SClaraPokeman

I doubt any attorney--bike oriented or not--would be interested in taking a case with so little potential for payoff. Even if you were injured, (and bicycle replacement costs weighed against virtually any medical costs is chicken feed) your injuries would have to go beyond the realm of the trivial for it to be "worth it" to a lawyer.

Any one year old bicycle I own will be worth far more to me than any buyer in a "arms length" transaction. For instance, I wouldn't sell my five year old Cervelo for blue book + 50% even if offered that because I expect the bike to be fully functional for several more years (unless damaged in an accident of course). In my mind a bicycle depreciates very slowly under normal usage.

While I wouldn't expect any insurance company to replace a 15 year old Accord with a brand new one, a bicycle accident not involving an injury is a different kettle of fish. It's a trivial amount of money not matter how you look at it. Basically, the insurance company position is petty, absurd and infuriating. This is what gives them a bad name.

Roughstuff

Is there a Kelly Blue Book for bicycles?

travbikeman

Insurance has given us money to replace my Son's stolen bike. Their depreciated value of his 1.5 year old bike, was less $50 from the original value.

So $700, minus my deductible of $250 and minus the depreciated value of $50.

I find it strange the insurance is saying your more expensive bike loses that much value. In my opinion they are ripping you off, BUT, that is a U.S. opinion. Not sure how Canada does things.

CB HI

No. As others have noted, you need to go onto craigslist and e-bay to compare what similar year, model and condition bicycles are selling for, to establish current value.

agenkin

I ended up filing a Small Claims Court claim. I got a free 30-minute consult with a lawyer, who helped me write the claim.

An interesting takeaway from the conversation with the lawyer is that, once a court claim is filed, this is no longer an insurance claim. It is now a court claim under the Law of Negligence, so the insurance policies no longer apply. Especially since there was no contract between me and the driver's insurance company.

The lawyer's advice was to keep insurance terms out of the claim and to not even discuss the replacement value vs. cash value disagreement in the court claim. Keep the arguments about that for later, in case the defendant's side tries to argue that. The lawyer advised to keep the claim as short as possible, and to not try to foresee and counter any arguments with which the insurance company is likely to come back.

Overall, filing a court claim was quite easy, but did take some time to prepare.

Altair 4

So in Ontario, is your claim against the insurance carrier or the driver? How does the other party get served?

baron von trail 

I had one lowball me on a case where their driver totaled my car in a rear end collision. So, I sued them for "replacement value" and threw in some added pain and suffering. I ended up with punitive damages that were about three times higher than what I was asking for in the first place.

Sometimes, you gotta fight...and, be sure to fight smart.

agenkin

You sue the driver. There is no contract between me and the driver's insurance company, so there are no grounds to sue them It was the driver's negligence that caused the collision, so I sued the driver. From what I understand, the insurance company has an obligation to represent the driver as part of liability coverage, so, as far as I understand, it will be the insurance company's lawyers representing the driver in court.

There is an online FAQ on serving the documents, more like a tractatus. The bottom line is that it is possible to send by registered mail and then print out the delivery confirmation page that shows the recipient's signature. If the recipient decides to dodge service of the documents, there are some elaborate methods to still serve them.

agenkin

I hear that Canadian court system is different from American in that here the judges are very unwilling to award punitive damages. That said, I am asking for some things on top of the replacement value.

gregf83 

It will be interesting to see if you actually get to a hearing. I filed a small claim against a building contractor a few years back and we ended up settling in the pre-trial/discovery meeting.

jefnvk

Just a general thought, not aimed at anyone specific: considering you have an emotional attachment to your bike, and are likely to overvalue it (especially when asking for compensation), wouldn't a better way of determining a fair value be how much you would pay for that same bike from someone else? Would you buy a bike that was a year old and ridden daily for only a 10% discount off this years model, brand new, sitting next to it? Also, just because one particular claim may seem to be trivial to you, when dealing with thousands of claims a day, trivial things add up in a hurry, and are not likely to just be given out. Especially so, to someone who is not a customer that they are trying to retain.

