RobbieTunes

If you need to fill out that group, just let me know. I won't be going up to Hastings any time soon, but I do have mail service...…

Also looks good with a 1055 group... that frame can really let loose....

RobbieTunes

Someone has to be there with some sense. May as well be you.

cb400bill

Thank Robbie. If that wheel work out then I think I'm good. If anything unforeseen pops up, I'll let you know.

texaspandj

Thanks for the info. I was thinking 13-40 but with your input I'll go with 34...unless someone else pipes in with a bigger number.

seypat

Don't stop there. Might as well put a triple on front also.

RobbieTunes

And a white basket on front.

texaspandj

Seypat, I can't steal your "seypat setup" and RT, to give it the RTish look it would have to be a White basket to match the white trek decals.

Initially I was looking for a yuge cassette to just add insult to injury for me riding the trek in the first place. But now thinking about it, at some point in the future (probably nearer than I want to admit) I may be needing that 40 tooth rear sprocket.
Besides I intend to ride it at least once OR keep and ride it when i ride with my riding partner. The fact is I feel like I'm cheating when I ride with him on my Ironman with aero bars. However, I only use the aero bars when trying to catch him after he accelerates quickly after a stop light. The trek will stay road bars as long as I have it.

My plan is to split my long rides on Sundays if I ride with my riding partner. He generally has limited time on Sundays so short rides up to 26 miles is all he can do. I'm trying to convince him to ride our hilly ride (<relative term ) about 17 miles then immediately after I can ride a 30+ miles on my Ironman. Problem is, in spite of his -20 lb advantage on me he dislikes our "hilly" ride. I tried to convince him the hillier route will do him and me good (mostly me). I even used the old adage " riding makes you strong, and riding hills makes you strong faster". With some races planned and marked, I need to get on it.
Since the time change I ride M,W,F 26 miles. Sundays are my long rides. Later Irongents.

texaspandj

Sunny lighting


Over cast lighting
​​​​​​​Here's my '86 Pic mode and training mode.Its now my designated Monday rider. The original wrap us starting to go and may have to resort to my inner tube wrap.

markwesti

Hey tex , I think you have said before but is that a 7400 DA RD and 7400 DA DT shiffters ?

texaspandj

Yo mark, The DT shifters, and FD are 7400. I originally thought the RD was 7400 but turns out it's a 7402 and I would rather have had the 7400 RD. Oh well.
BTW, the headset, bottom bracket, Hubs and freewheel are also Dura Ace.
​​​​​​​The aero seatpost, brakeset and crankset are 6oo.

canklecat

On a whim I swapped the rear wheel from my Univega Via Carisma to the Ironman this week. It's an Alex S500, 14mm inner bead width I think, pretty close to the Ironman's original Araya CTL-370. But the Alex rim wheel has an 8-speed cassette on it, 11-32, and I was curious to try it on the Ironman. I didn't try to make it fit the entire 8-speed range, just the 11-28 cogs.

The Alex S500 rim is sorta-aero, which theoretically might be better if combined with aero spokes -- which this wheel doesn't have. It's definitely heavier than the original Araya CTL-370, which was supposed to have been exceptionally lightweight for late 1980s clincher rims. And there's a thicker, heavier no-name hub, the usual loose bearing thing. Seemed as good as the Suntour and Shimano hubs I've worked on.

The hub setup was very slightly too wide, but that's because I used a shim or two for proper centering on the Univega. For the Ironman I'd remove that shim. But for a test ride I just spread the frame carefully, enough to pop the wheel in.

Had to switch to friction mode but it ran well. I'd still rather have a dedicated and properly designed friction lever set for that, but this was good enough for a test ride. The 28T cog was handy on my first hilly section, since I didn't bother warming up first and that hill is only a mile from home. And into a headwind Tuesday. Combined with the 39T small chainring, that combo should handle any hills in our area even when my legs are dead. But I wouldn't kick a 32T big cog out of the freehub. And a 38T small chainring might be even better.

I used the 11T cog briefly on a fast downhill, but even with my 50T big chainring there still wouldn't be many occasions when I'd need to push a 50/11 gear. A 12-32 or 12-28 8-speed wheel might be about right.

Mostly I was trying to pinpoint some creaking noise on the Univega. I was pretty sure it was the rear wheel's black enameled/painted spokes and sure 'nuff, when I swapped wheels the Ironman developed the same creaking noise -- with the same wheel.

