benoksanen

So I just picked a vintage Carlton bike up, and have no idea how to identify it or tell if it is worth something. I'm pretty solid at fixing old bike (not this old or nasty), but don't want to mess anything up that I don't have to.

I was unable to post pictures here (I've tried before, I tried this time), so instead I posted it up on craigslist. If you are interested in helping, follow this link to comment, much appreciated. Fear not, $3000 is just a number that I wrote up there.

Someone must be interested to see what I pulled out of a front yard sporting a sign reading "FREE someone won the tour de france on this bike in 1966".

By the way, bike does have almost full campy, so I assume it was pretty nice. I have the full spec written out as best I could on the craigslist listing. Oh, frame is rusty but not rusted through.

Here is the link ... Vintage Carlton in tough shape

Finally, I am an avid rider (mountain mostly, sidelined with a rotator cuff tear) not just a turd.

Thanks!
Ben

0.2HP

Start by getting the serial number off the bottom bracket shell, and if you can get the year it was made from here:

Raleigh Serial Numbers & Charts

Then look in the catalogs for that year:

Raleigh Catalog Database Archive

Retro Raleighs

Also look to see if the model name is on the top tube. Can also try to match color and components with these charts:

'The Headbadge': Raleigh (Carlton) Registry Database

A Chronology of Raleigh Models

Retro Raleighs: Professionals

Retro Raleighs: The International

Tom Forhan's Periodic Table of the Raleigh Super Course

benoksanen

0.2hp, Thanks for suggestions. I tried every one of them to no avail. The serial # is Y2971 (bottom bracket), which didn't match any of the formats and got me off to a bad start. As far as the other sources, no luck identifying anything (though I don't really know what to look for).

Any other takers or folks with good ideas? Thanks again.
Ben

daf1009

Ben...welcome to the forums...so...you own this bike? Is that your CL ad? If not...we will probably ask for some better pictures...close ups of several areas...seat cluster, head tube, bottom bracket, decals...also, if you can list the components on the bike, that may help...

bertinjim 

benoksanen-

Try the VVCC on line archive here for Carlton. Raleigh frequently just slapped a Raleigh Heron on the headtube and left the rest of the bike Carlton. Yours looks like a Flyer from the lugs but possibly a Competition or an International. Check seatpost diameter to id for 531 which would be 27.2 mm. Other dimensions like 26.4ish might indicate plain gauge 531 and Tru-Wel 205 hi-ten came in under that dimension. Possibly a Criterium?

big chainring 

Looks a lot like a '68, '69 Raleigh Pro.

benoksanen

daf1009, I do own this bike, and it is my cl ad (I wasn't trying to sell, it was the only way that I could think of posting pictures). I did my best to photograph and list the parts and decals - i guess my best wasn't good enough (sorry James Ingram). If I don't find some info, I'll get on some better photos soon.

bertinjim, thanks for the info and homework. I'll take a look into all of this.

I'm hoping a 1970, because that's what I am.

In the meantime, a fellow on craigslist offered me $150 despite me hiding it in bike parts and asking $3000. I do know I'll be no better off in this life with an extra $150, however getting paid to clean junk out of my garage is cool and I love the idea of this bike getting refurbished. I'm a solid bike mechanic, but this looks way too much for me. Any thoughts?

zukahn1 

It's a nice bike but in rough condition with slightly mixed components in it's current shape as is. I would think $150-200 would be fair on this one. The issue on this one value wise is it would cost about as much to fully fix as it would be worth in nice riding condition.

big chainring 

Thats a nice bike. Worth way more than what is being tossed about here. Like I have said before, an afternoon ofwrenching on that bike and you have a real gem. As is I would expect $400. If it's a 59-60cm, I'd buy it for that.

benoksanen

So the closest that I can come to identifying this bike is a 1969 Raleigh pro (such as ... https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...ts-photos.html). Seems some have more cable stops, but mine, like this one, only has one on the chainstay. I have the same bottom bracket lugs and seat lugs as this, and same "stripes" at the top of the seatstays. That being said, mine says Carlton and has on other legible writing on it. Fair to say maybe a pro, probably higher end whatever it is.

