jimmuller 

I'm not familiar with the GS's original rims but I have some experience with the Weinmann Concave rim. In a prior life I had bought a pair of Bike Warehouse specials for my UO-8, those wheels I'm riding now, Fiamme rims, Shimano 600 hubs. When the rear broke a spoke I had a wheel built up with a Weinmann Concave. It was a bit heavy but I was commuting between Watertown and Cambridge and figured the extra strength was worth it. Within a month it bent itself into a pretzel. Which is why it wears a Mavic now and I have a spare Fiamme rim hanging on the wall.

noglider 

My experience with the concave rim was that it was very strong but also nearly as heavy as a steel rim. It was both heavier and stronger than the original rim on the Gran Sport.

Notice I have a lot of experience with and knowledge of crashes.

jimmuller 

A final note. One of my band members was a bike mechanic and used to ride a Gran Sport. His was a '74, and one difference between '73 and '74 was the ST decal was longer on the '74. So much trivia...

systemBuilder

Gransport was one of 2 bikes I lusted after, as a kid, in 1972.

The only models you cannot tell apart are the 1973/4 white/blue models. Weirdly, sometime in 1975 or 1976 or 1977 they came with top-tube badging saying "Grand Sports" instead of "Gran Sport". The reynolds decals in 1973/4 said, "Butted Tubes", with a separate forks decal (no gold band). The 1973/4 bikes weigh 100 grams more than a 531-throughout bicycle in the same size. In 1975 they started using a gold band that said, "Reynolds Tube Co. Inc.", in 1976 it became a registered trademark "Reynolds Tube Co. Inc. (R)", and in 1977 It became (TI) Reynolds Limited as TI swallowed up Raleigh & Reynolds together.

Even without any paint, they changed the rear brake-cable stop from a 1-piece item to 2-pieces (like the front) in late 1974 so you can tell the difference. The seat cluster is stamped '73' but that's just the angle of the Bocama lug set, it says that on every bike.

https://www.bulgier.net/pics/bike/Cat...8GranSport.jpg

1972 - 531 butted tubes, forks, stays. zeus dropouts. white/blue. script 'Raleigh' lettering
1973 - 531 butted tubes, forks. stamped dropouts w/sn. white/blue. block 'RALEIGH' lettering.
1974 - 531 butted tubes, forks. stamped dropouts w/sn. white/blue + blue/white. block 'RALEIGH' lettering
1975 - 531 throughout, stamped dropouts w/sn. white/blue + blue/white. block 'RALEIGH'
1976 - 531 throughout, stamped dropouts w/sn. white/blue + blue/white. block 'RALEIGH'
1977 - 531 throughout, stamped dropouts w/sn. white/blue + blue/white. block 'RALEIGH', Suntour Vx-GT gears

The bike was very similar to a Peugeot PX-10, so it is NOT a mix of high-end and low-end parts. It's mostly high-end parts, but with a touring focus.

Normandy competition (red-label) hubs
Stronglight 93 crankset
Simplex maxi (mid-level) gears
Weinmann 219 rims (27")
Weinmann alloy QR brake set with high-end drilled levers
Brook B-17 saddle
Atom 440 pedals (the main cheap-out; it should have been atom 600 or atom 700).
GB stem and GB randonneur handlebars.

jimmuller 

Thanks for the additional info. Of course, this thread (which I started) has been dormant since 2010. And I do still ride my Raleigh.

USAZorro

Two observations, one question.

I have a Grand Sports that has no apparent serial number on either the bottom bracket, or dropouts or anywhere else (with the possible exception of the steerer, which I have not pulled to check).

Observation 1: The dropouts are forged, as I would expect on a Carlton (Worksop Built) frame.
Observation 2: Every other bicycle that I have that was made in Worksop from 1970 on has the serial number on the bottom bracket, with the exception of a Raleigh Super Course that was built prior to 1973.

Question: Which decal should I be looking at to determine the differences between 1975-6-7 models?

