gmcjetpilot

LOOING FOR ADVICE, do's and dont's, pros and cons, opinions and experience with Panniers. I always dreamed of bike touring. I have done it on motorcycle, car and small personal airplane camping. I enjoy combining the personal travel and camping. I am original owner of a 1983 Bianchi Randonneur with front and back black burn racks. It was in Mothballs for decades and decided to fix it, replacing fork. It's a long story I posted it in Vintage bike section, search Bianchi Randonneur if interested.

Once a long distant backpacker with gear for a week on back, I have very light compact gear. I don't want to spend a fortune on Panniers. I see some Chinese stuff I'm tempted to buy. There is German stuff a local bike store suggested but pricy and hard to buy. I'm not a total cheapskate. I appreciate quality and design, although have no interest in impressing anyone with a name brands, I want something that has form, fit, function and is a good value (yes inexpensive),.

To go cross country for days on the road, I need to pack the usual, clothes, personal items, food, small tent, very light sleeping bag, compact light small stove. I have gone motorcycle camping with his gear, although a 1150cc motorcycle with side and top hard bags is a different thing than a bicycle.

SUGGESTIONS?

PS How do front panniers and added cargo weight affect steering:. I am sure weight on fork will effect the handing. I can feel a slight difference doing tight maneuvering with the Black Burn front alloy rack on verses off. Straight line or gentile turns no issue at all, rides the same. May be no front pannier with one light but slightly bulky item like sleeping bag on top of the rack? Or panniers with light weight stuff down (low CG) for food or clothes.

dvdwmth

A lot of people seem to say front load is more stable and that low center of gravity is better. Your front rack is a higher mount. I use something similar and I do what you are suggesting, which is rolls of stuff bungied to the top but this year im going to buy another set of panniers for the front. It does depend on the design of the bike however. My touring bike was designed to be more stable with a rear load, and it is uncanny how well it rides with a load. I'm not sure what yours will be like since one would think the randonneur was not designed principally for carrying a load. The only bike I own that freaks me out loaded is a devinci road frame that happens to have braze ons. The front gets twitchy.

Lots of people buy cheaper panniers, but I'm always afraid of what happens if they fail on the road. Ortliebs are around $200 and seem to be one of the most common brands. I see some Axiom packs for a bit less but I don't think I'd personally buy anything for less than that. Second hand is probably a good option. Lots of people buy this stuff and it doesn't get used that much.

Many more experienced than me but i thought id give your post kick down the field.

Nice bike.

randallr

I'd say a major factor in your pannier choice is about how well they need to keep out water. Ortliebs are like a canoeing dry sack with mount points for your racks; kind of have to ride underwater for some extended period to get things inside wet. I've used Ortliebs and other, cheaper panniers and all worked pretty well in dry conditions . . . . .

Polaris OBark

If you can figure out how to get low riders on that, it will greatly improve your loaded handling. Even if you have to get a different fork, it is probably worth doing.

I like Lone Peak, fwiw. If you don't need full-immersion water-proof, they strike a good balance. They are not inexpensive.

Slasharoo

If you don't have waterproof panniers, gallon size freezer ziplocks are a good choice to keep things dry and organized.

79pmooney

I haven't read the rest of this thread and I gotta leave but my advice is - LowRiders rock! Ortleib panniers, while expensive and not light, salt virtually forever with no more than the periodic replacement of the mounting hardware - any shop can order it and 20 Ortleibs are fully supported. Also, being truly waterproof, there is no weight pickup from rain, puddles ...

Loaded front Ortleibs and LowRiders, leaving the big, bulky stuff for the rear, makes for a very good handling ride. And going a little lighter? You can skip the rear stuff entirely and the bike rides just fine. I used to do the farmer's market on my workhorse fix gear with just LowRiders on it. I've ridden it home with close to 20 pounds in each bag. Doing the 500' hill on the fix gear out of the saddle - that weight up front simply wasn't an issue and made mo changes in my riding style.

PedalingWalrus

I can't imagine in what situation on a tour you will try to impress someone with 'german panniers' :-) In my experience when you're out there - nobody cares...unless you're the one asking for help when your panniers failed :-)


so...what amount$ are we talking about here between this set of panniers or that set of panniers?

tyrion

I'd get these:

https://www.tubus.com/en/products/ac...ithout-eyelets

and this:

https://www.tubus.com/en/products/fr...s-product/tara

and whatever front/small panniers you prefer. Maybe a framebag and a handlebar feedbag to hold a bottle of water. Heaviest stuff in the framebag, next heaviest stuff in the front panniers, lighter stuff (sleeping bag, down jacket) in a drybag strapped on top of the rear rack.

