Cheap navigation
#51
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#52
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Hello everybody,
I love to travel by bike, but navigation can be quite a pain sometimes, i would like to buy a device that would help me with navigation.
I'm looking for the least expensive options, and i'm not necessary looking for a GPS bike computer, could be a watch or maybe something else.
Believe it or not i've been doing google researches but couldn't really find an article or something listing the cheapest options.
Reasons why I need this :
- I can't use my phone because the screen is not visible enough for me, i've also tried to use google maps, put the volume at maximum in my rear pocket and listen to the instructions.
But it's not working out, how many times i've been stuck in small paths full of rocks, having to walk (i"m using a road bike).
- I usually write all the towns i need to go by on a piece of paper and stick it on my frame, and I would just follow the signs on the roads. That's cool but it's easy to make mistakes, and when you do quite big stages it's annoying when you know you have to cycle back a couple of km's because you realized you made a mistake.
Thanks!
I love to travel by bike, but navigation can be quite a pain sometimes, i would like to buy a device that would help me with navigation.
I'm looking for the least expensive options, and i'm not necessary looking for a GPS bike computer, could be a watch or maybe something else.
Believe it or not i've been doing google researches but couldn't really find an article or something listing the cheapest options.
Reasons why I need this :
- I can't use my phone because the screen is not visible enough for me, i've also tried to use google maps, put the volume at maximum in my rear pocket and listen to the instructions.
But it's not working out, how many times i've been stuck in small paths full of rocks, having to walk (i"m using a road bike).
- I usually write all the towns i need to go by on a piece of paper and stick it on my frame, and I would just follow the signs on the roads. That's cool but it's easy to make mistakes, and when you do quite big stages it's annoying when you know you have to cycle back a couple of km's because you realized you made a mistake.
Thanks!
The first is the planningThe second is the navigation.
It looks like a part of your problem is the planning. No GPS unit will make a bad route good.
Google Maps is not good for route planning.*
https://cycle.travel/map is excellent for planning routes, especially in Europe. You can download a gpx or tcx file to use in a gps device and/or cue sheets and pdf maps. Depending on the distance you want to cover a cue sheet and map may be all you need.
A useful app for your phone is Osmand. A bit clunky to get a hang of, it has many useful benefits especially the ability to plot a route totally offline. Its altitude information is excellent. It is also easy to create a gpx file and transfer to a gps unit if you get one.
You could take a route prepared in cycle.travel and navigate it using Osmand. Osmand has voice instructions but you would really need at least one headphone/earpiece. It will also reroute automatically if you go off course.
*Google Maps has one advantage for travelling - the ability to save areas in advance (if you have a Google account) These saved areas will "remember" any places you have saved as well as the usual Google Map info like Hotels etc.
Even offline Google Maps can create a route - but only for cars. That may not be helpful.
The "cheapest" gps unit you buy will the the one that does what you want it to do rather than buying anything at all and then finding out it doesn't suit you or your style.
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#55
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I think you've already tried the cheapest options, a written queue sheet and using your existing phone, and as you've discovered they have limitations. GPS Bike computers attempt to solve some of these limitations, albeit at a cost. I went through the same decision process and ended up with the Garmin Edge Explore, which still isn't cheap, but I'm pretty happy with it. There are other brands and models, but if you do a lot of exploratory riding, I think a dedicated GPS nav system is probably what you want.
#56
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The great thing about opinions is that everybody has one. Or more.
Let me count the steps a potential user has to take to use their phone as a GPS:
1. Pick and install an app.. (The right app!)
2. Learn how to use that app.
3. Download maps for every area they might ride.
4. Update those maps periodically.
5. Learn how to use the phone and app while turning it off when it's not needed.
6. Buy the $8 waterproof pouch.
Six steps so far, right? but don't forget
7. Buy a cell phone mount for your bars (assumes you don't want to stop to look at the map)
8. Buy a cache battery for cell phone and figure out how to mount it.
So it can be done. One of my daughters would probably take this route to use her phone. I'd pay for the dedicated GPS. Other daughter is probably in between us. As with most "which is best?" questions, it comes down to a choice; in this case is your time or your money worth more to you?
- Downloadable maps for phones are cheap or free and get updated regularly. They work at various zoom levels and occupy much less space.
- With a little bit of care, one doesn't need service for routing on phones. There are quite a few apps that do this.
- Given that service is spotty, I'd rate it as some sort of "doing it wrong" if one relies on something that requires service.
