genejockey 

It wasn't till 1999 that somebody won the TdF on Dura Ace - of course, the record books say "No Winner" - so I'd say in 1984 DA was still an upstart. But they were pushing hard while Campagnolo was resting on its laurels.

79pmooney

None that I've seen. Haven't owned a DT index shifter but I ran the SunTour Commands on the bars for years. Operation is just like a friction shifter except you have the indents to locate each gear center. You can reach down or look at any time and feel/see what gear you are in.

phughes

I guess just because you don't like them, you have relagated them to the dustbin of your mind. Sorry, but triples are alive and well, and used on touring bikes to this day.

genejockey 

The 7100 stuff is just okay. I think Shimano hadn't decided yet to go for the brass ring. But starting with 7200, they got serious. One of my favorite bikes is a 1982 Lotus Supreme with 7200. Previous owners had replaced the non-aero levers with Dia Compe aero levers, and the RD was a Sun Tour. And that cool, funky 7200 headset that needs special wrenches was replaced with a Campy. It's actually not that expensive to buy 7200 parts on Ebay, so it's not been too bad. There are even people still making the adapters you need to run regular pedals with the 7200 "Dyna Drive" cranks. AND making the special wrenches for the headset.

Leinster

Indexed/brifter/trigger shifting for the rear is great.

I’d happily go back to friction front shifting.

Garthr

I friction shift because I know how to and that's about that. I tried some indexing back in 1990 when I was working in a bike shop and assembled new bikes. During the rest ride of course I had to test the shifting. It was okay, nothing earth shattering and it certainly didn't move me to want to go out and buy some. I thought indexing was unnecessary as I already knew how to shift, and had no desire to relegate that skill to a third party, let alone limit myself to linear sequential one-click-at-a-time moving of the chain. It seemed like a step backwards. With friction you can swiftly move the chain over the cogs from big to small and vice versa with one swift motion. I like that.

Now with the brifters and front indexing and all that, I say to each their own. If you wanna tell me friction is "out of date, antiquated, slow or limiting", well hah hah, the only thing "out of date, antiquated, slow or limiting", is just that... that anything is "out of date, antiquated, slow or limiting".

One form of shifting isn't in opposition to any other, they're each valid in their own way.

staehpj1

Brifters are nice, but you know what? I get on my old 1990 vintage 105 down tube shifter equipt Cannondale and the indexed shifting is a joy to use. I never really minded down tube shifters and the friction shifting on that bike which has seen more miles than I care to estimate has been flawless. I don't see a need for friction other than maybe as a backup just in case for RD shifting. I used friction shifting until really nice indexed shifting was available and it was okay, but when indexed was perfected I didn't see a reason to not use it.

On the front I don't mind friction and indexing seems almost pointless.

BTW, I never found any joy with bar end shifters of any type.

JohnDThompson 

Dura-Ace was just a centerpull brake caliper in 1973, and not a particularly high-end piece:

It wasn't until several years later that Shimano decided to use the Dura-Ace moniker for a high-end racing component group. The Dura-Ace centerpull caliper got renamed to Tourney, the Crane derailleurs were renamed to Dura-Ace, and a sidepull caliper, crankset, hubs, etc. completed the group.

Shimano introduced its SIS indexed shifting system with a huge advertising campaign, and convinced OEMs to adopt SIS by insisting that they had to spec the whole group in order to get SIS. This dried up demand for other components of all types; the French component industry was decimated, and even Campanolo was on the ropes for several years. SIS was an impressive technical achievement, but the marketing achievement was even more impressive.

Xavier65

Friction shifters are much more tolerant of abuse, neglect, mud, and adverse conditions (<5C) than indexed. That's why I would never think of removing my heavy duty friction thumbshifters from my mountain bike.

Indexed gears are delightful on a road bike/tourer - IF well maintained, and it's good weather.

Xavier65

I've had a triple on my tourer for over 30 years, 52/42/20 -> 11:36 - and that has suited me down to the ground. It has a wider range than you mention above, i.e. from 52:11 down to 20:36.

