Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Steel Frame & Stock Aluminum Fork. Early 1990s. Anyone remember this era?

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Steel Frame & Stock Aluminum Fork. Early 1990s. Anyone remember this era?

Old 09-12-16, 10:15 AM
  #1  
armstrong101
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
armstrong101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 386
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 49 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Steel Frame & Stock Aluminum Fork. Early 1990s. Anyone remember this era?

Hi folks

Wondering if anyone recalls this "aberration" era. A steel bike with a stock aluminum fork would (AFAIK) never be marketed today. But it was for a time. My first real high end road bike (bought it used) was a Specialized Allez Pro from 1994. Tricolour STI. Steel tubes, aluminum fork.

At the time, the fork was advertised as being "lighter" and to actually be vibration damping compared to steel(!). Given aluminum's current reputation for harshness, no one would ever "upgrade" their steel fork for an aluminum one to give a softer ride, but at the time, aluminum's harsh characteristics weren't yet widely known. It was simply considered a newer/lighter/better material found on higher-end bikes in a world of full of steel bikes.

In a sense, the alu fork "upgrade" was kinda the entry into "better tubing", the way modern entry-race alum bikes have carbon forks - they would be for people who didn't shell out for an all-aluminum (now all-carbon) frameset. But alum's characteristics soon trickled out, and then you couldn't advertise it as a vibration-damping material, and hence such bikes were no longer designed/marketed.

Is what I just said all true? I do know steelframe/alumfork existed - I'm just guessing the era was very short lived because it simply didn't make sense. Anyone else have a take on this?
armstrong101 is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 10:30 AM
  #2  
crank_addict
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,150
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1361 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 422 Times in 282 Posts
Rolling in the 70's with Lambert / Viscount. Later coined the brand with the 'd' fork.
crank_addict is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 10:40 AM
  #3  
thinktubes 
weapons-grade bolognium
 
thinktubes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Across the street from Chicago
Posts: 6,335

Bikes: Battaglin Cromor, Ciocc Designer 84, Schwinn Superior 1981

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 984 Post(s)
Liked 2,353 Times in 882 Posts
Yeah, I remember that era. Quickly got superceded by CF. I have one of those Allez frames stashed away. Wish the fork was steel.
thinktubes is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 10:59 AM
  #4  
jetboy 
Senior Member
 
jetboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Oakland, CA
Posts: 3,445

Bikes: centurion cinelli equipe, look hinault 753, Zunow z-1, 83 stumpy sport

Mentioned: 66 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 814 Post(s)
Liked 330 Times in 186 Posts
I had the carbon tubed Allez Epic with the Alu fork. probably the same fork that was on the steel - Perhaps it was the carbon helping out, but it felt fine and did the job it was made to do with no complaints.
jetboy is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 12:29 PM
  #5  
noglider 
aka Tom Reingold
 
noglider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA
Posts: 40,691

Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem

Mentioned: 510 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7287 Post(s)
Liked 2,361 Times in 1,380 Posts
I'm still riding my Viscount with its so-called Death Fork. I'm still alive. The fork was subject to recall, but I don't think it caused any deaths.
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author

Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
noglider is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 12:40 PM
  #6  
gaucho777 
Senior Member
 
gaucho777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Berkeley, CA
Posts: 7,445

Bikes: '72 Cilo Pacer, '72 Gitane Gran Tourisme, '72 Peugeot PX10, '73 Speedwell Ti, '74 Peugeot UE-8, '75 Peugeot PR-10L, '80 Colnago Super, '85 De Rosa Pro, '86 Look Equipe 753, '86 Look KG86, '89 Parkpre Team, '90 Parkpre Team MTB, '90 Merlin

Mentioned: 87 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 826 Post(s)
Liked 2,048 Times in 545 Posts
I have a couple. My Parkpre (Tange Prestige frame tubes) came with a bonded alum Tange Fusion fork. As far as I can tell, the stock fork on my Merlin Ti frame is the same. I also rode a Vitus 979 with it's stock alum fork for many years. No complaints about the ride quality of these forks and I wouldn't say they give a hard ride though I haven't spent as much time on the Merlin. If anything, the 979 fork flexed more than comparable steel forks; you could really see that fork flex with hard front braking.



gaucho777 is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 02:41 PM
  #7  
Scooper
Decrepit Member
 
Scooper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Rosa, California
Posts: 10,489

Bikes: Waterford 953 RS-22, several Paramounts

Mentioned: 71 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 634 Post(s)
Liked 68 Times in 57 Posts
The 1998 and 1999 Schwinn Pelotons had an 853 steel frame and aluminum alloy fork. I never owned one, but thought at the time it was an odd combination. In 2000, Schwinn went to a Time Club Carbon fork on the same 853 steel frame which made a lot more sense to me.



