Kapusta

All you ever wanted to know:

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/chain-wear.html

MaxDB

Interesting read, thanks

elcyc

Still goin' on that set-up: June 2017-replaced KMC chain and Shimano 7-spd cassette, now with about 10,300 total miles!!! . Tho', as i noted, I did replace the 31T middle crank chainring back in Jun 2020; also replaced the pulley cogs, which were frankly okay even then. Surprisingly, it's that June 2020 31T crank chainring that is now skipping bad enough that I have to use the crank's inner or outer chainring.
I do have two band new sets of KMC chains, new chainrings and a new cassette and new pulley cogs ... and many other band new / OEM (or better) replacement components in my garage.
Too lazy to get to it ...

TPL

ShimaNO hyperglide tooth profile cogs, even when brand new, begin their life in a somewhat compromised condition

Persistant use of hyperglide cogs will allow the users to become quite familiar with the ritual of reaching for their billfolds

PeteHski

Worn chain and cassette pairs can actually run together for a very long time. Only problem is that eventually the chainring also wears enough to start slipping, as you have just discovered. It won't be long before your inner and outer chainrings suffer the same fate as they are being driven by a very worn chain.

elcyc

So suggest some options… cost is not important… links would help😉

ofajen

Thanks for a good reminder. I checked my rear cog and saw a bit of hook shape so I bought a new one…. by taking it off and flipping it over.

Otto

sweeks

My 9-speed Ultegra cassette has about 8,000 miles on it and shows no sign of excessive wear. The chain is changed at 1% elongation. The whole drivetrain (3 x 9) has been entirely trouble-free... no additional expenses incurred.
(I get that you don't like Shimano.)

elcyc

Let others answer that more concretely ... e.g., SRAM is better for similar-price products, etc.
Also, you could get more "scientific" ... say you cryo'd your Shimano parts after deliver from Amazon. Would they last longer / perform better?

tomato coupe

Won't that make you go backwards?

ofajen

Sadly, no. The freehub ratchets the same way no matter which way I install the cog. 😊

Have you ever seen one of those bikes that has two gear ratios, a lower one pedaling forward and a higher one pedaling backwards? Very cool!

Called retro-direct.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retro-direct

Apparently the older versions used reverse for the lower climbing gear but more modern ones use forward for the climbing gear.

Otto

sweeks

That was meant to be a little jest, I think.

That is interesting. There have been many ingenious but strange bicycle drivetrains over the years.

tomato coupe

Thanks, interesting link.

frogman

Been away for a few days, did he get a new cassette yet ?

tkamd73 

Agreed, but fortunately in my case I can afford the 20 bucks every couple of years, the shifting performance is well worth it.
Tim

prj71

Wow. No kidding. How obtuse can a person be?!

livedarklions

Surprised this thread got bumped, but will remind everyone that pretty much everyone decided this guy wasn't sincerely looking for advice at around post 50.

Please don't feed the troll.

elcyc

Ja … sehr interesting psychoanalysis du hast goin’ on, Herr Freud. So das ist warum so viele responses after 50, including deine.

Michellemayer

evento de salto inicia quando a corrente em movimento tenta engatar os dentes desgastados. Sob condições em que a corrente e a roda dentada não estão em movimento, a corrente está suficientemente engatada em vários dentes para evitar a possibilidade de escorregamento.

timtak

I almost always get chain slip when I use a new chain on an old cassette. I am still not sure why. There are so many threads about this I chose this one because it is pretty long and pretty new, and because I agree with the OPs reticence to purchase a new cassette.

One factor in new chain slip is no doubt due to the wear on the cassette. This time I can be even more sure of this because I had just changed my first three cogs to new ones, whereas the next few are a bit worn (though not all that worn, nowhere near as worn as the first three were) and the new chain does not slip on the first three cogs only on the middle ones.

And bike shops with those experienced mechanics often recommend changing cassettes with chains. But cassettes are not all that cheap so I don't want to change my cassette that often especially since my change of the three most worn cogs was so successful (with my old worn chain there was no slip at all).

Plus, almost as if new chains have been designed to increase cassette sales, and this is the important point, the chain slip generally goes away after about a week or less. It is a stressful week but new chain slip does generally go away in my experience.

I have suspected in the past that the sticky grease that comes with new chains may be part of the reason for new chain slip. I have just cleaned the grease off and lubed with a thin PTFE containing oil and the chain is slipping less.

I think I will order the next four cogs (the top 4 I hardly use and they don't slip) just in case. Total cost of 7 cogs about 20 USD.
I just purchased 14, 15, 16, 17 (11s) here. This shipping is combined to a lesser value (370 for four cogs) at the penultimate step prior to payment.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000688979810.html

koala logs

The highest gears did look incredibly worn. Fits exactly the symptoms of the problem you're having - skipping at the highest gears.

I assumed, you used the chain for too long. Quite many new riders make the same mistake. They didn't replace the chain soon enough because it still looks new and shiny. The only right way to know a chain needs replacing is measuring the stretch (check out youtube for measuring chain stretch).

If you waited long enough to replace the chain, you'll likely have to replace the cassette as well because new chain on worn cassette won't go well together and it will skip. Exactly like the problem you're having.

koala logs

You have to watch out for and measure chain stretch with a chain measuring tool or ruler. Measuring chain stretch of your bike periodically, every 300 miles or so far more important than deciding what lube to use on the chain.

Replace chain if it goes beyond tolerance - if you do this, you won't experience chain skipping with new chain at all. Why experienced mechanics often replace cassette with new chain is many riders are not aware of the fact, they need to replace the chain more often and not aware they need to measure stretch. So they use the chain too long and wears out the cassette too.

A chain that is stretched beyond tolerable limit will accelerate wear on both the cassette and chain and a worn cassette will skip with new chain. A new chain may stop skipping on a worn cassette after a while because as the chain wears down, it starts fitting the worn cassette better but the problem remains and the wear rate will only get worse.

timtak

> the wear rate will only get worse.

I am concerned only about chain skip/ drop not wear per se. For example, I would like to be able to purchase one week worn chains.

I wonder if I were to replace my chains at before 1% wear (as measured by my wear tool or a 12 inch ruler), and replace cassettes if new chains skip (or other metric -- is there a cassette wear indicator tool?), would I get more or less skip/drop free miles per dollar spent on chain and cassette, compared to
1) Using more than 1% worn chains
2) Using worn cassettes

koala logs

If you replace chain before excess stretch, you'll be prolonging the useful life of not only the cassette but also your chain rings. The last time I made the mistake of allowing the chain to stretch beyond the excess amount, I had to replace both cassette and the big ring as well.

Worn chain + worn cassette would still undergo accelerated wear no matter how well you clean and lube it. The only way to know a cassette or chain ring is still good - it doesn't skip on a new chain, the cog teeth is not pointed, the blunt tip must be at least 2mm across (anyone pls correct me if I'm wrong here), and finally, shifts well on new chain.

ClydeClydeson

Skipping new chain on old cassette is obviously defective chain. In my experience, you need to buy chains in lots of 15-20 to find one that will not skip. If no good ones show up after 20 attempts then assume the brand you are buying is a different pitch than what you need, so buy 15-20 of a different brand, repeat until success. All the leftover chains should be spliced together to make greasy wind chimes.