Caretaker

That's just for legal purposes, licencing etc. it's treated the same as a bicycle.

For definitions I use a dictionary:

I've no problem with 'bikes' or variations of it as the word is somewhat ambiguous.

If people want to tour on Ebikes or go 'E-bike touring' then fine, I'll just keep on (bi)cycle touring.

indyfabz

alan s 

It keeps coming back from the dead. Shills for the leg-assisted motor bike industry.

Happy Feet

Man, where do you come up with this stuff...

And why are you posting in this thread? You have nothing to contribute and are only here to insult members who want to discuss a subject. Like I said before, I hope the mods just lock out one or two bad apples who's only purpose seems to be to derail a valid discussion, rather than lock the thread.

alan s 

Same reason as anyone else, incl. you. Someone posted a topic for discussion.

350htrr

An Excellent description on what is happening in both type of assistance systems... Thank you

What I AM TRYING TO GET PEOPLE TO UNDERTAND is its not all or nothing, it's not all motor, it's is sometimes just me pedaling to get the range one need per day and the battery won't provide, or like you said 50/50 or 10/90, or 90/10 or 25/75, or 75/25...

mstateglfr 

Man, yet again this forum strikes entertainment gold!

I ride a bicycle. It has 2 wheels(bi) and the wheels and crank arm spin in a circle over and again(cycle). I can tour on it.

I dont care if someone rides on the following as its all touring to me-
- trike
- recumbent bicycle
- recumbet tricycle
- e-assist bicycle
- e-assist tricycle
- other things I am forgetting.


- I find it hilarious that the term 'motorcycle' is continually used when the subject of e-assist bikes is discussed. They are so clearly not motorcycles. The term motorcycle has become synonymous with the 2(or 3) wheeled engine vehicles made by Honda, Harley, etc. To use that term when discussing an e-assist bike is just funny due to how clearly biased it is meant to be.

- There is a clear difference between 'e-assist' and 'e-bike'. They may both use a motor, but one is used as a bailout power help and the other is used as a primary power source. Yet for some reason, they are continually used synonymous around here.




- I dont give a rip if someone tours on an e-assist, single speed, recumbent, or traditional 2diamond bike. I dont care if someone rides ultralight, heavy, bikepacks, carts 4panniers, or credit card tours.

Theres more than 1 way to skin a cat and theres more than 1 way to tour. All are legitimate.

Do you 'hub and spoke' tour by driving somewhere then riding all around doing day rides from there? Congrats, you toured.
Do you fly on a plane to a starting point and ride home? Congrats, you toured.
Do you leave your house and ride in a big loop? Congrats, you toured.
Do you ride an e-assist and camp every night? Congrats, you toured.
Do you ride a 2diamond frame and cross the country with a sag vehicle while taking in the sights and scenery of national parks and tourist traps along the way? Congrats, you toured.
Do you bring camping gear, a credit card for hotels, and an app to find homes to crash at? Congrats, you toured.



Definition of TOUR
make a tour of (an area).
"he decided to tour France"
synonyms: travel around, explore, discover, vacation in, visit

It shouldnt matter if you camp while touring, or if you stay in hotels. That qualifier doesnt exist in the definition. <----this is a comment in response to a post earlier in the thread.




This forum makes the time pass so quickly at work!

jefnvk

Caretaker

If you travel around France in a chauffeur driven limo you also 'toured' so are congrats called for?

350htrr

Well said @mstateglfr I wish I was 1/2 as articulate...

alan s 

To me, the question is where do you draw the line between bike touring and non-bike touring. In my view, when you add a motor to a bike, it is no longer a bike and you are no longer bike touring. Just because there are two wheels and pedals, the line has been crossed into another activity. Hey, I could strap a bicycle to the back of my 60' long RV and call it bike touring, but is it really? Is that what we are talking about here? If so, then any activity that involves a bike could be considered bike touring, regardless of how the bike is propelled.

Caretaker

I agree, that's where you draw the line not at some random level of wattage or whether it requires some pedalling to work.

350htrr

I agree that one cannot/should not just say that one did a bike tour if one did it on an E-Assist bike, one needs to say they did a tour on an E-Assist bicycle... It is very simple. But to be looked down upon in a touring forum by ridiculers, is... sad...

indyfabz

What's most entertaining is watching people go back and forth over the same old ground. This thread rival any good disk brake argument in the 41.