I oiled the spoke nipples, relieved and retightened the spokes, cussed until I got it true again, and took it for a 24 mile ride on the Ironman Tuesday. Seemed to have eliminated most of the worst squeaking. Boeshield T-9 in the fiction surfaces where the black enameled/painted spokes cross didn't help. So I tried some leftover soft candle wax. Slathered it around every likely friction point. Seemed to cure the creaking -- but so far I've tried it only on the indoor trainer. We'll see Wednesday whether I really eliminated the squeaks.

Anyway, fun to try a different wheel on the Ironman. Good to know it could work. But I was missing the lighter original rear wheel and index shifting with the 7-speed freewheel.

And I got my fastest times on a couple of loops and turnarounds that negate the effects of wind. Not sure I'll credit the wheel. Just a good day for the legs, despite the allergies and asthma snot rockets I was launching like it was the phlegm equivalent to D-Day.

texaspandj

Equivalent to D-day, lol.
I tried the C-Cat test, ( for those who don't know that's when you kick your pedal backwards to see how many revolutions it spins) on my '86 and lo and behold it barely made one complete revolution! I discovered it when I went to lube my chain which is something I don't do. Instead I just spray with wd40 and wipe. But since my '86 had been hanging so long and my wife had bought me some clearance chain lube I thought I'd give it a whirl. It needed the lube btw. So I put the bike on my 5 dollar work stand and started to investigate. I noticed it sounded funny when it was coasting. Anyways, it turned out it was the dura ace freewheel. The same one I overhauled a while back. When I pulled it apart, It looked like I had too many ball bearings. So I took two out and dribbled a little of said chain oil and it was back to normal. I theorized, since I used grease in the initial overhaul, that one was ninja-ed in the grease. I also remember I swiped a ball bearing to make the race full even though I was careful not to lose any. I also remember pming freewheel guru pastor Bob and asked how many ball bearings are in a dura ace freewheel, he said he never counted. Later I read to leave 1 bearing out, but too late I filled it completely. So thats why I took two out. One thing to note. From now on when overhauling freewheels to use white lithium grease instead of the marine grease I use. It seems to me that white lithium grease is oem for most freewheels and lubing of components, shimano and campagnolo alike.
But All my other Ironman were fine when I applied the @canklecat test. C-Cat perhaps you should describe the test.

canklecat

Yeah, the pedal swat test I described... I should have videoed my Ironman with the original sintered bushing bearings in the GPX rear derailleur. It would have easily demonstrated something that's hard to describe in words. Next time I clean the RD I'll swap out the new Tacx sealed bearing pulleys and swap in the original bearings and video the demo.

Basically, the original simple bearings on the GPX RD created way too much friction. I could feel it pedaling. And I could see it with the bike on a work stand. Swat or shove the pedal backward in any gear combo -- the pedal would barely make a full rotation. Or, by hand, crank the pedal up to speed with the bike in top gear, then let go and see how far the pedal continues to rotate. Again, it stopped almost immediately.

When I did the same test on other bikes, notably older classic road bikes, the results were very different. All of those bikes would produce at least a full rotation and a half, and often more. There was noticeably less felt friction when operating the pedals by hand, forward and backward.

For several months I switched to an old Shimano 600 rear derailleur, which eliminated that draggy feel. But it was friction shifting only and I really wanted the Accushift back.

I chased down the problem one component at a time without success. I even fussed over reducing RD cage pivot spring tension, even drilling a hole to set the spring retention leg for reduced tension. Didn't fix the problem, but maybe the spring will last longer. And the bike still shifts properly with enough chain tension.

Late one night I noticed some Tacx sealed bearing pulleys for only around $12 for a set, comparable Delrin or other plastic pulleys, appropriate number of teeth, etc. On a whim I ordered a set and it cured the problem immediately. Now when I whack the pedals backward they'll spin up to 3 complete rotations. Or if I crank forward with the bike on a stand, the cranks will continue to rotate freely for awhile.

I'm not any faster. But I'm not as strong as I was this time last year (before injury and illness). But I'm *as fast* as I was this time last year. And it takes less energy to pedal. So the few watts I gained from a more efficient pulley set compensated for my reduced energy and power output.

texaspandj

Latest version of my '87 Expert. Mostly original except the aero seatpost, aero bars, 7 speed gripshift, 13-26 freewheel and turbo saddle. This is my heaviest Ironman so I use it for the hills and also the reason I have the big freewheel.


Here's how I ride it. Those bottles don't match but they're more Miami Vice colors than the bike.

