Cycle Tourist

Here's a subject that is totally insignificant but, none the less, interesting to me. What kind of upgrades would you like to see on a bike you were thinking of keeping? I realize it depends on the type of bike and it's original intention and also your experiences. So here's an example:
​​​​​​ Below you'll see a Miyata 610. It's not what your thinking though. This one was made in '81. That means: a crank with a bolt pattern that allows the granny to be no smaller than 36 teeth, center pull brakes, (the last year they used them on this model), stem shifters, turkey arm on the brake levers and no braze-ons except a bottle carrier. On the plus the paint is exceptional and the bike was safely ensconced in a thick layer of grime. The bearing are totally dried of course but laying only on one side. The bike looks to be used when new but completely unused since. The cables are totally rusty but pull out easily and perfectly. I would have much preferred a post '83 610 with lots of goodies but this one reminds me of my very first touring bike which I've always claimed was my favorite. It's pretty nimble without being twitchy, carries loads very well possibly because of the straight gauge tubing which is very appreciated in the 25" size and has a short top tube. I couldn't afford a real loaded touring bike so bought a sport touring Univega for $20 and started to work. To my mind a real crank, with real gears and a couple of racks is all one need make a real touring bike. I'd be more comfortable with barends and a leather saddle. If we're talking bar ends, why not clickers and








a 7 speed freewheel? I'm a big fan of aero brake levers but totally understand those who say it's going too far. Anyhow here's some pics. Would you keep it stock or make changes and what kind of changes?

nlerner

If I’m going to invest in upgrades, the frame itself really needs to be worth it. I’m afraid that Miyata doesn’t qualify for me.

RiddleOfSteel

Upgrades on a keeper bike: Dura-Ace

Cheeky, yet truthful, answer aside, is this a keeper for you? If so, do you have a budget? If so, do you possess nice/nicer components or the ability to purchase them (for good prices) locally via Craigslist or LBS (that sells used bike parts)? After all of that, how much do you care about its looks?

There are a number of Very Rusty bits on this bike, some that look unsightly (front derailleur, headset) and others that look unsightly and give me reason to replace them (chain, wheels). A disassembly of the bike to determine if the "bones" are good would be a prudent move. Crankset off, BB out, inspect the tubes inside. Stem+bars off, wheel out, disassemble headset to see how that is holding up.

- New quality cables and housings and a new chain at the very least. Those center-pull calipers have strong springs, so a nicer modern dual-pivot caliper would require less effort and deliver great stopping power.
- Crankset replacement to one that has a 110/74mm BCD pattern instead of a 110mm only will get you to 24/26T for a low ring. At least you have a 36T. A Sugino AT crankset is a lovely crankset for any bike, and possesses such BCD pattern. Lesser yet still pretty Sugino cranksets also exist, as well as a number of modern triples.
- Aero or non-aero brake levers are plenty fine--anything is going to be better than hood-less, old-school levers like those in terms of comfort, operation, and performance.

I've had modern electronic shifting on my '74 Schwinn Paramount. Nothing is too far, or hasn't been done, more or less. If you like certain components--at whatever level of niceness they are--find them, buy them, and install them. Make the bike comfortable for you and capable of the terrain you want it to handle, keeping your own abilities in mind. If you sync all that up, a good bike like a Miyata 610 will be one that you certainly want to keep.

Cycle Tourist

It's already in a box. The frame needed only very minor touch ups. The headset is actually perfect. That was hardened brown grease. I've always been good with centerpulls so I'm OK there. I'm hoping the fd is the same. It's amazing sometimes what they come out looking like. I'm sure I have a good fd that'll work. I bought a nicely priced crank a few months ago with a 110/74 bolt pattern. It was coincidentally made for Miyata with a script engraved arm that has "SIGNATURE" on it. Function is beauty for me but this little beauty has style.
Electric shifting on a bike from '74? Sir, have you no decency?

RiddleOfSteel

Good to hear that you are well on your way to a well-functioning Miyata.

As for decency, I have plenty:

Lascauxcaveman 

I'm going to have to agree. My '81 Miyatas didn't make the cut, when compared to my '88 Voyageur and '90 C-dale ST600. They just didn't stack up

The Miyatas were good bikes; the ones I kept are great bikes.

Germany_chris

If I was going to keep that bike the only things I wouldn't replace would be the stem/HS/cable hangers everything else would go into the recycling.

branko_76 

The Miyata 610 is a solid working man's bike.

Completely dismantle it and replace (not "upgrade") the rusty spokes and front derailleur, clean, polsh and lube everything else.

JaccoW

I'm going to throw in a less C&V-approved option and more of an xBiking approach.

If you don't mind a black groupset the Microshift Advent X 10-speed (1x10) is a great option for an affordable price. ($167 for a complete groupset)
Either trigger shifters, brifters or bar-ends but since this is a cassette and not a freewheel it will require new wheels. I'm pretty sure you can find a narrow-wide chainring that fits.
A 40T x 11-48 setup would still give you a range of 22.5 - 98 gear inches.

Still, that would probably set you back somewhere around $400-$500 at the very least for a group set + wheels.

