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Zwift KOMs are Ridiculous

Old 03-14-23, 07:31 AM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
Did you ever stop to think that maybe people with Zwift subscriptions actually spend more time on their bike, because they ride indoors in addition to riding outdoors?
I spend more time on my bike outdoors. This>Swift...





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Old 03-14-23, 07:34 AM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
Sometimes, spinning in one place and staring at a screen is the sensible option.

The atmospheric river is making landfall tonight (Monday). Flood watch and high wind warnings start tonight and run until Wednesday morning. I don't mind getting a little wet, but this stuff is dangerous.
Yeah. Between snow and rain lately...you're area is getting pounded by bad weather. Take care and stay safe.
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Old 03-14-23, 08:13 AM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by prj71
I spend more time on my bike outdoors. This>Swift...
I prefer to go skiing when it snows. Skiing >> fat biking. When it's wet and muddy I prefer training on Zwift. None of these things are actually mutually exclusive anyway. They all have their time and place.

Anyway you clearly don't like Zwift, so don't waste your time on a thread about Zwift. It just makes you look like a troll.
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Old 03-14-23, 08:56 AM
  #104  
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Living in Wisconsin getting a trainer and using Rouvy has been a game changer for biking. I use to put 2000 miles on my bike per year. After getting a trainer late October 2022, I've put 2000 simulated miles on in 5 months which would have been <100 miles. My endurance, power, weight and overall fitness all are considerably better compared to that in March of recent years.

While one can bike in winter and I've done it, to put in many hours as a recreational sport is not realistic for most. In addition to the cold, there is a lack of daylight time, concerns of ice, loose salt and the hassle factor of added layers.

I'll continue to ride outside, but there are advantages to the trainer including not having to be constantly aware of traffic and ongoing conditions, scheduling, a variety of ride profiles, no risk of crash/accident, no flats, ability to ride different course profiles vs what is available locally and spouses piece of mind.

Is it the same as outside - no, but I suspect that it will make the outside rides better. I may slow down on more of those rides in the future and then use the trainer when I want to go harder or pretend to go climb a mountain in the alps.
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Old 03-14-23, 09:21 AM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by SwtBadger
Living in Wisconsin getting a trainer and using Rouvy has been a game changer for biking. I use to put 2000 miles on my bike per year. After getting a trainer late October 2022, I've put 2000 simulated miles on in 5 months which would have been <100 miles. My endurance, power, weight and overall fitness all are considerably better compared to that in March of recent years.

While one can bike in winter and I've done it, to put in many hours as a recreational sport is not realistic for most. In addition to the cold, there is a lack of daylight time, concerns of ice, loose salt and the hassle factor of added layers.

I'll continue to ride outside, but there are advantages to the trainer including not having to be constantly aware of traffic and ongoing conditions, scheduling, a variety of ride profiles, no risk of crash/accident, no flats, ability to ride different course profiles vs what is available locally and spouses piece of mind.

Is it the same as outside - no, but I suspect that it will make the outside rides better. I may slow down on more of those rides in the future and then use the trainer when I want to go harder or pretend to go climb a mountain in the alps.
I live in the same state, but north of you.

Added layers not an issue. Lack of daylight means I do night rides with lights.
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Old 03-14-23, 09:52 AM
  #106  
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Originally Posted by prj71
I spend more time on my bike outdoors.
Good for you. Other cyclists spend lots of time on their bike outdoors, but complement it with Zwift time indoors.
Originally Posted by PeteHski
Anyway you clearly don't like Zwift, so don't waste your time on a thread about Zwift. It just makes you look like a troll.
Yep.
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Old 03-14-23, 10:35 AM
  #107  
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Originally Posted by prj71
I live in the same state, but north of you.

Added layers not an issue. Lack of daylight means I do night rides with lights.
Where shall I post your medal? Honestly, nobody cares how hardcore you are. Having the need to keep stating it probably means you have insecurity issues.
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Old 03-14-23, 11:56 AM
  #108  
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Originally Posted by prj71
I don't hate it. I ride a spin bike occasionally at the local gym...But if and only if the weather is very cold or it will be raining outside. I wouldn't buy a Swift machine and pay the monthly subsciption fee. But there seems to be a segment of the cycling population that once winter season hits they refuse to go outdoors and ride and all. All it takes is a fat bike if you live in a snowy area or an upgrade on clothing for road or MTB.
Or maybe it's people whose jobs don't allow them to ride outdoors in daylight during winter except on weekends, and who would rather not trust the local drivers not to kill them in the dark.

I used to basically give up on riding outdoors during the week between the Fall and Spring time changes. I'd still do my Sunday rides, but without the riding during the week my fitness dwindled and I couldn't do 60 mile Sunday rides by February, so every Spring I had to spend a couple months clawing back the fitness I'd given up. I tried riding a dumb trainer, but that's not for me. I can't do more than about 40 minutes before feeling like I'd rather do ANYTHING ELSE, and then the next time I wouldn't even want to get on the damn thing.