__________________
- Stan

my bikes

Science doesn't care what you believe.
Scooper is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 03:18 PM
  #8  
martl
Strong Walker
 
martl's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 1,316

Bikes: too many

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 332 Post(s)
Liked 481 Times in 252 Posts
in the early 90ies, some recommended a Vitus fork as a comfort upgrade for any lugged steel frame. My first oversized alloy bike came with one, 1". Still own it, its a sweet ride.
martl is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 03:36 PM
  #9  
exmechanic89
Senior Member
 
exmechanic89's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Richmond VA area
Posts: 2,713

Bikes: '00 Koga Miyata Full Pro Oval Road bike.

Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 475 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 7 Times in 6 Posts
Yet another example of the bike industry and their decades of BS. I dont know that aluminum forks were necessarily bad, but like many things before and after them, they were marketed as a better ride, then eventualy just vanished. Things like oval tubing, oval chainrings, and aero shifters come to mind as well..
exmechanic89 is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 03:43 PM
  #10  
martl
Strong Walker
 
martl's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 1,316

Bikes: too many

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 332 Post(s)
Liked 481 Times in 252 Posts
Originally Posted by exmechanic89
Yet another example of the bike industry and their decades of BS. I dont know that aluminum forks were necessarily bad, but like many things before and after them, they were marketed as a better ride, then eventualy just vanished. Things like oval tubing, oval chainrings, and aero shifters come to mind as well..
They *were* good. If the creator of the steel fork knew his business, they weren't much of an improvement, but there were many bad ones out ther at that time. Good CFK forks are even better, lighter, and cheaper to manufacture. Same goes for oval tubing, my Columbus Max frame is the most "modern" feeling lugged steel frame in my garage. Only alloy could do that better and was lighter, CFK even more so.

Now oval chainrings, they are something else wanna have a good laugh? check out https://moeve-bikes.de/en/cyfly, sort of oval chainring 2.0
"more efficient" torque *and* "more efficient" performance... yeah, right. These guys call themselves Engineers.

Last edited by martl; 09-12-16 at 03:53 PM.
martl is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 04:57 PM
  #11  
old's'cool
curmudgineer
 
old's'cool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Chicago SW burbs
Posts: 4,429

Bikes: 2 many 2 fit here

Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 263 Post(s)
Liked 111 Times in 70 Posts

I'd like to see the power transmission efficiency from the crank to the chainring...
(for a conventional crank with one moving part, the only loss is in the bottom bracket bearing system, which is common to any crankset.)
old's'cool is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 05:05 PM
  #12  
DMC707
Senior Member
 
DMC707's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Norman, Oklahoma
Posts: 5,389

Bikes: Too many to list

Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1764 Post(s)
Liked 1,119 Times in 743 Posts
I've got a lot of miles on Aluminum forks both on my GT Edge, and several Cannondale's over the years.

I don't recall it ever being an issue --- but I wasn't in the market for a plush, Lincoln-like ride at the time
DMC707 is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 05:50 PM
  #13  
RobbieTunes
Banned.
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 27,297
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 378 Post(s)
Liked 1,407 Times in 908 Posts
I am so sure it would eventually explode.
RobbieTunes is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 06:07 PM
  #14  
agmetal
Senior Member
 
agmetal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 1,541

Bikes: Bianchi Volpe, ANT 3-speed roadster, New Albion Privateer singlespeed, Raleigh One Way singlespeed, Raleigh Professional "retro roadie" rebuild, 198? Fuji(?) franken-5-speed, 1937 Raleigh Tourist, 1952 Raleigh Sports, 1966 Raleigh Sports step-through

Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 248 Post(s)
Liked 26 Times in 18 Posts
My grandfather has a mid-'90s Fuji Team road bike with CrMo frame and 6061 fork...first time I'd ever knowingly seen such a thing, when I was visiting my grandparents this summer. Thought it was really weird...
agmetal is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 08:03 PM
  #15  
thenomad
Riding like its 1990
 
thenomad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: IE, SoCal
Posts: 3,789
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Having ridden aluminum forks I agree that's the wrong direction to go! What about the opposite: Alloy main tubes bonded to steel parts with a steel fork? Good old Univega Viva-tech. It was a strange time indeed.
thenomad is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 08:12 PM
  #16  
FBinNY 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 38,544

Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter

Mentioned: 139 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5703 Post(s)
Liked 2,429 Times in 1,343 Posts
Kinesis, SR (Prism), and others produced some very nice riding aluminum forks in that era.

The claim that an aluminum fork will give a harsh ride is absolute nonsense. The ride properties of any fork, of any material will be determined by the wall thickness, taper, curve and mechanical properties of the material.

