RT

Understood, but if by chance they are caught with the weapon in their car, it's all over but the cryin'. It is better than doing nothing.

missile meister

Originally Posted by mijome07
I miss the dinosaurs.


Then can you explain this?

Villainous_Victor.jpg

T-shirt still available (for now) at https://shirt.woot.com/friends.aspx?k=11537

JFlurett

Exactly my point. My guess is the police won't spend any time looking for this anyway.

When I got hit by a car on my bike, they asked me if anyone needed an ambulance. I said no. They said, "Well we don't come out unless someone is hurt." This is where we are today. Nothing will be done.

RT

You don't know Colorado Springs. We are third in the nation as far as DUI citations. The cops troll the city at the exact hour I'm going home. I see cops all over the place on my homeward commute, just not last night. Dumb luck.

And before you say that the drunken drivers are more dangerous, I can see any vehicle coming from a mile away, I just can't know if they're armed.

Tonight I was heckled - at friggin' 1:15 a.m. (half an hour ago) by a speeding SUV with three occupants. I stared them down and the pu$$13$ rolled their window back up when I met them at the stoplight. I called the cops and reported the plates as driving erratically.

I am convinced the criminal element is alcohol + the college students (not that this is a new idea). I will no longer take the University route home at night. The hardest part to digest is how I can have been doing this for two years without incident and now two in two nights.

WTF

Seamless

I was visiting that area this past weekend. We saw a male bike cyclist with a decorated cake on the rear rack, riding with a holstered handgun. (My nephew says he got a photo, but I haven't seen it.)

ItsJustMe

I suspect that the police may take a different view of that.

jeffpoulin

Then how about one that says POLITE in big white letters on navy blue?

chipcom 

It's been going on since I was a kid in the 60s/70s...and probably even longer than that.

Ray R

Here in San Diego they certainly would. I have a vintage BMW police motorcycle from Germany. I was riding west on University Ave. one afternoon wearing black jeans, an open face helmet, and a period double-breasted black leather jacket with "POLIZEI" on the back in tall reflective block print. Moving through traffic I could see an SDPD black and white in my mirrors trying hard to navigate through the gridlock. It finally caught up to me and lit me up. The two rookie officers wanted to know why I was "impersonating a police officer," even though I looked nothing like an officer from any modern U.S. police department. I spent about ten minutes explaining the vintage motorbike and obsolete jacket. They went back to the car to radio for instructions. Finally they came back and said that from a distance they could only see the first four letters "POLI..." and that I was doing nothing wrong and was free to go.

"No one who speaks German could be an evil man."
-The Simpsons

RT

I had actually considered having a Polizei jersey made (three years in West Germany), but I don't think even drunks are going to believe that a cop would be out on a bicycle at 1:00 a.m. :-\

Sirrus Rider

Devolution in progress.

dwr1961

I live in Idaho - where any jury would give me a standing ovation for shooting a punk trying to "blowdart" me while on my bike... Still, that level of escalation is so fraught with issues that I'll leave it to the realm of fantasy. However the idea does have a certain powerful appeal...

Drunk/stupid/brainless young men apparently see cyclists as defenseless fodder for their immature hazing and abuse. I've been spat at, screamed at, cussed at, splashed with water and beer. Fortunately the cretins usually miss the target.

I've learned to just shake my head and move on. Mixing it up with society's bottom-dwellers just doesn't seem wise once I get beyond the heat of the moment. I have a lot more to lose than they do.

Harvey2

My comment about getting a forty caliber sort of fell out of place. I do not recommend defending oneself on a bike with a firearm. Mainly that part was about getting a decent sidearm instead of regretting the caliber one got.

Flash camera still the best imo. Second the pepper spray but ultimately I'm just glad you made it here to tell us about it.

And yes lol some of us have way-out-of-the-mainstream hobbies.

