machinist42

Well, as I noted in a previous post responding to Doug Fattic's question, my '73 SS has standard 1" external threading and any old 1" headset should (and did) work?

The inside diameter of my '73 SS differs from the standard 1" steerer, not the outside diameter. The LeTour fork listed on ebay has the "different" inside diameter of the 70s SSs, which means the OP would have to find a stem with that quirky spec to replace the hacksawed original?

I don't know for certain, but I don't think the LeTour had the slack angles of the SS, so the rake of the forks would not be the same?

Plug and Play would require a SS forks, and a new .833 stem?

Figuarus

As far as the stem is concerned, im sure i have so.ething lying around that could work. I have collected a number of bits and pieces from other bikes over the years and might have something available. If not, there is a bike junkyard of sorts not far from where I work that may have what I need. They get donated bikes and tear them down and catalogue the parts.

Ill check out what they may have available and report back.

Doug Fattic 

Figuarus, I'm not sure your original fork is toast. It may be bent all out of whack but that doesn't mean it is destroyed. After all your fork blades were bent 2" just to create the rake. Send me the fork and I will try to straighten it out. The cost to you will be shipping and a promise to not do any damage on future repairs. I've got all the right equipment and knowledge to make it right. I can also melt out the remaining stem stuck in the steerer. I've done that many times over my career.

BTW, I was one of those original Americans that had to go to Europe to learn how to build frames right after the bike boom in 70/71. I've been teaching framebuilding classes steadily since 1976. Covid has increased interest in making steel frames. You will find my online posts mostly in framebuilding forums.

The reason I like Super Sports is because my dad got me one for Christmas in 1965. It was an upgrade for a cheaper 10 speed he got me from Western Auto in 1963. In the 60's when no adult rode a bicycle for recreation, I couldn't find any information about bicycles anywhere. The Notre Dame University library (with the big touchdown Jesus mosaic on the outside),had a booklet for Boy Scouts on bicycle safety. My freshman year in college the men's dorm put on a 7 mile bicycle race. About 10 guys showed up with single speed newspaper bicycles and maybe a couple of English 3 speeds. However one of my high school classmates came on a Super Sport and won the race 2 minutes faster than me (I still remember my time of 21 minutes 21 seconds - or about 19 mph). He said he had spent the summer going to many bike stores and figured out the Super Sport was the best bicycle. Why he didn't say a Paramount is still a mystery to me. Since I didn't know anyone that knew more, that became the bicycle I wanted. I also didn't realize at the time my genetics weren't as good as his and he still would have won if I had been on a Paramount. Some years ago I called him to see what happened to his Super Sport. Sadly Viet Nam had done major damage to his mind.

email me using my first and last name all lower case with no spaces in-between. After the AT, use q (a lower case Q) t (as in Tom) and m (as in Mary). and then it is dot net.

Figuarus

Just sent you a PM. Thanks doug!

madpogue 

^^^^^ WOW. The bike's cool factor will double, just for having a part worked on by Doug Fattic.

Figuarus

Well, while I am waiting on this fork situation to get resolved, I took some time to start cleaning up the frame and get it ready for paint. (VERY CAREFULLY)

I spent some time looking up info here and found a site to decode the serial number. According to Bikehistory.org, I have a 1972 Super Sport. I was looking through the 72 Schwinn catalog they have listed, and noted that the catalog says mine should have quick-release wheels. I do have a front quick release, but the rear is a regular nut and washer wheel. Was quick-release only used on the front? Is it possible I have a replacement rear wheel?

Jeff Wills

Well, sort of... The fillet-brazed Schwinns used the same headset dimensions as most other Schwinns of the era- even the kids' bikes (Bantam, Pixie, Sting-Ray) used the same dimensions. There were two headsets (I think): a "standard" and a "deluxe". I found a NOS deluxe headset when I was restoring my Superior: Green Superior after paint | Black Magic Paint removed the h… | Flickr

That being said, the Schwinn headsets are not the same dimensions as the "Euopean" headsets (Campagnolo, etc.). As long as the chrome isn't peeling off the Schwinn headset just clean it up, apply new grease, and it's good for another 50 years.

If the headset is totally trashed or missing, BMX bikes used the same dimensions as Schwinn headsets up until they switched to 1 1/8" threadless setups. Good quality Tange headsets are available from BMX suppliers.

Aside from my Superior (above) I also have a Super Sport that I turned into a three-speed: Burgundy Super Sport | Flickr

Jeff Wills

Yes, the rear wheel probably was replaced. In that era, 27" wheels were as common as dirt. Is the rim on the rear wheel the same as on the front wheel?

Jeff Wills

Hi, Doug- as I wrote in a couple posts thataway ^^^ , the Schwinns of that era used 1" x 24 tpi threading on the fork. 0.833" (13/16") inside diameter.

