. Garmin set it up to only report overtaking vehicles.

It seems logical that Tesla (while in drive) wouldn't need to report a stationary vehicle behind it.

There's gotta be at least one Tesla drivers in BF ... right?

genec

They are approaching the vehicle, and could become involved with the actions the vehicle or driver has to take. I typically use rear view mirrors to stay aware of vehicles approaching from behind... this is especially important if I plan on changing lanes.

Granted ,there are countries that teach a form of "organic" driving, that excludes those behind you... but then they also tend to avoid using turn signals for lane changes too...

tomato coupe

Already answered ...

I-Like-To-Bike

​​​​​​​
​​​​​​​

Bald Paul

As a retired automotive professional (regional troubleshooter / instructor for an import car manufacturer) I've had quite a bit of experience with driver assist systems.
I can tell you this: NONE of them are foolproof. Camera based systems sometimes have trouble identifying things like cyclists, or even stationary poles. The "self driving car" is a myth with current technology and road systems / conditions.

downhillmaster

Why?
The thread was started by someone guessing at what they may have seen; on a small screen at a distance through the rear of a vehicle.
Nothing educated about your response or the entire OP so no reason to start now.

AlmostTrick

I can't speak of your incident(s) but the guy driving in the video failed. He should have noticed the dislodged grate and anticipated that the cyclist would want to avoid it. Cyclist failed too. Should have positioned himself to avoid it much sooner in a safe manner. Surely it's folly to count on these auto detection systems (as a driver or cyclist) but maybe they can help reduce some crashes.

gregf83 

Depends somewhat on the age of the Tesla. More recent models have more capable computers. The image recognition on my son’s model 3 is very good and constantly being upgraded every few weeks. The cameras pick up traffic cones, pedestrians, cyclists and can read signs. It’s not perfect but with the number of Tesla’s on the road they’re able to collect massive amounts of information used to train the neural networks used to control the car.

The training of the car is selective in that they will collect relevant information for a particular feature like figuring out how to identify traffic cones. The sensors in the front of the car are more sophisticated and the information more important so it’s not surprising they don’t identify items behind the car as well as things in front. I doubt it attempts to read signs behind it and cyclists or pedestrians behind the vehicle aren’t important when driving forwards.

Hypno Toad

For me, my near collision was a deer at dawn (same thing has happened with a deer for Frau Toad too) ... the deer crossing in front of the vehicle, because of low light I didn't see it coming, and based on past experience, I'd have hit the deer, but the Volvo auto-braking 'sees' the deer and stops the vehicle violently to avoid the collision. In the vehicle, you feel the full force of your seatbelt keeping you from slamming into the dashboard, and alarms go off too. Frankly, I'm surprised I didn't destroy my undies!

To the Volvo promo video, I'd say the marketers did their best to create an 'unexpected' situation that neither the person driving or biking would expect. In the marketing video, I don't know that the person driving should have known there was a obstacle in the road, from the driver's seat, you likely wouldn't see the cover is off. Based on my days driving a commercial vehicle, there are no accidences, only crashes. All road users need to look for the unexpected. That said, I don't think I've ever had a person driving anticipate an obstacle in my way while I'm biking. While biking (or driving), I need to know what's in my path, and what's coming up behind me. If I'm riding and get surprised like by an obstacle in my path, I'll slow or stop until I know I can safely get around it ... BTW, I'd do the same thing if I'm driving my car too.

I agree, never trust the tech! Our car offers many of the Tesla-type of tech, it helps me, but I'm still 100% responsible for my vehicle. And like you, I hope this tech can help us reduce collisions and deaths/injuries.

AlmostTrick

Wow, that's a truly impressive account of what these systems can do! Thanks for posting.

My one deer incident while driving happened 20 or so years ago, so no avoidance systems. I was on the highway exit ramp early in the morning on my way to work, probably still traveling 35-40 mph. Before I even realized I saw the deer, the incident was over. I had instinctively braked, was now traveling about 10 mph, and the deer was up and running away with no apparent injury. Zero damage to my car. The bumper had what looked like sweat on it.

Thankfully, even though I see them often, I've not had a deer incident while on the bike. But I do ride early mornings when it is still dark out, so I'm extra attentive. Especially when riding downhill, where I will limit my speed. If I ever do crash into one, I certainly don't want it to be at 30+ mph!

Hypno Toad

IDK ... but this story seems to belong in this thread: Police Ask Tesla To Drive In Straight Line, Recite Alphabet Backwards After Vehicle Crashes Into Tree