So I'm wondering what to do with this - frame is cosmetically challenged with missing paint and surface rust, but only surface rust, and there are no dings or dents whatsoever. It has a 27.2 post, so I assume it is 531 steel. My choices are:

1. Sell it to someone who will fix it up right on this forum. From what I gather, this bike warrants the effort.

2. Fix it up a bit and call it done. It is a 58cm to top of top tube (22.5 in), so my 5'10" body has that covered. I've done plenty of degreasing, repacking, running new cables, and even a little oxacylic acid to rusty steel, etc. The only reason that I don't like this option is (a) I don't really know how to address the frame (I assume cleaning, maybe framesavering, and some wax product that I'm not aware of would shine it up and protect it), and (b) every time I try to kick back and enjoy vintage down tube shifters, I long for my titanium with modern shifting. Then I just sell it on ebay or craigslist.

I think I am looking for a reliable presence on this board to take this off my hands and do it right, or looking for a reliable presence on this board to talk me through not wrecking the frame.

Any thoughts or guidance? If someone were to buy it, I'd like to use the board to set a fair price, and then ask that I get half the $$$, the other half would be a check written directly to the high school that I teach at for our "maroon and white scholarhip fund" ($$$$ given to college bound student with limited financial means).

juvela

+1

that's what i was thinking also. had the opportunity to ride one of these which came fitted with a mafac tiger brakeset.

find it interesting that head emblem is the cutout heron while for this date one would expect the oval head emblem as on the example linked to in post nr. 10 above. dates from right around the time the emblem changed.

big chainring 

Dang, I would take it off your hands but just a bit small for me. I think over painting the white would be the extent of any restoration I would do on it. Leave the contrasting colors. Touch up, fill in the missing Carlton lettering. Polish up the parts. Replace the crank with a Campy. That Era Raleigh Pro is my favorite.

benoksanen

So I'm keeping and refinishing/restoring a bit. Absolutely no dents, so looks good. I need some advice on how to handle the frame without wrecking it. LOTS of small scratches/chips with surface rust all over. I was thinking...
- strip parts, oxalic acid bath
- spot dab some auto paint (will I need primer? Any recommendations on brand?) that matches
- Any smoothing, with fine emery perhaps, required?
- is there any polishing that can be done, if so, with what?
- apply wax and buff a bit
Thanks in advance for advice. Even a link is fine. I've read quite a few, still not sure what to do.

cbutler

+1

I'd have a hard time resisting this bike at 350 - 400.

The frame seems to be built for the UK market, about the time that Raleigh bought Carlton. The frame is likely 531 DB with Campag ends and Cinelli full sloping crown. The Pro model sold in the US had fastback seatstays, yours has very nice wrapover stay caps. It's late 60's early 70's due to the lack of brazeons.

I'd look at UK Raleigh catalogs from '66-'74

benoksanen

Thanks all for help/advice. Looks to be about a 69 Raleigh/Carlton Professional. After a lot of hand-wringing, thinking, plotting - I tore it down, cleaned, repacked all bearings, trued the wheels. Went back and forth on paint (it was pretty rough), but I opted to touch up a few spots after lightly sanding/naval jellying surface rust. Looks like all is original except ...
- crank and bb are Superbe Pro
- skewers aren't correct
- not sure if rims are original, as they aren't tubular. Hubs do match the remainder of bike - which is all campy.

Thanks again. Now what to do ... I never enjoy downtube shifters. Oh well, perhaps time to suck it up.

benoksanen

Another view, not too different but ...

exxongraftek

Your rims are 27" I believe.
Looking at how the brake shoes are at the top of the slots makes me think they may be original rims, but I'm just a 27" wheel Carlton past-owner, not an expert.

Thanks for coming back and letting us know how the story turned out... a rather rare thing.
What a wonderful find! Enjoy!

benoksanen

The bike cleaned up very well and was decent to ride. I just don't like downtube shifters, so put it on craigslist. Lots of emails, but in the end a very nice fellow that lived about 1/2 mile from my house paid $500 for it. He seemed like he'd really enjoy it, so all was good. Thanks all for help identifying the bike - I really wanted to like it, but it fell behind my ti and my single speed in the road bike pecking order, and I'm a mountain biker so it had to go to free up space.

Go Uconn Huskies!

alanalys

Well, not really the end... I'm the guy who bought the bike and really enjoy it. It does seem to be a 1967 Professional. I need to ride it more, competes with my other old bikes on weekends. Still need to find an appropriate Campy crank, but otherwise all works well. Happy rides!

benoksanen

Excellent! I think about that bike now and again … I’m happy that you enjoy it. If you ever think of selling, please give me a shot. Apparently I get notified if you post on this thread.

Peace. Ben