Thanks,

Z

noglider 

FWIW, Super Courses (which are Carlton made) had stamped dropouts. Many Gran Sports had them, too, including the one I had.

USAZorro

I have a '71 Super Course, and a '71 Competition that both have stamped dropouts. There's no Carlton decal on the Competition, and wasn't one on the Super Course (it was rather beat when I got it, so possibly it was there once), so I'm a bit skeptical that "all the 531 framed Raleighs in the 70's" were built in Worksop. I suspect those two were built in Nottingham.

jimmuller 

Some years ago I stopped trying to condense the available Raleigh info in a concise description. However FWIW, my GS says Gran Sport, has stamped dropouts, a serial number on one of the dropouts, does (or did, though much is now worn off) have a Carlton decal, and has Reynolds stickers which do not say fully DB tubes fork, and stays. Actually, I don't recall what they say. The fork does have a Reynolds sticker but I don't remember its details either. I just ride it. I believe it is a '73.

dweenk

I got my Gran Sport as a frame and tweaked fork with headset and bottom bracket. It should be a '72 since it has Zeus forged dropouts. It had been badly repainted with good paint. All decals were gone of course, and someone placed a Reynolds decal at the base of the seat tube. My LBS was able to true the fork; so I built it up with new wheels, Suntour derailleurs, and Sugino cranks. The brakes are Weinmann center-pulls, the stem SR, and Belleri rando bars.

I've been thinking about a repaint and new decals for a while, but can't seem to get excited about that expense since it is at the small end of what fits me.

systemBuilder

The last year they used forged dropouts was 1972. They used both Zeus & Campagnolo dropouts on the Gran Sport / Competition model (same bike just tubs v.s. clinchers in 1972). Starting in 1973 and onwards, they used stamped dropouts (no raised lip around the slot for the rear axle on either side - just a flat piece of sheet metal, cut-out). So your bike is likely 1972 or earlier.

If your bike has reynolds decals on the frame or forks, you can possibly determine a year. The ones with gold bands at the top (forks) or bottom (seat tube) with "Reynolds ..." are 1976 or 1977. They must have had a surplus of all-black seat decals because my >= 1974 blue and white gran sport doesn't have the gold band "Reynolds Seat Tube In. Birmingham England" square decal nor forks decals which appeared in 1974, as on my international(s).

bikemig 

I have one with Zeus drop outs but a chrome rear triangle. I thought it was a '73 or later based on the catalogs as the '72 catalog shows the bike with a painted rear triangle.

USAZorro

I was going from memory when I posted this, as it was up at my stepdaughter's at the time. It actually has stamped dropouts. Also the decals show "Grand Sports", if that helps to date it.

I am a bit confused by 1973 and 1974 catalog pictures which appear to show this model with dropouts that have derailleur hangers (= forged).

rustystrings61 

That's because the Gran Sport in the '72 catalog wasn't really a Gran Sport. They used a photo of one of the 1971 variants of the Competition, which had two color schemes that never made it to the catalogs as Competitions - the lilac and purple and the lagoon blue and white. While the blue and white Competitions mostly had Bocama Professional lugs, I had one with Nervex Professionals and Zeus forged dropouts. The '71 catalog "Gran Sport" photo shows what appears to be the Zeus crankset seen on the 1970 Gran Sport and the 1969 Competition. The GS and the Competition alternated for a while there. The catalogs show the Competition in '69; the Gran Sport in '70; NEITHER depicted in '71; a Competition with clincher wheels depicted as a GS in '72; then both shown 1973-76.

mkeller234

All this talk about Gran Sports inspired me to grab mine for the commute today. Just as smooth as I remembered. Not a super fast ride though.

steelbikeguy

Forum member Bernie, aka 76SLT, has one of those Competitions in Gran Sport colors.





It's almost as if Raleigh was intentionally messing with us future Raleigh fans.

Steve in Peoria (was a fan back then too)