- The rerouting of using anything (the internet, on-device routing, and even paper maps) may "be suspect".
- One doesn't have to use the phone in a way that requires keeping it running all the time.
- Dedicated GPS units have their advantages but "everybody" already has a smartphone. It might make some sense to investigate using that first (the phone is also a useful addition to a dedicated GPS).
- An $8 plastic pouch solves the water resistance issue.
1. Pick and install an app.. (The right app!)
2. Learn how to use that app.
3. Download maps for every area they might ride.
4. Update those maps periodically.
5. Learn how to use the phone and app while turning it off when it's not needed.
6. Buy the $8 waterproof pouch.
Six steps so far, right? but don't forget
7. Buy a cell phone mount for your bars (assumes you don't want to stop to look at the map)
8. Buy a cache battery for cell phone and figure out how to mount it.
So it can be done. One of my daughters would probably take this route to use her phone. I'd pay for the dedicated GPS. Other daughter is probably in between us. As with most "which is best?" questions, it comes down to a choice; in this case is your time or your money worth more to you?
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#57
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Let me count the steps a potential user has to take to use their phone as a GPS:
1. Pick and install an app.. (The right app!) <Not that hard. maps.me (free) is a good place to start. Osmand is a reasonable choice but it's a bit more complicated. I like guru maps but it's a bit expensive. An app is a useful/cheap backup too.>
2. Learn how to use that app.<not that hard. you have to learn how to use the device too. It's a useful backup too.>
3. Download maps for every area they might ride.<easy. It's a useful backup too.>
4. Update those maps periodically.<easy. you have to update the maps for your device too. It's a useful backup too.>
5. Learn how to use the phone and app while turning it off when it's not needed. <easy.>
6. Buy the $8 waterproof pouch.<Which you should have anyway/regardless. The alternative is to spend $200+ or more on a separate device.>
1. Pick and install an app.. (The right app!) <Not that hard. maps.me (free) is a good place to start. Osmand is a reasonable choice but it's a bit more complicated. I like guru maps but it's a bit expensive. An app is a useful/cheap backup too.>
2. Learn how to use that app.<not that hard. you have to learn how to use the device too. It's a useful backup too.>
3. Download maps for every area they might ride.<easy. It's a useful backup too.>
4. Update those maps periodically.<easy. you have to update the maps for your device too. It's a useful backup too.>
5. Learn how to use the phone and app while turning it off when it's not needed. <easy.>
6. Buy the $8 waterproof pouch.<Which you should have anyway/regardless. The alternative is to spend $200+ or more on a separate device.>
Also, since it's much, much easier to view maps on a phone, an app is a useful and cheap addition to a separate device!
Six steps so far, right? but don't forget
7. Buy a cell phone mount for your bars (assumes you don't want to stop to look at the map) <Sure, the mount is an extra thing but it's still cheaper than buying a dedicated GPS!>
8. Buy a cache battery for cell phone and figure out how to mount it. <The batteries are cheap (they might already have one) and not that hard to use. I did it for a dedicated unit.>
7. Buy a cell phone mount for your bars (assumes you don't want to stop to look at the map) <Sure, the mount is an extra thing but it's still cheaper than buying a dedicated GPS!>
8. Buy a cache battery for cell phone and figure out how to mount it. <The batteries are cheap (they might already have one) and not that hard to use. I did it for a dedicated unit.>
So it can be done. One of my daughters would probably take this route to use her phone. I'd pay for the dedicated GPS. Other daughter is probably in between us. As with most "which is best?" questions, it comes down to a choice; in this case is your time or your money worth more to you?
I won't presume to decide "which is best" for anybody.
If the OP can't afford a decent dedicated unit (one with map), why shouldn't he use what he has?
I use a dedicated device on the bike but, in other situations, use an app on my phone (which I nearly always have).
Last edited by njkayaker; 07-08-21 at 10:17 AM.
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#61
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What a bunch of B S , most of the answers are... JMO... If you have a phone, the solution is in your hands... If not, then a map and compass is/should be in your hands... It is that simple...
#62
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fwiw - (before getting a modern smart phone) I've tried an old style battery operated auto GPS strapped to the bars. it works of course but not ideal. I later just kept it strapped to my rear trunk & just turned it on when I needed a directional tip. the battery doesn't last long. it doesn't have unpaved bike trails. but it can get you back to your car if you can find a road & have saved the location where you parked your car. I also tried using it to help me navigate the 22 miles from home to a new office. but really, the best way that I learned the route, was plotting it w/ google maps then repeatedly driving it with my car in both directions, even tho that wasn't the preferred driving route (which uses the highways). anyway, it was a fun experiment for a while
Last edited by rumrunn6; 07-08-21 at 07:56 AM.
