Aardwolf

Hiya folks,
I've just got a Record front hub (possibly around 1982, 7/32" bearings) in the post and it's great ,,,, except for the cones (marked 9 x 26tpi).
So I'm wondering what the correct part number is and did the cones ever change ?

Mainly because I found an advert for

Campagnolo HB-RE005 Front Cone for 1994-96 Record Front Hub. Uses 7/32 Bearings

Which would seem to be the about right except for the date range.
Anybody know if these would fit ?

Aardwolf

I've ordered one cone for £12 to see what it's like.

In the meantime I've worked out a way of comparing cones:
1) Photograph the outline - cone on a lightbox and macro lens on a copy stand (so distance fixed)
2) Magic Wand in photoshop to detect the outline
3) Fill and stroke in photoshop to isolate the edge
4) Merge different cone images at 50% opacity.

The previous front hub for these rims is an Ofmega which uses 3/16" bearings and a 9mm 26tpi axle (ie. Campy spec):

Campy Record 25/R: 7/32" bearings, 15.8mm diameter, 11.5mm length
Ofmega: 3/16" bearings, 16mm diameter, 12mm length




It looks to me like those line up quite well, I could probably just use the Ofmega cones
I'll do another comparison when the HB-RE005 cone turns up.

Bianchigirll 

Good Morning. I don’t understand why no one answered your original question unless, like me, they aren’t quite sure what the question is and what you’re trying to do.

I believe the part number fir the ‘82ish cone is 25R.

The new cone for a ‘94-96 Record hub might be same but slightly different since that is now for the Ergo era hubs, which the front one is still basically based on the Corsa Recorc hubs.


in regards to this morning’s post, since the Ofmega hub is basically a CampI clone the cone will likely work.

However IMHO if your ultimate goal is simply to replace a Ofmega hub on a built wheel with a CampI hub, I think you’re doing a lot of thinking and work for little gain. The working quality of both hubs is about the same although under regular daily use the CampI might last a bit longer. As for presentation most casual observers will never really notice the difference. Also if you have a built functional wheel rebuilding it simply to change the hub sounds somewhat like a fool’s errand to me.

Maybe when I was younger I might have been more picky about things like this but I think pure laziness saved from such things as swapping out a Super Record headset for a Chorus one or the hub swap your doing. These days as long as the bike is clean, functional and performs well that’s much more important that every part matching and being made on the same day despite being from 23 different companies.

verktyg 

A few years back I overhauled an Ofmega front hub using Campy Record 25/R cones that dated at least as far back as the 1960 catalog. The Campy cones appeared to be a little better quality than the Ofmega cones.

verktyg

Aardwolf

Morning, and thanks for the reply.

Yep, my original post didn't say why I'm doing this

My Holdsworth came with a set of Mavic Monthlery Route tubular rims on Ofmega hubs when I bought it, the original spec is Super Champion Model 58 clincher rims.
I put on a set of Tufo S33 Pro to get the bike running and they work but they are a bit harsh. But I had to replace a bad cone on the rear axle and eventually replaced the
whole rear axle with a Weldtite one (a noob mistake). Also it has naff zinc plated spokes.

So I built a set of Mavic MA2 rims with decent tyres and they're working really well (8 speed with Shimano RX100 hubs and DT stainless spokes). The hubs are noticably better than the Ofmega ones.
They are now my 'everyday' rims and I was wondering what to do with the Monthlery Route.

I decided to rebuild them as period good quality tubulars (for an urban environment): better hubs + stainless spokes + decent tyres.
The (Mistral) Holdsworth pricier than the one I've got had Campy hubs as standard (probably Nuovo Tipo since the catalogue doesn't say Record) so I decided to look for some Nuovo Tipo or Record hubs on Ebay.
So I've now got a Record front hub and a Nuovo Tipo rear hub in the post, I'm thinking they will work better than the Ofmega hubs I've already got.
But I've got no real idea of how good the Ofmega hubs are supposed to be, I can't identify the model on Velobase.


To be honest changing the tyres will make the most difference, but I also don't like the scruffy zinc spokes and I think the new hubs will be better.

Yep I've now worked out the '82 Record cones are known as 25R but I don't know how/if they are different from the ones in the advert.
If the advertised cones can work in my '82 Record hubs they would be better since they're NOS in factory packaging, but I could fit the Ofmega cones until I find some 25R.

So I think it all makes senese, even if a lot of people would'nt try it

Bianchigirll 

While not the lightest those Montherly Route rims were nice. I had a pair laced to some Sheriff Star hubs and other than a bent rear axles, I had respaced them to 8spd, I don’t recall ever having an issue.