Then back in 2020, I found Zwift. I started using it during Fire Season, when the air outside was officially Unhealthy from the smoke. I found I could easily ride for an hour or more, at much the same level of effort I'd do outside. So that winter, I just kept riding the whole time - Zwift on weeknights after work and outside on the road on Sundays. That Spring, I was about as fit as I had been at the end of the previous season. No loss, no clawing back. I could build fitness from a higher base, so that the long rides could be longer and not have the last 10 miles turn into a death march, and the fast rides could be faster, too.

I don't get why some folks feel the need to denigrate others' choices. Are their egos really so fragile they can only feel good about themselves if they crap all over others for doing differently?
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Old 03-14-23, 12:04 PM
  #109  
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Do any folks who use Zwift during the winter go to the Fatbike subforum and rattle on about how silly it is to buy a fatbike and all that cold weather gear when you could just buy a smart trainer?
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Old 03-14-23, 12:14 PM
  #110  
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I will admit that I've never tried to do structured interval workouts on a fatbike on a snow covered trail before sunrise on a weekday before work, but this seems... less than ideal.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:21 PM
  #111  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
Where shall I post your medal? Honestly, nobody cares how hardcore you are. Having the need to keep stating it probably means you have insecurity issues.
Never said I was hardcore. Just suggested there are other options better than staring at a virtual screen.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:23 PM
  #112  
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Originally Posted by prj71
Even more ridiculous than a Zwift KOM is Zwift itself. Get outside and ride a bike instead of paying $500 for a machine plus $15/month to sit in one place and spin staring a screen.
Totally. All you need is a $4k fatbike and $1k worth of gear, plus a car, access to nearby snow covered trails and a bunch of free time during the day for you and your buddies to go do this.

I don't know how Zwift even survives.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:23 PM
  #113  
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Originally Posted by genejockey
Or maybe it's people whose jobs don't allow them to ride outdoors in daylight during winter except on weekends, and who would rather not trust the local drivers not to kill them in the dark.

I used to basically give up on riding outdoors during the week between the Fall and Spring time changes. I'd still do my Sunday rides, but without the riding during the week my fitness dwindled and I couldn't do 60 mile Sunday rides by February, so every Spring I had to spend a couple months clawing back the fitness I'd given up. I tried riding a dumb trainer, but that's not for me. I can't do more than about 40 minutes before feeling like I'd rather do ANYTHING ELSE, and then the next time I wouldn't even want to get on the damn thing.

Then back in 2020, I found Zwift. I started using it during Fire Season, when the air outside was officially Unhealthy from the smoke. I found I could easily ride for an hour or more, at much the same level of effort I'd do outside. So that winter, I just kept riding the whole time - Zwift on weeknights after work and outside on the road on Sundays. That Spring, I was about as fit as I had been at the end of the previous season. No loss, no clawing back. I could build fitness from a higher base, so that the long rides could be longer and not have the last 10 miles turn into a death march, and the fast rides could be faster, too.

I don't get why some folks feel the need to denigrate others' choices. Are their egos really so fragile they can only feel good about themselves if they crap all over others for doing differently?
Wouldn't riding Zwift be the same as dumb trainer? Still pedaling nowhere with the only difference being looking at a screen.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:26 PM
  #114  
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Originally Posted by prj71
Never said I was hardcore. Just suggested there are other options better than staring at a virtual screen.
Do you imagine we aren't aware of other options?
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Old 03-14-23, 12:28 PM
  #115  
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Originally Posted by msu2001la
Totally. All you need is a $4k fatbike and $1k worth of gear, plus a car, access to nearby snow covered trails and a bunch of free time during the day for you and your buddies to go do this.
I don't have that much invested in my fatbike or gear. And most everyone has a car. If I can't ride during the day I do it at night with bike lights.

Gheez...some of you make this riding outside thing seem like it's impossible to do.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:39 PM
  #116  
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Originally Posted by prj71

Gheez...some of you make this riding outside thing seem like it's impossible to do.
Which part of we donít give a toss about your fat biking preference do you not understand?
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Old 03-14-23, 12:39 PM
  #117  
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Originally Posted by prj71
Wouldn't riding Zwift be the same as dumb trainer? Still pedaling nowhere with the only difference being looking at a screen.
I've done both the dumb trainer and the smart trainer. The smart trainer's resistance changes, accompanied by a little visual distraction on a screen, is far less mind-numbingly boring.