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That this is necessary is a common misconception. You really don't want to use a mapping app that relies on cell service.
Last edited by njkayaker; 07-08-21 at 10:35 AM.
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#68
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normaly a phone keeps it's charge all day. those stand alone auto gps batteries do not
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The phone is a computer with memory. There's nothing really forcing an app to need cell phone service. Indeed, for navigation, I recommend people not use an app that relies on a connection.
A cell phone is/has: a computer, a screen, a cell phone transceiver, a GPS receiver, a compass (maybe), and a barometer (maybe). The cycle navigational computer (generally) lacks the cell phone transceiver.
GPS is very accurate but takes a while to warm-up. Using the cell-towers is very fast but not accurate (this is used to get an approximate location to warm-up the GPS faster). WiFi is based on a database of WiFi names and locations determined (by GPS or cell-towers). This works indoors (unlike GPS).
recently read an article about a woman who crashed her car into some woods, didn't know where she was & 1st responders pinged her phone to locate her. were they using cell towers?
I have done some dumb things & have been caught off guard, on the Cape, at night, during the winter. I was able to walk out & flag down a car & hitch a ride to a police station to get a tow truck, but others, in other parts of the country (or abroad) might not be so lucky.
These devices are intended to be used plugged-into the car battery. The internal batteries for these are designed to keep the device operating over short interruptions of power.
Last edited by njkayaker; 07-08-21 at 03:35 PM.
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Yep. If you start recording a ride on your phone (let's say with Strava because that's what I've done) and then put your phone on airplane mode it will still record your ride, then upload it once you re-enable network services.
I've done that as a backup on long rides just in case something goes haywire with my cycling computer.
I've done that as a backup on long rides just in case something goes haywire with my cycling computer.
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There isn't a huge difference between a smartphone and a cycle computer like the 530. (The first is more focused on short/high-performance use and the second is designed for continuous use.)
(I added more info to that post.)
The phones are a useful and cheap addition to a cycle navigation unit.
The screen on the 530 is a bit small for navigation and its lack of a touch-screen makes doing some navigation stuff (like panning/zooming the map) harder (or impossible).
(I added more info to that post.)
The screen on the 530 is a bit small for navigation and its lack of a touch-screen makes doing some navigation stuff (like panning/zooming the map) harder (or impossible).
Last edited by njkayaker; 07-08-21 at 01:47 PM.
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#73
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I have had my phone battery last for 3 days and still have it on for the GPS for navigation and monitoring my ride with ride with GPS app... You just need to put the phone in airplane mode... and I carry a small external battery about the size of a deck of cards with which I can charge the phone 8 times...
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#74
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How did I get around the US and Europe without any electronics back in the seventies and eighties? Actually, I don't think I want a device that will tell me exactly where I am. I like to figure it out by myself, with the help of a map.
BITD I used to study a map before I set out on a tour, or a hike. I tried to visualize my route and the terrain I was traveling through and then tried to remember some of the important landmarks .
On the topic of navigation there are a couple of interesting books: Wayfinding: The Science and Mystery of how Humans Navigate, M.R. O'Connor, St. Martin's Press; and From Here to There: The Art and Science of Finding and Losing our Way by Michael Bond, Belknap/ Harvard University Press (to be published in August); and Nature ShockGetting Lost in America by John T. Coleman, Yale. It's an interesting subject. Animals, including our ancestors, have been navigating for millions of years without a GPS.
BITD I used to study a map before I set out on a tour, or a hike. I tried to visualize my route and the terrain I was traveling through and then tried to remember some of the important landmarks .
On the topic of navigation there are a couple of interesting books: Wayfinding: The Science and Mystery of how Humans Navigate, M.R. O'Connor, St. Martin's Press; and From Here to There: The Art and Science of Finding and Losing our Way by Michael Bond, Belknap/ Harvard University Press (to be published in August); and Nature ShockGetting Lost in America by John T. Coleman, Yale. It's an interesting subject. Animals, including our ancestors, have been navigating for millions of years without a GPS.
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#75
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They also all managed without bicycles too.
Last edited by njkayaker; 07-10-21 at 08:16 PM.