Your bike isn't a heavy duty touring bike (I don't think) so putting a lot of weight in rear panniers will make it unstable. Distributing most of the weight between framebag and front panniers - I think that's the best way to keep it handling decently.

You could also add a rando rack and rando bag to have some things easily accessible when you're riding.

Steve0000

I have used bike and racks like you have but have changed both over the years. It can be done but there are some compromises but nothing too great. Weight on the front is best to counteract any weight on your rear rack which makes the steering light. Especially if you need to mount your panniers as far to the rear on the rear rack to avoid heel strike. This makes the weight centred behind the rear axle and affects the steering even more. Lowrider rack is better to get the weight low but you can live with the rack you have.
I have used cheap panniers but you need to pack gear inside plastic bags and the mounting systems may fail over time. Ortliebs are now my choice and have not given any problems over many years. There is a reason you see many cycle tourists with Ortliebs and it is not to impress others. Some use similar styled bags such as Arkel (I think that it the name) which may be cheaper but still good.

indyfabz

Is that gearing going to be low enough for you?

gauvins

Depends on how much volume you need.

One way to go would be 4 X 5L dry bags (two in front, two on back) plus some gear (tent, food bag) on top of your rack(s).

If it feels cramped, 2x12.5L front panniers instead of dry bags.
It still cramped, 2x20L back rollers
If still cramped, an extra wheel + 2 additional panniers.

I'd try 4x5L + stuff packed on racks

79pmooney

LowRiders and U-bolts in plastic sleeves around the fork blades work just fine. LowRiders used to come with the U-bolts. My touring on the Mooney was in its first 5 years with the original fork with no LowRider eyelet. Except being a little tedious putting the racks on, they worked just as well as the brazed on eyes. OP's got a steel fork so that bike is good to go.

As I write this, I had the thought that there may be very light forks with blades of steel too thin to take the crushing force of the U-bolts. My Mooney has probably 531 forks and it simply wasn't an issue. (Don't crank the the U-bolts tight. Yo don't need to do much more than remove the rattle and sliding.)

veganbikes

+1 on Ortliebs or my favorite Arkels. Both are excellent panniers and you won't go wrong with either.

Go with Ortlieb is waterproof is the important factor. Go with Arkel if organization is the important factor. All in all they are both super durable. My Arkels came with a patch of fabric that they use for the panniers that was cut and the idea was to try and rip it more and nobody has been able to do it and I gave it to a bunch of people. But you will also hear plenty of excellent stories of the durability of Ortliebs as well.

If I had to do my panniers over again I don't think I would change anything but I am also considering an Ortieb Hi-Viz for commuting because it is a little smaller and lower profile and the reflectivity is cool. But I haven't pulled the proverbial trigger yet because my Arkels are awesome and I have had zero issues except maybe some minor abrasion on a rain cover years ago but I so rarely use the rain cover and the panniers are decently water resistant I haven't worried about it. I think I just want something new just because I want something new and potentially it might work better with my racktop bag but in the end if I use the racktop bag I don't really need the pannier much except winter time when I carry a lot more clothes.

With any load you want to keep it low for best handling. Pllenty of people do a front load and enjoy it but you have to figure that out for yourself. I haven't done it enough because I am usually too lazy to put my front "racks" on (Tubus Duo) so I just pack up the rear and be done with it as the Arkels are the GT-54s so tons of space.

gmcjetpilot

Some comment above asked if this bike was suitable or such? Yes the Bianchi Randonneur was a premium touring bike back in the day made for this. That is why I bought it.. It came out late 1982 and was made until early 90's? I bought mine in 1983 when I was in college. It has a Mangalloy frame (steel and magnesium very strong yet can flex), and geometry is for touring. It is very stable and comfortable. It is the most comfortable road bike I have ever been on. It is 23 lbs without racks which is not bad. Racks are alloy and weight is minimal. For the day it was premium touring bike. It can handle cargo. Not saying it is the holy grail of touring bikes, it is vintage, and I'm sentimental about this bike. It fits me, rides so nice and had it forever. .

​​​What to you mean "gearing low enough for me"? It is 18 speed 3 x 6. Low gear is very low. . Sorry don't have tooth count in front of me. What ratio do you think I need? Feet/Crank Rev or Gear Ratio? I have a rule. If incline is so steep, pedaling at 60-90 rpm is not much faster than walking, I will get off and walk. Ha ha. No shame. Low gear is enough to climb medium hills without too much issue with my mighty legs... ha ha.. Gearing is high enough to pedal on down grades and go fast enough to scare me. Gearing is not an issue.