Aluminum frames tend to be stiff and ride harshly not because they are aluminum, but because they were produced in an era of "stiffer is better and stiffest is best" and the makers used oversized tubes to maximize stiffness.

That doesn't apply to forks which have tapered and curved blades, especially when the blade is made by thinning the walls at what will be tapered down. Thinning before tapering reduces the tendency of walls to thicken as they're tapered to smaller diameters.

Bonding rather than welding also allows the designer to work with thinner tubes so achieving good ride quality is easier.
__________________
FB
Chain-L site

An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.

Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.

“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN

WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FBinNY is offline  
Old 09-12-16, 08:17 PM
  #17  
jamesdak 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Utah
Posts: 8,823

Bikes: Paletti,Pinarello Monviso,Duell Vienna,Giordana XL Super,Lemond Maillot Juane.& custom,PDG Paramount,Fuji Opus III,Davidson Impulse,Pashley Guv'nor,Evans,Fishlips,Y-Foil,Softride, Tetra Pro, CAAD8 Optimo,

Mentioned: 154 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2300 Post(s)
Liked 4,764 Times in 1,725 Posts
Originally Posted by Scooper
The 1998 and 1999 Schwinn Pelotons had an 853 steel frame and aluminum alloy fork. I never owned one, but thought at the time it was an odd combination. In 2000, Schwinn went to a Time Club Carbon fork on the same 853 steel frame which made a lot more sense to me.
And so did the Circuits!



My 1999 was one of these. I took it on a 3 week business trip to Mississippi and put a lot of miles on it down there where the roads were dreamy, smooth pavement. The bike was so fast, responsive and joyful to ride. Then I got back home to the nasty chipseal roads we have here and that straight, aluminum fork would just beat the heck out of me. I sold the bike in a moment of weakness when I thought I had too many bikes. I do miss it but to be honest it was a harsh beast if the roads weren't perfect.

I also would buy it back today if it was for sale. I loved it and I hated it....
__________________
Steel is real...and comfy.
jamesdak is online now  
Old 09-29-16, 12:57 PM
  #18  
crank_addict
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,150
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1361 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 422 Times in 282 Posts
Happened to find this in a 1993 Suntour / SR catalog.

[IMG]SunTour and SR catalog 1993 aluminum fork by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]
crank_addict is offline  
Old 09-29-16, 04:27 PM
  #19  
Lascauxcaveman 
Senior Member
 
Lascauxcaveman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Port Angeles, WA
Posts: 8,016

Bikes: A green one, "Ragleigh," or something.

Mentioned: 194 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1627 Post(s)
Liked 629 Times in 355 Posts
Originally Posted by martl
in the early 90ies, some recommended a Vitus fork as a comfort upgrade for any lugged steel frame. My first oversized alloy bike came with one, 1". Still own it, its a sweet ride.
Somebody thought it would be a good upgrade on my recently acquired (1993-ish?) Raleigh Technium, too. This oddball is clearly labeled Reynolds 531 tubes and I've been told the lugs are Aluminum. I don't think the current alu Alan fork was original, at least.

It could be the V-rims and skinny tires I put on it after the "as found" pic, but this is definitely the harshest riding bike in my rotation right now. Feels fast, though.

__________________
● 1971 Grandis SL ● 1972 Lambert Grand Prix frankenbike ● 1972 Raleigh Super Course fixie ● 1973 Nishiki Semi-Pro ● 1979 Motobecane Grand Jubile ●1980 Apollo "Legnano" ● 1984 Peugeot Vagabond ● 1985 Shogun Prairie Breaker ● 1986 Merckx Super Corsa ● 1987 Schwinn Tempo ● 1988 Schwinn Voyageur ● 1989 Bottechia Team ADR replica ● 1990 Cannondale ST600 ● 1993 Technium RT600 ● 1996 Kona Lava Dome ●


Last edited by Lascauxcaveman; 09-29-16 at 04:31 PM.
Lascauxcaveman is offline  
Old 09-29-16, 04:45 PM
  #20  
FBinNY 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 38,544

Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter

Mentioned: 139 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5703 Post(s)
Liked 2,429 Times in 1,343 Posts
Originally Posted by crank_addict
Happened to find this in a 1993 Suntour / SR catalog.SunTour and SR catalog 1993 aluminum fork by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]
I don't need no stinkin' catalog, I'm riding it.
__________________
FB
Chain-L site

An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.

Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.

“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN

WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FBinNY is offline  
Old 09-29-16, 04:57 PM
  #21  
PaintItCeleste
Senior Member
 
PaintItCeleste's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 219

Bikes: My wife says "Too Many"

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
An early 90's Specialized Allez Epic was my first "light" performance bicycle. I loved this bike and it blew me away every time I rode it. Granted my only comparison at that time was a few thrift shop, boat anchor bikes. But even later, after picking up a nicer italian steel frame, I still recall loving that Allez. Eventually I sold it but I can't say I ever thought the fork negatively affected the ride.