Aardwolf

Yep, I got this bike 6 months back after a break of 35ish years and I'd never experienced tubulars, I quite like them.
I figure the roads round here are not great so the Monthlery Route are probably a good option and won't break.
However I'm not sure I could fix a tubular on the roadside.

I'm going to fit a 7 speed freewheel (Sunrace 14-28 probably) and some 28c tubulars (Vittoria Rubino Pro IV G2.0 ?) and wear
them on sunny days in the summer and promenade slowly looking cool (maybe).

obrentharris 

Most of us mere mortals don't try to fix tubulars on the roadside: We just carry a spare (or two!)
Brent

Aardwolf

Yep, I've heard the theory

I had to stretch the Tufo S33 Pros for 3 days using a ratchet luggage strap before they would go on the rims.
I took the front one off a few days back - about 2 hours using tyre levers (it was my first time), the Tufo tape came off cleanly though.

I'm sure the theory is correct, but I know I can change an inner tube in 10 mins because I've done it.
I'm hoping Vittoria Rubino Pro IV are easier.

Road Fan

I have some experience with tubulars, which I would like to share. First, I’m working on a set of nearly-period correct wheels for my Peugeot PX-10 from 1967 or so, and a set of Monthlery would be very near to OEM for that bike. I have a trade in mind for you. This part of the site is not for commercial stuff, so I’ll try to send you a PM about that.

Also, I don’t think we were clear: I think very few people have ever made a practice of patching tubular inner tubes on the roadside, regardless of your (or my) clincher chops. The big difference is stitching up the tire casing after you have patched the tube. It’s normal, and has been since I first had tubulars around 1970, to carry a spare tire or two, and a good pump that can get you 90 to 100 psi. The classic in my day was the Silca. Another classic experience was to fix a few punctured tubulars in an evening where it’s quiet, well-lit, and you have a place for a beverage or your dinner.



If you wanted to shift those

Aardwolf

Sorry for any confusion, I realise carrying a spare tubular is the norm, I wasn't expecting to stitch one on the road.
And I've even got an original Bluemels 3 frame pump that actually works, I used it on the Tufos before I got a track pump.

It's just that I can't see fitting a spare Tufo S33 Pro on the roadside unless I've pre-stretched it and I've got 3 hours to spare.
Maybe I'll learn how to do it some day.

The Monthlery Route are the only tubular rims I've got and they're perfect for my situation so I think I'll be hanging on to them.

obuckler

Your experience of taking 2 hours to pull off the s33 tire from a Tufo taped tire is the best argument for not using tape at all. It was my experience also. Something that would never be done on the road. Switch to glue and you can change out a tire faster that a clincher tube.

I have two wheelsets with Monthlery Route rims and they are perfect for my weight (180 lbs) and the city roads I frequent.

Have dented my lighter AVA rims hitting bumps. Recommend the Monthlery rims highly. Found mine NOS.

Never had the stretching issues you mentioned. Not sure why you did other than they were Tufos? Don’t think any tire maker would recommend stretching by ratcheting with a strap?

Aardwolf

I'm fairly sure it was just a problem with those Tufos, I read others had the same issue eg. https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...ing-ideas.html (he sent them back)

Tufo S33 Pro 24mm (25mm mounted).

And here's my solution

JohnDThompson 

I stretch all my tubulars on rims before mounting them. Some can be quite a struggle; I've found zip-ties to be helpful in holding the tire in place while wrestling rhe last bit onto the rim. Once stretched on the rim for a while, subsequent mounting is much easier.

I've found that despite the name, the Tufo "Extreme" tape is easier to deal with than the standard Tufo tape, at least with non-Tufo tires.

Aardwolf

Cheers I'll give it a try. I've only taped one set of tyres so far, I haven't tried traditional glueing yet.
Think I'll try the extreme tape and then glueing when one of the new tyres needs replacing if the tape gives trouble.

Aardwolf

Looks like HB-RE005 is probably not usable as a 25R standin, I'm definitely no expert but the shape is sufficiently different that I'm going to go with the Ofmega cones.

Campy Record 25/R: 7/32" bearings, 15.8mm diameter, 11.5mm length
Ofmega: 3/16" bearings, 16mm diameter, 12mm length
Campy Record HB-RE005: 7/32" bearings, 15.83mm diameter, 8.93mm length

Aardwolf

Vittoria Rubino Pro G+ 28mm went on (fitting test only) just using fingers

At 60 psi it's 27.2mm wide, leaving me 4.5mm clearance - slightly less when I install the glue and inflate some more.

Darme

This is is from 1982 campy support publication ..