I also have a triple on my mountain bike, but I forget the gearing. It's probably an even wider ratio.

If I had to have a derailleur on a new bike, then it'd be a triple.

staehpj1

Meh, the Deore XT thumb shifters on my 1990 MTB have been rock solid for muddy riding in the mid atlantic region with lots of muddy races in the Md and PA mountains and West Virginia. I was always an all weather and all season rider and they were trouble free. Worst case there was the option of switching to friction mode, but I don't recall ever needing to. They saw plenty of mud, rain, snow, and sub freezing temps.

I don't ride that bike too often these days, but it still shifts fine when I do. Those vintage XT thumb shifters are good stuff other than being a bit hard on my arthritic thumbs. I'd guess the bar ends of a similar vintage would be similar in reliability, but I hate bar ends so I wouldn't know.

Atlas Shrugged

Just out of curiosity what derailleur had a 57 tooth capacity? It’s a limiting factor in most cases.

Xavier65

Hmmm. With that commendation, maybe I'll check 'em out as a possible upgrade...

Xavier65

I may have increased the cassette large cog from 34 to 36 a while ago, but front is Shimano FC2303 (small ring swapped with 20T), and back is Shimano Tourney TY300.

It may well be used outside of spec, but the chain is very tight on 52/36 (which I don't use), and fine on 52/11 and 42/11 (no jumping).

Atlas Shrugged

Awesome, it’s always amazing how conservative Shimano is. Most of my drivetrains are pushed and surprising how well they work.

smd4

I believe most of this is incorrect. Yes, they used the Crane rear derailleur, but if you look at images of the 1973 Dura Ace catalog, except for the RD, everything else is in fact "Dura Ace" branded.

1973 Catalog

JohnDThompson 

I concede you're correct as far as the date. Now that I think about it, my freshman roommate in college in 1973 had a Fuji "Finest" on which he replaced the stock Dia-Compe centerpulls with black Dura-Ace sidepulls, so they must have been available by 1973. But before the full group came out, the centerpull caliper was the sole Dura-Ace branded component, and it was not aimed at high-end racing bikes. Once the Dura-Ace group came on the market, the centerpull caliper was renamed "Tourney" and continued to be marketed at entry and mid-level bikes.

smd4

So maybe the name itself predates 1973, and when Shimano decided to chase the racers with a DA group, they realized they better not have the name associated with a poor-quality center pull?

rsbob 

I have:
Friction shifters
Indexed friction shifters
Campy Ergo shifters
Ultegra brifters.

When I switch to my earlier bikes with down tubes shifters, I don’t like is not being able to shift gears while climbing out of the saddle as well as not being able to down-shift while braking to a stop. That’s probably why my early bikes are relegated to rain bikes since my speed is much lower.

Fredo76

For me, I think location matters more than the type of mechanism. After riding both my old racing bike and my bro's Clem Smith Jr. around the truly wild and crazy Cactus Loop Drive at Saguaro NP East, Clem's Shimano Mega-9 indexed bar shifters beat the stem shifters on Fredo by a considerable margin. In my youth we would power up the short, steep rolling hills without downshifting but that option is not available to me in my old age golden years. Bar cons may be coming on Fredo, and my new drop-bar mixte build has MicroNew brifters (gasp).

"Everything's up to date in Kansas City,
They've gone about as far as they can go!"

Germany_chris

I think we're probably going to see more of the friction shifting content since "Path Less Pedaled" is on a friction shift kick right now.

Calsun

Friction shift levers mounted on the downtube were never an efficient way to change gears. I would often go one cog past the one I wanted and then need to make the change a second time. No such problems with indexed shifters if set up properly.

SurferRosa

So "never" in some 40 years of professional cycling?

Or on my ride yesterday?

PeteHski

They are still obsolete, just like steam engines. A nostalgic throwback to a past era with no relevance to anyone beginning their cycling journey in 2023 unless they specifically want a C&V bike pre mid 80s. Or perhaps someone bodging up a Frankendrivetrain of incompatible parts.

smd4

But both are absolutely a blast to operate!