Harv

khutch

I do not view it as OK for people to do mindless and cruel things to other people by any stretch of the imagination. Nothing would please me more than to see all such people caught and punished every time they commit such a deed. Having the victims take it upon themselves to exact the revenge is another matter entirely. That is actually how things were done routinely in Europe before about 1000 AD and of course that is the way things are still done in some parts of the world today. I would not care to live in 1000 AD or in the parts of the world that resemble it today. I would much rather that our justice system took care of such matters but of course as it is in everything else it does government is fairly incompetent when it comes to meting out justice. So instead we are teetering on the verge of a society that cannot bring itself to deal effectively with those who would prey upon decent citizens. Returning to the barbarian ethos of pagan Europe is not the answer, it is really just the same behavior wrapped in a mantle of self-righteousness.

If you want to get a feel of what life was like in such societies there are English translations of some of Europe's most ancient literary works available. There is a very fine collection of Sagas from Iceland that is utterly fascinating if you are up for it. It is a large volume but of course you don't have to read all of them. These were people who routinely took justice into their own hands but even though wrongdoers were often given their just and eternal reward people who were wronged frequently got the same treatment. A might makes right society pays scant attention to justice. Another glimpse into this world is found in the Volsunga Saga. It is a pretty good tale and a free version is available on line at that link. Sigurd, Gudrun, Brynhild, and the other characters are not shy at all about using lethal force to get retribution for wrongs slight and major but do they profit by that? Would you want to live in their world? This story in the form we have it is another Saga written in Iceland but the story is much more ancient than Iceland and the tale is from the Germanic tribes of pre-Christian Europe. It is a unique resource for that reason alone but it is also the source material for Wagner's Ring Cycle of operas as well as Tolkien's Lord of the Rings. Those who have read Tolkien's Silmarilion will recognize that he borrowed many of the stories in that work directly from this ancient Germanic legend and that work forms the foundation of the world described in his later and more popular works.

The most immediate problem with returning fire has already been mentioned but it bears repeating. I realize you are all crack shots who, like Walter Mitty, can hit your assailant at 1000 yards while riding on cobblestones and firing with your "wrong" hand -- at night -- without streetlights. That only exists in your mind though. No matter how good a shot you are, riding a bicycle while shooting introduces variables that will send shots astray. Most large American cities already have people who live their lives by this instant, violent code of barbarian justice. They go by many names, currently we tend to call them gangbangers. There is no slight so small that it cannot be put right by gunfire. I doubt that many of them are what you would call a crack shot and none of them puts much care into their work. And hardly a week goes by that some little boy or girl doesn't die in Chicago because their bullets missed the intended target. You may be better than that shooting-wise but bicycling prevents you from exercising your shooting skills properly and if you choose to return fire in crowded urban areas you are no better than them in other respects.

I'd rather see us all wear helmet cameras with direct wireless links to internet recording sites. Then if something happened we could just forward the video to the authorities, license plate numbers and all. That would work even in fatal accidents and attacks. I wish I could do the same in my car and have all the jerks on the road sent to remedial driving school. This is not feasible today, not quite. It won't be long before it is. Somehow we have to build a better society, Gudrun's life was nothing I would wish on any decent person.

Ken

RT

The goal for me is not primarily justice, it is to preserve the sanctity of one of the things in this life I find most fulfilling - cycling. Justice is a stepping stone on the way to solving the overall problem, but I do agree that taking the law into one's own hands is not the right approach. As someone in this thread said, I have a lot more to lose than do these idiots.

This dramatic shift in my commuting experience is a small event in the larger picture which is the decline of polite society. I could write a book on how this new generation is dragging those before it down the toilet. To some extent, I blame my generation for not properly raising their children. To a degree I blame alcohol (even more than drugs).

I used to walk five blocks to kindergarten (in the snow, uphill both ways) in a time when my parents didn't have to concern themselves with their children being abducted by pedophiles. During my drinking days, a shot of whiskey came in a 1.75 oz. glass, now shots are served in highballs with energy drinks, and in a much higher volume. I literally know more people with DUIs than I can count on two hands, and half of those have served jail time for multiple or severe offenses.