PaintItCeleste is offline  
Old 06-22-21, 07:30 PM
  #22  
lazarusdal
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by FBinNY
Kinesis, SR (Prism), and others produced some very nice riding aluminum forks in that era.

The claim that an aluminum fork will give a harsh ride is absolute nonsense. The ride properties of any fork, of any material will be determined by the wall thickness, taper, curve and mechanical properties of the material.

Aluminum frames tend to be stiff and ride harshly not because they are aluminum, but because they were produced in an era of "stiffer is better and stiffest is best" and the makers used oversized tubes to maximize stiffness.

That doesn't apply to forks which have tapered and curved blades, especially when the blade is made by thinning the walls at what will be tapered down. Thinning before tapering reduces the tendency of walls to thicken as they're tapered to smaller diameters.

Bonding rather than welding also allows the designer to work with thinner tubes so achieving good ride quality is easier.
very well stated I just picked up and older cr/mo frame wise with a beautifully raked and shaped aluminum fork ,,, 1990 era and t rides like a a gem and points beautifully .. a nicer ride than my 4000 dollar Specialized Roubiax with the Future shock headset and the compliant seat post set up ... and I paid 125 for the steel bike ... steel is real
lazarusdal is offline  
Old 06-22-21, 08:51 PM
  #23  
Mr. 66
Senior Member
 
Mr. 66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 3,438
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1124 Post(s)
Liked 1,704 Times in 941 Posts

I have the Performance Focus with the alloy fork, very good rider a little harsh perhaps. I don't ride it very often.
Mr. 66 is online now  
Old 06-22-21, 09:09 PM
  #24  
79pmooney
Senior Member
 
79pmooney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 12,825

Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder

Mentioned: 128 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4742 Post(s)
Liked 3,860 Times in 2,509 Posts
Originally Posted by armstrong101
Hi folks

Wondering if anyone recalls this "aberration" era. A steel bike with a stock aluminum fork would (AFAIK) never be marketed today. But it was for a time. My first real high end road bike (bought it used) was a Specialized Allez Pro from 1994. Tricolour STI. Steel tubes, aluminum fork.

At the time, the fork was advertised as being "lighter" and to actually be vibration damping compared to steel(!). Given aluminum's current reputation for harshness, no one would ever "upgrade" their steel fork for an aluminum one to give a softer ride, but at the time, aluminum's harsh characteristics weren't yet widely known. It was simply considered a newer/lighter/better material found on higher-end bikes in a world of full of steel bikes.

In a sense, the alu fork "upgrade" was kinda the entry into "better tubing", the way modern entry-race alum bikes have carbon forks - they would be for people who didn't shell out for an all-aluminum (now all-carbon) frameset. But alum's characteristics soon trickled out, and then you couldn't advertise it as a vibration-damping material, and hence such bikes were no longer designed/marketed.

Is what I just said all true? I do know steelframe/alumfork existed - I'm just guessing the era was very short lived because it simply didn't make sense. Anyone else have a take on this?
"Given aluminum's current reputation for harshness, no one would ever "upgrade" their steel fork for an aluminum one to give a softer ride, but at the time, aluminum's harsh characteristics weren't yet widely known."

I'm not quite sure where to start here. Aluminum is considerably less stiff than steel. This has been common knowledge a long time. Sophomore engineering As a fork with cross section remotely close to steel, it is a lot more flexible. What made aluminum famous as a "stiff" frame material was the huge diameters used for the tubes. Again, not "new" knowledge. I did a quick ride on an early Klein in 1976. I couldn't have flexed that bike at twice my weight and strength.

I owned a Lambert. That fork was not stiff. Very comfortable on rough roads. The 1990s aluminum forks I saw weren't a lot thicker so obviously also not very stiff.

Edit: Oops. Guilty of answering an ancient post.

Last edited by 79pmooney; 06-22-21 at 09:13 PM. Reason: added paragraph return to be more readable
79pmooney is offline  
Likes For 79pmooney:
Old 06-23-21, 02:53 AM
  #25  
Lazyass
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Minas Ithil
Posts: 9,337
Mentioned: 66 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2432 Post(s)
Liked 638 Times in 395 Posts
Originally Posted by FBinNY
The claim that an aluminum fork will give a harsh ride is absolute nonsense. The ride properties of any fork, of any material will be determined by the wall thickness, taper, curve and mechanical properties of the material.
This. Steel is actually a more stiff metal than aluminum. The early pre-Cannondale aluminum frames with tubes of the same diameter of steel, such as Vitus, were noodles.
Lazyass is offline  
Likes For Lazyass:

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.