Seabiscuit has, in fact, risen.


I hear that Pokémon Go is a good time, but please don't start a thread about whether playing on an e-bike is cheating or not.

mstateglfr 

Of course you toured, so if you want some congrats, then sure they are in order. There are dozens of cars with a model trim level called 'touring'. Its from a historical perspective of how that model would be perceived vs others that were 'sport' or other terms.

You didnt bike tour, but you toured. You car toured.
And before the comment immediately above this sentence is broken down and used to somehow disprove what I posted earlier, I dont care if someone car tours using a car, minivan, truck, or conversion van. That all can fall under the general term 'car tour'.

In similar fashion- supported touring, self contained touring, bikepacking, credit card touring, etc can all fall under the general term 'bike touring'. And in additional similar fashion- riding a diamond frame, recumbent, trike, etc can also all fall under the general term 'bike', even if a trike has 3 and not 2 wheels. It would be absurd to demand someone call it 'trike touring' as there isnt any benefit to further clarify.

Robert C

I use the term e-bike because I see it as being just as good as the other, and more descriptive on a glance. Neither 'e-assist' or 'e-bike' are words with any special legal standing.

A point that I consider to be in favor of e-bike, and why I prefer it over e-assist, is that e-bike makes it clear that I am talking about a bike e-assist is much more generic. As I use it, e-bike is in reference to an e-assist bicycle. As staed, neither has any special meaning, beyond that given by its use, and I happen to prefer the one. Yes, I do see how they can be used somewhat synonymously here.

I do feel that an e-assist bicycle, A.K.A. an e-bike, can make cycling more approachable to many. It can also allow people to share cycling. A few days ago I noticed a couple that I know from elsewhere. In the past he rode without his wife in the evenings because she was not able to ride at the pace he wanted his evening workout to be at.

Since then they got an assist motor for her bike and now she can ride with him. She is still pushing pretty hard; but she is with him. I realize that the Bike Forum consensus is that he should just ride without her; but Bike Forums is not the place I would look for good relationship advice.

Frankley, converting her bike to an e-bike made cycling together an activity that they can enjoy together. I consider that a win. Back to the thread topic, this (riding together) is something that an e-bike added to their cycling activity.

350htrr

Even in the USA there is a difference as to where E-Assist bikes (means no throttle) can be used, and where E-Bikes usually with a throttle can be used as I understand it. So legally there is a separation. In Europe most/all E-Bikes are E-Assist bikes, even when one says E-Bikes it's a given that there will be no throttle...

jefnvk

Don't worry, that thread is also already degenerating into how you can't enjoy the outdoors if you have electronics

prj71

I'd hate to ride this on a windy day. Be like a kite with 2 wheels.

350htrr

Yea, I would go with a folding solar panel myself... But that E-Bicycle sure does look like a touring bicycle to me. Unlike all the ones pictured by the no E-Bikes allowed here people...

alan s 

My next bike tour will be on the PCH from SF to SD. This is how I plan to ride. It's called an RV-assist bike.

seeker333

I may possibly be conducting future tours from an e-Tesla3-bike, which offers leg assisted pedaling, brain-eyes-arms assisted self-driving (so I can play Minecraft while I'm touring), air conditioning, sun protection, GPS navigation, handlebar mounted radio, mp3 player and cell phone, headlights and taillights for safe night touring, a rack-and-pannier-like innovation called a "trunk", and can be used for stealth camping at the local Walmart parking lot without the burden of carrying tent, sleeping bag and sleeping pad. I won't be carrying cook gear, as the Walmart has an economical fully equipped kitchen area called "McDonalds".

indyfabz

Take lots of pictures, but if you can't, find some on the Internet and pass them off as your own like YKW.

Doug64

I suspect in the EU, the intent of the rules concerning e-bikes is not to label an e- bike as a bicycle or motor bike. I believe the intent is to allow motorized bikes meeting certain criteria to use infrastructure designated for bicycles/non- motorized use. It is a use classification not an equipment classification.

I have ridden a lot in Europe and have seen hundreds of people on e- bikes.

350htrr

Exactly, Good point,

EDIT; Sometimes people are just a little bit tooo literal... Just because a low powered E-Bike is ALLOWED on bicycle trails does NOT mean they are Bicycles...