​​​​​​​This my Wednesday rider.

markwesti

Is that morning or evening sun ? Cool shot . Those bottles are definitely MV !

texaspandj

My wife gave me some chain oil that she purchased on clearance. It was something I appreciated but figured I never use. However since most of my bikes had been hanging a while I figured what the hey no better time or more to the the point probably the only time I'd use it as my chains looked a little dry. In spite of the adage a "well oiled machine", I think I'll stick with my usual method of a wd40 spray then wipe method. I know , I know, wd40 is not a chain lube but it is a lubricant and since I rotate my bikes out now, it'll last about a month before I need to treat it again. But more to the point is that the bike chain lube I used, although effective, it's Messy. First it uses a brush to apply, then after I let it sit I wiped and it still got everywhere, but mostly the drive side everything, including rear wheel. That may not surprise you but it did me. Especially because I wiped it pretty good after application. Actually, maybe, maybe, maybe, I could see lubing chain once a year to help preserve original lube, then use my usual WD40 method, but probably Not, the more I think about it.
If I had only one bike and put at least 250 Miles a week I'd only need to spray and wipe the chain once a week. But because I have four I only spray and wipe once a month.
WD40 it cleans and lubes chain (providing you never remove original chain lube). Oh note of caution if you ride in wet conditions you'll need to reapply a lot sooner. Think squeaky door, or key hole that got wet, wd40 works...well for me.


I finally finished my trek project...well sort of. I still need to cut and cap cables and get white bar tape. I actually have a clear inner tube I was gonna put on there but although the tube is 30 years old it didn't need patching and I couldn't see myself cutting up a good but never to be used tube. It's called a poly lite made by panasonic I think. They were made for triathletes, supposed to be lighter however they required a special patching if I recall correctly. I thought since I use inner tube for bar wrap it would be appropriate and funny. Anyways back to the trek. Since I had a complete group of Ironman 105 stuff I would use it, but I turns out I didn't have the complete group. I either sold or gave away parts of it. So since the deore LX rear derailleur looks very similar to the original 105 I thought I'd use it. And since the '89 Ironman wheelset I have is HG I thought I'd get a huge silver cassette with a walmart 9 speed shiny chain. I thought I'd be funny to put on a pie plate cassette on that "racing" bike. But I remembered I had no budget and also that I had a 13-28 freewheel. And that I had a pair of '87 Ironman wheels I got from RT, (We traded, he gave me fuel money to pick up an Ironman in Dallas and I kept the wheelset for time and shipping labor). I ended buying the cheaper non shiny chain from walmart that matched the non shiny freewheel. I still had a 105 front derailleur but the trek needed a braze on style. So I had a couple of the 6401 tricolor and used the one missing the sticker, hey it matched better. I didn't have a 105 brakeset, instead I used the dia compe calipers that came with the trek but the levers weren't great. So I used the extra levers off my '89 Ironman. Well at least I had the 105 crankset. Also I used the white cables off my 56cm Miami Vice I sold to RT (how come RT is in every ironman story...and now trek). Let's see..I'm temporarily using the bar tape that was on the trek, it's some good stuff. The tires are the amidillo that came with my Carbon Ironman. I think that's it. So to recap, here's a trek 5900 built with mostly Ironman parts. Ok here's a pic.

texaspandj

Doh! I forgot I don't have a pic 8n my tablet only in my phone. So here's the iron-man trek. I sent this pic to my riding buddy who I had in mind when I built this uhhh thing.

Not a good pic but it's trek so just as well, hehe

seypat

WD40 is a water displacer. Not really a lube. If you trying to save some coin, go to Walmart or one of the auto parts stores and get some generic chain lube/general lube.

texaspandj

Haha. Well yes and no. Its both water displacement and lube well more like lubricant.
I've told this story before but I used only WD 40 for years as a chain lubricant and cleaner. I'm sure I read about it in '80s in a bike mag. Anyways, when I was younger I would wash my bike once a week including using wd40 to spray and wipe. It worked great and was putting some mileage on back then. So, years later when I decided to get back into cycling I used the same method. No problem. Then I got a chain left for dead and decided to bring it back to life. I had read where using paint thinner would get rid of the dirt and rust so I did that and it worked! Then I decided to lubricate per my usual method of WD40. I rode a mile before it started squeaking. Complained about it here and jetboy told me the same thing you said. So I used motor oil to lube it and it was fine. I stated and still believe the difference was removing the original lube is when wd40 will NOT work but otherwise it works for me. Honestly I kinda regret using the stuff my wife got me, I mean it works, but it's so messy. Here's a pic of the chain lube and the other lubes I use. The Teflon silicone lubricant is for our treadmill but I use it for brake cables and it works great. I usually use walmarts version of wd40 but they were out so was forced to pay name brand price. The thing about the wd40 is I use it for a lot of things not just cleaning/lubricating chain.
Alright gents, what chain lube do you use? I know C-Cat uses wax. What about the rest of you. Me, I'm sticking with wd40 but the walmart equivalent. HeHe. Every time I type HeHe I think of markwesti. He's mischievous.

texaspandj

Pic.

rccardr 

canklecat

A rare Centrekian Carbonman!