Always remember to leave an offering to Saint Sheldon: Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Headset Dimension Crib Sheet

machinist42

As I detailed in my post, the standard 1" no-name headset from my mid 70s Ron Cooper fit fine on my 1973 Schwinn Super Sport.
I can't speak to your '78 (?) Superior. Did you try to fit a "regular" headset? How do the "dimensions differ?"

All this is beside the point.
Doug found his 1965 Super Sport would not accept a "normal" 1" headset, as the threading is different? I experimented with my '73 Super Sport. I discovered a "standard" 1" headset fits. The steerer of the early '60s Super Sport is different from the steerer of the early '70s Super Sport. The stem from my 1964 Super Sport is too wide to fit in the steerer of my 1973 Super Sport. I'm sure Doug is correct that a standard 1" headset won't work on the early '60s Super Sport, but I have not yet verified his finding on my 1964 Super Sport.
Because Lazy.

The OP's Super Sport is he says from 1972.
I am not aware of any damage to his headset which would require replacement.
The issue you were addressing is moot, and irrelevant.
My experimentation was to inform the OP he could use a "regular" forks to replace his mangled one.
My answer is moot and now irrelevant as Doug has kindly offered to mend the OP's forks.

Doug Fattic 

I just checked again if the standard threading on a 1" English headset fits the threading on my 60's Super Sport and it does. Before I checked this time I cleaned the SS's threads and made sure there were no burrs or other interference like damaged threads. Thanks to those that provided me with greater information.

The OP sent me pictures of his fork. While there are some big fork blade bent issues, it won't be a problem to fix. I'll use Johnny Berry's fork alignment fixture I bought from his widow in Manchester in 1975. Johnny probably had it made pre WWII. I still use his bench vise as my primary vise and his cast iron alignment surface plate is what most of my framebuilding class students use when they are building their frames.

I'll melt out his cut off aluminum stem. I'll measure its ø 1st. I'll use one of my rosebud tips designed to work with my oxypropne setup. My online explanation on how to switch from acetylene to propane with an oxygen concentrator for brazing has had thousands and thousands of views. Obviously the majority aren't building frames so my instructions must have gotten in the mainstream somehow. Propane is cheaply and easily available everywhere while the sales and transport of acetylene is often very restricted.

Replacement forks that work as well as the original would be very hard to find. Not everyone is acquainted with rake, brake clearance and steerer length including thread length. If any one of those variables are off, it can interfere with the quality of the ride - even if it has been made to somehow work.

Vintage Schwinn

FIGARO: those ferrules that attach to the brake levers where the cable exits from ARE INCLUDED in the BELL Pitcrew 600 Replacement Cable Set which SELLS for $10 at Walmart stores and Walmart Online and ACE HARDWARE Online.
------Those things are included....you get TWO of them, and they are Quality pieces!!!--------
Of course you also get two Brake Cables, two Shift Cables, and the other ferrule-bushings for the going over the end of a cut cable sheath......where it (the cable) enters and exists the frame's cable guides too.. YOU WILL NEED A QUALITY Brake Cable Cutter pliers-tool IN ORDER TO MAKE CLEAN CUTS IN THE BRAKE CABLE and THE SHEATH HOUSING IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE THE BLACK COLORED SHEATH HOUSING PROVIDED WITH this Bell Pitcrew 600 Cable Set. A Dremel with a cut-off wheel will also do the job adequately in lieu of Brake Cable Cutters.
You see the BELL Pitcrew 600 Replacement Cable Set COMES WITH BOTH STYLES OF BRAKE CABLE ENDS........one style that Traditionally is seen on TOURIST LEVERS & MOUNTAIN BIKES (this has the brake cable end that looks like a big ASPIRIN tablet).................the other style is a narrower mushroomed bullet shape which is commonly seen on ROAD BIKE LEVERS.
Because as the cables are supplied in the BELL Pitcrew 600 CABLE SET, ----THERE IS A tourist-mountain ON ONE END and THE IS A road bike ON THE OPPOSITE END , OF EACH OF THE TWO SUPPLIED BRAKE CABLES And You Have To Cut Off The End Type That You DO NOT NEED !!

The Bell Pitcrew 600 Cable Set is certainly a decent package and a bargain for the $10 cost, however the Black Cable Sheath that is provided may not be as high quality as the original equipment Cable Sheath that is on your bike. As to the cables themselves (the stranded wire...), I find them to be as good as anyone provides in replacements. You are also given a sufficient length of cable that should do the largest frame sizes of the Seventies which were typically larger than today's frame size offerings.

Figuarus

Dang it! I knew i had seen that end before! I didnt even think to check! I just ordered the ends from the ebay seller linked early in this thread. Oh well. Thanks for the heads up though!