Neither is as enjoyable as a road ride. Today is an exception, when it sounds like the roof is going to blow off the house.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:42 PM
  #118  
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Originally Posted by prj71
Wouldn't riding Zwift be the same as dumb trainer? Still pedaling nowhere with the only difference being looking at a screen.
It might be the same for someone with limited intelligence. Maybe you can do the test?
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Old 03-14-23, 12:44 PM
  #119  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
Which part of we don’t give a toss about your fat biking preference do you not understand?
That was just an example of what I do during the winter because it feasible to do. Not suggesting it's what others have to do. But I have friends elsewhere in colder climates without snow covered trails that will road ride outside or ride on dirt trails with their mountain bike.

Due to snow covered roads and salt covered roads and dirt trails being covered under snow my road bikes and mountain bikes don't see use for about 5 months of the year. So fat bike it is!!
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Old 03-14-23, 12:44 PM
  #120  
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Originally Posted by prj71
Wouldn't riding Zwift be the same as dumb trainer? Still pedaling nowhere with the only difference being looking at a screen.
No, not at all. With a dumb trainer, you have a single level of resistance, and you have to choose how hard you push by changing gears. You have to concentrate on keeping your effort up with nothing to keep you going but your own concentration.

Using a smart trainer and an app like Zwift, the trainer varies the resistance to follow the virtual terrain, much as resistance in the real world changes with the real terrain. The app takes your height and weight, and the virtual bike you choose, and uses physics to model your speed based on the virtual gradient and aerodynamic drag, so even if you're riding by yourself, you're riding on a virtual road that can be flat, or rolling, or hilly, and your speed through that world is based on your effort, so if you come to a steep pitch you may actually have to get out of the saddle for a bit to keep momentum over it. Once you're over the top, you can softpedal on the virtual descent to get your HR back down. There are other riders you can try to catch. There are races where you can compete with other riders, and group rides where you can let the pace of the group keep you going at the rate you choose, whether that's pushing yourself or recovering.

It's a video game, really, but you play it with your legs on the pedals rather than your fingers on a controller. So, it's engaging enough that I'll push myself - sometimes harder than I would on the road. Of course it's not as much fun as a ride outside, but it's a great substitute for that when it's colder, or wetter, or darker than I'm comfortable riding. Dumb trainers, staring at a wall, having to concentrate to keep my effort up just doesn't work for me.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:47 PM
  #121  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
I've done both the dumb trainer and the smart trainer. The smart trainer's resistance changes, accompanied by a little visual distraction on a screen, is far less mind-numbingly boring.

Neither is as enjoyable as a road ride. Today is an exception, when it sounds like the roof is going to blow off the house.
I'm listening to the wind outside, and thinking about riding in it, and all I can think is....
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Old 03-14-23, 12:50 PM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
It might be the same for someone with limited intelligence. Maybe you can do the test?

Nah. I'm not into the gamified & social aspects of Zwift.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:55 PM
  #123  
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The other thing about smart trainers, and Zwift and the other virtual cycling apps is that it makes interval training a lot simpler. If you have a workout that includes, for example 20 minutes at FTP, you don't have to find a road that will let you ride 20 minutes without a stop sign or traffic light, or where there's no descents to make keeping your power up difficult. If there's an all out effort, you can push it as hard as you can and then practically collapse without worrying about accidentally wandering into traffic. Using Erg Mode, the trainer will vary the resistance so that you are putting out the specified power no matter what your cadence.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:56 PM
  #124  
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Originally Posted by genejockey
No, not at all. With a dumb trainer, you have a single level of resistance, and you have to choose how hard you push by changing gears. You have to concentrate on keeping your effort up with nothing to keep you going but your own concentration.

Using a smart trainer and an app like Zwift, the trainer varies the resistance to follow the virtual terrain, much as resistance in the real world changes with the real terrain. The app takes your height and weight, and the virtual bike you choose, and uses physics to model your speed based on the virtual gradient and aerodynamic drag, so even if you're riding by yourself, you're riding on a virtual road that can be flat, or rolling, or hilly, and your speed through that world is based on your effort, so if you come to a steep pitch you may actually have to get out of the saddle for a bit to keep momentum over it. Once you're over the top, you can softpedal on the virtual descent to get your HR back down. There are other riders you can try to catch. There are races where you can compete with other riders, and group rides where you can let the pace of the group keep you going at the rate you choose, whether that's pushing yourself or recovering.

It's a video game, really, but you play it with your legs on the pedals rather than your fingers on a controller. So, it's engaging enough that I'll push myself - sometimes harder than I would on the road. Of course it's not as much fun as a ride outside, but it's a great substitute for that when it's colder, or wetter, or darker than I'm comfortable riding. Dumb trainers, staring at a wall, having to concentrate to keep my effort up just doesn't work for me.

Sounds similar to the dumb bike I occasionally ride at the gym except without the screen and social aspect. Various programs on it that simulate hills and descents and the resistance adjusts accordingly.
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Old 03-14-23, 12:56 PM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by prj71
Nah. I'm not into the gamified & social aspects of Zwift.
And I'm not into riding in the dark.
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