WD-40 is okay as a short term lube. I once used it instead of grease on hubs just before a 75 mile ride that included an impromptu 50+ mph drafting of a truck. Not my brightest idea. But the hubs and bearings were fine when I checked them a few days later. I switched back to grease. There was no discernible advantage to using oil instead of grease, and oil wouldn't keep out water and debris as effectively. And the clicking noise of the bearings without grease was annoying.

But as a chain lube redone every couple of weeks or month, should be fine.

Besides wax, I touch up the waxed chains occasionally with Boeshield T-9. Also a very light lube that needs to be replenished often, and is mostly a protective film rather than lube.

I also use Park CL-1 oily wet lube on my Univega, but will probably switch it to wax next time I replace the chain.

Since my bikes stay indoors and I have three cats, waxed chains are cleaner. No chain mark cattoos or shintoos.

fleslider 

I tend to use Tri-Flow or some Ritchey lube that i have, Wipe down the chain real good to get any crud off of it, then lube link plates and rollers one at a time. let it sit for a few mins and wipe down .

TXsailor

I use Boeshield T9. Its not messy but your chain will give you black tattoo if you get against the big ring. I clean the chain with wd-40 or mineral spirits depending on how dirty it is then put a drop on every link then spin it a few times. I let it sit a while or even till the next day then wipe the residue off usually with some paper towels. I go anywhere from 100-200 miles depending on how lazy I am. My chains usually last about 3000 miles and I have never had one squeak or maybe I am just too old and deaf to hear it.

canklecat

My latest temporary Ironman experiment -- to see if my hybrid's wheelset with 8-speed freehub and 11-32 cassette would fit and function in friction mode, using the stock Suntour GPX derailleur. The wheelset is Alexrims S500, 622x14, on generic unlabeled loose bearing hubs with 8-speed freehub.

Yup, it works... just barely. Gotta be extremely careful to avoid shifting into the 32T rear cog while in the big chainring. It will shift into the 28T cog, but is crosschained so badly it's not worth using.

And even with the B-screw turned fully in the two smallest cogs still drag against the pulley cages. So shifting is much more critical with this combo of 11-32 8-speed.

This was mostly an experiment to pinpoint a persistent creak in my hybrid. Turned out to be the spokes in this rear wheel. The black painted or enameled spokes began rubbing each other the wrong way. Happened after I went off a low rounded curb. Didn't throw the wheel out of true, but did cause it to creak and squeak. Destressing and retightening the spokes and soft wax at the junction points quieted the creaking.

Not a bad wheelset. A bit heavier than the Araya CTL-370 and Suntour GPX hubs. I'm not sure I'm strong enough for the semi-aero rim profile to matter. And I used the slightly heavier set of 700x25 Conti Ultra Sport 2 tires from last year, at lower pressure, around 75 front, 85 rear. My average speed over 50 miles seemed about the same, hard to tell due to stiff winds. Strava's power guesstimation calculator shows my average power was a little lower than usual on the same circuit routes I usually ride.

The 11T cog was interesting for a couple of fast downhill runs. I wasn't spun out as I usually am with the 50T big ring and 13T smallest cog on the freewheel. And the 28T next-to-big-cog was handy on a couple of hills into headwinds. I'm hoping I won't need the 32T cog with a 39T or 38T small chainring for awhile.

But the original Araya rims are going back on the Ironman. I already miss the index shifting. Now I'll need to redo the rear derailleur but it shouldn't be difficult.

Ironman with wheelset borrowed from Univega hybrid.

***


Yup, it handled the 11-32 8-speed cassette... just barely. Probably helped that I'd switched to a 50/39 chainring.

***


Quite a stretch. Suntour GPX RD just barely handles the 28T rear cog with the chain in the 50T chainring. No way it would handle the 32 cog without damage. B-screw was fully seated to reduce pulley drag in the 39T front/32T rear cog combo.

***


Crosschaining isn't pretty.
If you look closely where the spokes cross you can see some residue from the red scented candle wax I used to stop the creaking noises coming from friction between the black coated spokes.

***


Alexrims S500 wheelset off my Univega hybrid. The 622x14 rims are sorta roadie oriented. I may get a 622x19 wheelset for the hybrid to take larger, softer tires.