There was a comment about heal clearance, a good tip. I will take some measurements. I am looking at two 25Liters, 15 x 12 x 6 bags for back, tapered as it goes down (for heal clearance). Price is right $40 each, roll up top top water proof with additional flap. I have heard of Ortliebs... German.made. I will look at them before buying Chinese-nesium. I have a German car and motorcycle. Let's just say they car and motorbike are a love hate relationship. I expect expensive.

irc

Ortlieb panniers just work. Nothing better than knowing your gear is dry after riding for hours in the rain. Just like a sleeping bag your panniers are not a place to economise.

mev

A few guiding questions for panniers:
1. How much touring do you anticipate doing?
2. How concerned are you about things getting wet?
3. Based on type of touring, how much might you carry?

In my opinion, if you tour one or two weeks a year or on a single trip across the US, I expect you can likely make most panniers work. When it gets wet, you'll either need extra bags or a good waterproof panniers. You'll also want to size things for amount you carry (and carry amount that fits).

I toured for multiple years including trip across US and a trip across Canada with basic Cannondale panniers. Eventually, the zippers started failing, one was ripped open and I replaced things. They weren't waterproof and bags inside worked mostly.

As I prepared for a 10 month trip on the road, I wanted panniers that would last, would carry what I needed and be a reasonable solution for all types of weather.

I did end up with some Ortlieb panniers. Not because I was trying to impress people with a brand (somewhat the opposite, I'd rather people in countries I traveled think "he is too poor to avoid motor transport and not worth bothering" than be a lycra clad foreigner with expensive lucrative equipment).

They have worked moderately well. Eventually, clips break and drawstrings pull out. One split open after a door incident and was repaired. However, excellent at being waterproof and otherwise more durable than my Cannondale panniers. As I've done further longer trips I did replace a few panniers with newer ones and then use older ones on daily commute (don't own a car) where keeps my laptop dry back and forth to work and carries changes of clothes, etc. For my uses it has been worth it to spend a little more and replace panniers less often - than what I had before.

However, I don't know your intended uses or frequency and fo believe one can make most work depending on the situation.

balto charlie

Figure the size of your gear for touring. You mention you have lightweight compact gear. You probably don't need 4 panniers. Food is another facter. Will you be passing markets along the way?

I go lightweight and use a dry bag on the rear rack, frame bag and handlebag bag. I can go 5 days before I need to resupply but I make up my own dried foods for most meals. I use my front forks for h2o bottles.

PedalingWalrus

those racks look beautiful

John N

Blackburn used to make a set up low rider adapters which were basically bolt on horizontal bars. You might try the folks over at the Vintage section and ask if anyone has a set they want to sell. Or maybe get lucky on eBay, especially if you are very patient and do a "saved search" so it automatically notifies you of a set when they become available. The Blackburn racks were the first "decent" racks out there.

djb

A little heads up from someone of a similar age and who also has kept my old tourer from not many years ahead of yours. (And had many motorcycles)
The low gearing that was fine enough unloaded back in the 80s will now be pretty damn tall when adding weight on the bike, especially for an old geezer (remember, I'm the same age!) Going up hills loaded will feel like you are lugging the bejesus out of your knees, but you won't be able to downshift.
Your maybe 60 yr old knees might not like this not very low gearing if you end up riding in hills.
On that note, really get out there and ride, ride, ride. And ride with some baggage, increasing load and distance to allow your body to get stronger.
These frames can and will get flexy with weight of a touring load, plus you may very well be heavier than 40 years ago, so careful of this, and you'll probably see that if you stand and pedal, it will be pretty loosey goosey, like a 76 cb350 with clapped out undersprung suspension!

Hopefully this will all turn out well for you, just be aware of these downsides from a 40 years old touring bike. As you say, walking is fine when needed, just be careful of lugging the crap out of your knees, it ain't good for them.

john m flores 

Beautiful bike! It would be ashamed to put modern-looking bags on it. I'd try to stay period and look for older-looking bags that match the style. If they're not waterproof, you can always put stuff in dry bags inside.

And be sure to wear wool!

Polaris OBark

Load the bike up and then ride it up some hard hills, and you will then know what he means.

ClydeClydeson

If you're heavily loaded for a tour, you MUST put some of the weight on the front. As people are saying, lowrider racks are probably best, but a handlebar bag or bar mounted bottle cages or even just strapping something to the handlebars will help balance the weight out. ALl the weight over the rear wheel will make the bike handle very badly.

indyfabz

I have no idea what YOU need.

What is the low end, expressed as gear inches?

Pushing a loaded bike up a hill sucks.

pdlamb

Yabbut, it beats tweaking your knee in a tour-ending injury.

Low gears rule!