Any number of societal changes can be blamed for influencing this demise. All I know is, it has become worse over the years - first I read about the escalation of the harassment, and now I have experienced it.

Motobetird

I live in a college town, and on my way home in the snow I ride past the most expensive place to live in the town, a private dorm. Atop of the 6 story parking garage were some students hurling snow balls at passing by cars. As I rode by I thought, as long as they don't send one my way I will just let them do what they do. Then, just as I thought that I was in the clear, one comes whizzing down past my head by about 2ft away from hitting me. I stopped, screamed obscenities, and proceeded to ride my bike up 6 stories after them. I would not normally approach any group of people to start a confrontation, however I know that these kids were all ******* and I could abuse them with words and avoid any physical contact. At the top there was no body except a tray full of snow balls. I broke them all and busted the tray over the door.

mickey85

Just reading this thread is making me furious. My students "joke" about dooring me with their cars when they see me on the roads...I tell them that a U lock is very capable of breaking windows, and I will know the car that does it to me.

I don't know if I could help myself from beating them to a pulp the next day. I'd probably flash white with rage and not know what I'm doing. Disrespect makes me so angry I can't even stand it.

JFlurett

Ken,

With all due respect to a though out post, you have taken it to the extreme. No one is suggesting breaking down the judicial system. Other countries seem to do just fine with the death penalty, eye for an eye, and similar types of punishments.

We are a weak nation full of apathy and bleeding hearts.

RT

This...

...and this.

It's funny - the only reason I consider carrying my lock is not to secure my rig, but to use as a weapon. What on Earth is the world coming to?

khutch

I was not speaking out against those although eye-for-eye punishment is too cruel in my opinion. I was recently injured in an accident that may have been the fault of someone else, I don't know because I have amnesia, no memory of that afternoon. If this was someone else's fault and not something stupid that I did I would not feel bad if the person responsible was given a ticket and made to repay my medical insurance (and me) for my medical expenses. I do not want to live in a society that would take the individual, break four of their ribs, puncture their lung, and give them a concussion. That is not right, sorry. I was commenting on the expressions here supporting individual retaliation with firearms or other weapons. People here are supporting that. That is gangbanger culture. I don't want to live in that society either. I'd like to see gangbanger culture eliminated from our society, not enshrined as normal practice by ordinary citizens. It certainly is apathy and bleeding hearts that perpetuates gangbanger culture here.

Ken

electrik

People who advocate for the death penalty are the real weaklings.

Sad - this conversation is even further off track now.

JFlurett

... because a murder's life is more important than the many lives he/she took and the hundreds of lives they've effected by their inhumane, disgusting, and selfish acts.

There is no repercussion for actions here.

*No, sitting in a room that society pays for, eating meals that society pays for, and having rights that we as a society hold true despite the fact that you've broken our laws, is not repercussion.

electrik

There are of course repercussions for their actions, without being caught or punished their are repercussions. In fact sometimes not being caught is the worst thing of all.

I won't condone state sponsored murder as long as there are options remaining. Even if these "gangbangers" are shooting darts at people or just your common everyday mass murderer(personally i don't think Hitler gave a **** about any death penalty) one must realize that killing them won't solve the real problem. It will only increase the problem.

ItsJustMe

Certainly not in the case of an accident. But what if someone came up to you with a baseball bat and intentionally did all that to you without provocation? OK, I still wouldn't advocate beating them up, though at that point they certainly should be locked up and given therapy until at least we were pretty sure they weren't going to do it to someone else again.

IMO the death penalty is appropriate for people who intentionally commit heinous acts with no provocation, do not show remorse and do not have a reasonable hope of ever getting to the point of showing remorse.

seenoweevil

Slingshot and ball bearings. That's my open carry choice, and I'm a pretty good shot(standing, not on a bike, admittedly). Haven't had to use it though, and there's a good chance I'd never get a shot off in time, but just the CHANCE that I'd dent the bum's fender or break a window is enough for me. That said, I am looking around at cameras to mount on my helmet for just in case recording.