Figuarus

An update of sorts.

I have spent the last few days getting the frame ready for paint. I've taken the rear derailleur apart, cleaned and lubed it, and spent two days debating on a brushed aluminum vs polished finish for the brake calipers.

I haven't heard from Doug yet, so my fork situation is still kind of in limbo. I did order a fork from a gentleman in Colorado, and we confirmed it is ALMOST the same fork, just has a 3/32nd longer steer tube. I'll know more about it and post some pictures when it arrives.

In the meantime, I goofed when I ordered the brake end cap. I didn't realize they were coming from France. Now I'm waiting until at least the 28th before I am able to run all my cables.

I wish I had more news, But this is it for now. I'm slowly polishing up most of the aluminum bits of the bike. I'm hoping that by Friday, I'll have that done, and I can focus on painting the frame.

Figuarus

Sorry, I forgot to answer this question.

Yes, as near as I could tell, both wheels are the same, but it's the rear hub that has a solid axle as opposed to a quick release. I was considering finding a quick release hub and lacing it into the wheel. I did manage to find one, but was unsure as to whether it would work.
This is the hub I found : https://www.ebay.com/itm/393332752798

madpogue 

Unless you want to use it as an opportunity to learn how to lace wheels, that's a lot of work just to get a QR. Another option would be to swap in a QR axle.

Figuarus

I mean, I could use the experience, but I was under the impression that I couldn't just swap the axle. Is it really just the case of unscrewing the axle and screwing in the QR axle?

top506

I suspect the cones and locknuts won't interchange and will need to be swapped as well.

Top

Doug Fattic 

I did respond to your email on June 3. Look in your junk mail box. My emails sometimes end up there because of my unusual address. Sometimes it also gets totally blocked by spam filters. I certainly don't mind helping you out.

RustyJames 

FWIW - I have my SS torn down and can get dimensions of stuff as you may need.
I think there was a question of seat post OD. 26.8mm. If you want the original you are welcome to have it for shipping cost.
PM probably best for any questions.

Figuarus

I do aporeciate the offer, but I do already have a seatpost at the moment. Im debating on fitting my cloud9 seat from my Jekyl, or ordering a brooks saddle. Im still a few weeks out before that becomes a priority issue.

I got in touch with Doug and the old fork will be on the way to him tomorrow. I did get a "for now" fork that from what i have been able to measure, is almost exacrly the same, with the exception of the crown. Here is a picture of it mocked up



I did have another question regarding the general sentiment on this forum regarding upgrading components, vs rebuilding or restoring what is already equipped.

I took apart and cleaned up the old Suntour V-GT rear deraileur, but curiosity is tugging at my elbow and making me ponder questions I hadnt considered. I am contemplating looking for upgraded deraileurs since I do plan on putting miles on this bike, but I also know that "If its good enough for grandad, Its good enough for me" could be applied here.

Thoughts?

Jeff Wills

The SunTour V-GT rear derailleur was the best in the late '70's and early '80's. It held its own against much more expensive hardware until the advent of index shifting.

Figuarus

Good to know. I've got it all cleaned up and ready to install now. Hopefully, I got the arm tension right.


Another Update. The original Forks are on their way to Doug. They should arrive to him by Tuesday or so.

I have spent the evening cleaning up the frame and getting it ready for paint. Managed to polish up the left brake lever assembly. I did get the cable end pieces from France really early. I was not expecting them for another 2 weeks or so.

I got a cable kit, but realize that the ends are wrong. I'll have to order another set. I'll keep the kit that arrived for another bike.

If nothing else fails, I am hoping to have most of the bike assembled by this weekend. Wheels have been the subject of great consideration. I was thinking of finding some lighter wheels as the set I have are VERY heavy. (They feel like they weigh more like cruiser wheels) I may end up just cleaning them up and using them unless a nicer set comes my way.

Jeff Wills

FWIW: this article about applying a show-quality paint job is worth it for the appreciation of the effort needed. I'd like to have the time, equipment, and motivation to do work like this:
How To Schwinn Lightweight Show Quality Paint Job Start To Finish | Bicycle Restoration Tips | The Classic and Antique Bicycle Exchange (thecabe.com)

Figuarus

Thanks for the link Jeff! I have done repaints in the past, and none of them have come close to show quality. That will help greatly.

I found a guy locally that had a Schwinn Continental with lights and both QR wheels. I picked it up for 50 and swapped my Super Sport wheels over. Now, I just have to clean everything up and get them trued and they should be good to go. I have some Continental road tires coming too. Hoping to see them by the end of this week.

Regarding paint, how many of you are purists in terms of preferring factory paint colors, VS repainting with custom colors/pain schemes?