Anyways, interested to hear how this turns out!

FullGas

here's an update on my property damage claim.

took the bike to a high-end shop and got a repair estimate. submitted the estimate and photos of damage.

the adjuster kept asking questions about the age of the bike as an apparent prelude to the 'depreciation' discussion. I attempted to explain that the frame/fork were from the late '90s but I wasn't seeking any money for them as they were not damaged. the damaged components were purchased from 2012-2014.

before we had a conversation regarding a settlement, I hired an atty.

a week later, the adjuster contacted me and said they would be issuing a check in the amount of the repair estimate. also notable was there was no demand to surrender damaged parts.

now, this is very interesting because the shop spec'd out all new 11-spd DA stuff at current full retail, but I had purchased mostly used 10-spd pieces for the re-build and had provided receipts for all expenses (which were considerably less than the repair estimate).

not sure what their line of reasoning for the settlement was, but not complaining.

my atty's advice was to wait 48 hrs to see if they claimed an error in the settlement offer and then cash the check. followed that plan and have heard nothing since.

CB HI

You had an atty. Giving you the shop estimate was the least risky method to close the case quickly. They did not want to give your atty time to come up with more cost.

PS You should have rented a bicycle and charged them for that as well. It is always nice to test out a different bicycle on their dollar and you should not have to do without while they piddle around.

FullGas

the adjuster and I had a really poor rapport, mostly because he was a ******nozzle, but partly because he knew nothing about bicycles and I quickly tired of answering his questions. didn't feel it was my job to educate him.

I could have easily claimed a bunch of small stuff (there was a micro tear on my jersey, etc), but the atty advised against blatantly padding the bill because the money for the medical claim will more than cover the cheaper property items. and I had a back-up bike to ride, so didn't need to rent one and I'm def not in the market for a third bike.

maybe I'm a sap, but I'm really not trying to gouge the ins company. I wanted to get my bike back to the same standard as prior to the crash, have medical costs covered, and pocket some money for the inconvenience and pain the driver caused.

so far, things are working out in my favor. will report back after the med claim is settled.

KD5NRH

Then A&S is full of people who would have been useful intermediaries for you.

Yan 

When I was hit by a car the driver's insurance company paid the full replacement cost of the bike, no depreciation. The bike was a custom. All I had to do was take the parts list to a bike shop, which verified the stated values and signed off on my claim. The insurance clerk wasn't happy when he saw the total, but didn't say much. They did take the wrecked bike. Why I don't know.

Not USA, so may not apply to the OP's situation.

mconlonx

10sp DA is obsolete and the 11sp group the shop quoted is currently available replacement equipment of similar quality.

I work in a shop and absolutely love working up damage estimates for bikes involved in bike/car collisions...

cjs9

Would love to chat with either FullGas or agenkin (not sure how to tag people) as I'm also in Toronto and dealing with a similar issue. I expect to receive a settlement offer today and I expect to hate it as they're spending a lot of time talking about depreciation. I'll try to DM and see if that works and if not, maybe shoot me a text using Toronto's OG area code and 888-1942? Would be appreciated

Milton Keynes

You do realize that this is a 5 year old thread, right?

tomato coupe

Why are newbies are always reviving zombie threads?

Daniel4

Because if they start a new one, someone will reply with a link to an old discussion

tomato coupe

Nope. The newbie wants to "chat" with two previous posters that haven't been active for years.

rydabent

How much can they take off of the value when you consider a good bike will last 50 years at least.

Gresp15C

If it's anything like the US, almost everything about insurance is set by regulation. This would probably include the depreciation period used for settlements.

Daniel4

My forty-two year old bike is probably worth $10 on the market. To me, it's not the material value that matters. It's the utilitarian value. If I were compensated with $10, it'd be too much effort looking for a replacement at that same price.