And besides, black wheels on a blue frame look pretty nice.

branko_76 

I agree, there's nothing special about the 610, so maintaining its C&V status would not be a priority for me either. The bike is going on 40 years old and has obviously been neglected. Restoring the original components and just replacing what is beyond repair will give the bike another 40 years or more if maintained properly.

The question is, will those modern components that cost $400-$500 still be usable 40 years from now?

tricky 

Depends on the components. I'd say yes if it's barends, most any non-Di2 derailleur, and some replacement wheels in that price range.

jamesdak 

I'm sort of in the same boat too. A friend had me looking at here 1988 Miyata 312 to see if it's worth upgrading. It's supposedly been sitting for 15 years or so. First thing I noticed is it's really the wrong size for her. She's maybe 5' 5" and it's a 54 cm. So that's pushing it. But all the components seem fine. It does have a wide and upright style gel saddle. Oh and clip on aero bars.

My plans is a throrough clean, degrease and relub of everything. New cables and possibly housings if needed. New chain too and sort out the freewheel as needed. Trying to decide on a good set of tires for it that will ride nice, give good volume, but also be fairly puncture proof.

It she's not doing tri's anymore I'll suggest pulling off the aero bars. Then to get her into a decent saddle and dail in the fit as best can beat. She mentioned being totally blown by in the past on the bike leg of events. Since this really isn't worth putting money in to I'm jsut trying to do what simple improvements I can to make it more enjoyable to use. She doesn't like the DT shifters but once again, converting to a modern setup doesn't make sense. There's a $400 Lemond Zurich in her size for sale locally running Ultegra 9 speed. Buying that make more sense and would be cheaper than sourcing all the parts, spreading a frame and upgrading a bike that really doesn't fit.

I guess my point for the OP is what is that once you evaluate the purpose does it make sense to pursue any upgrades....

mstateglfr 

I dont want a bike that wont be something I use. As a result, all my c&v bikes have become modernized in various ways. Most run modern drivetrains because I want the convenience of a compact crankset and STI shifting. I have bar end shifters too, but even my older drivetrains are 9sp.

The only exception I currently have to this is if I found a quality frameset from 1981 in 64 or 65cm. I think it would be cool to build up a bike from my birth year with period correct components. So far though, I havent come across a quality 64/65cm road frame from '81.

DMC707

This is a real beauty !!

DiabloScott

Wheels, nice handbuilt ones with nice hubs and shiny spokes and re-space the rear for 130mm.
That would give a good ride improvement and would be transferable to some other bike looking to the future.
And I wouldn't object to replacing any of that other stuff either.

RiddleOfSteel

A number of Treks came in the 25.5" size, which, per their catalogs, would yield a 64-65cm bike. My former '81 716 was 65cm CTT. Pitty about the really low rear brake bridge. Even the 410/412/414 frames were/are really nice to ride, and come in a very nice dark blue or dark slate blue. Up into the late-'70s (no catalogs found between '79-83), top-end Centurions could be had in a 25.5" size. Raleighs had 25.5" forever. Guerciotti Super Record came in 65cm in 1983. I bet there are some Masi's in there as well. Otherwise, bespoke or smaller outfits are likely the way to go for that size in that year.

guy1138

Cycle Tourist

I'm pretty much with you. I have a nice set of Matrix 27" wheels. I'll respoke the Arya's later. Found a Campy fd and if the rd works with bar end clickers it stays. I like aero levers for the extra power and the convenience. (nice place to hang stuff to dry). The crank is already in the parts bin. Half step gearing is good for a 15 speed but I've gotten lazy over the years and for a 21 speed, not needed. I know newer stuff is cool but cantilevers twist the seat stays and butted tubing on a big frame with a big load is not as stable as I'd like. I know. I know. I'm out of the mainstream but I've always been a little"different"🤓

Cycle Tourist

Probably not. I have a Klein touring bike that is perfect but I'm a member of the n+1 consortium and this is a much cleaner version of my first touring bike and recreating my first tour, fully loaded, San Diego to San Francisco sounds like a good idea at the time.

jamesdak 

Well I am a hypocrite for sure though. I'm sitting here this morning trying to decide which of my 30+ bikes to take out. "Making sense" has never figured into the equation for me either, LOL!

The Golden Boy 

There's a time to put lipstick on a pig, and a time to leave the pig be.

If that pig brought you to the dance and it means something to you or it does something for you- by all means. Repainting and dollying up a pre-1984 World Sport is understandable if that was the bike that got you into biking and you have so many inspirational memories made on that bike. Fixing up and improving a recently acquired post-1984 World Sport is understandable as it's a 'decent' frame. Repainting, and dropping big bank in dollying up a recently acquired World Sport isn't the best of decisions...

Yeah, I've thrown a ton of money at my 1986 Trek 400 Elance- but I'm well aware of what that bike is, and what it's worth to me. First- it's a good frame, double butted 531 main frame and CrMo fork and stays puts that in the league of a 600 series bike. Second- it's gorgeous paint. The way that paint sparkles in the morning sun still excites me. Third, that was (for whatever reason) the first bike I lusted for and searched for for the better part of a year.

There is a point that throwing money at a project isn't worth it by any measure. $2000 of Phil Wood and Campagnolo on a Varsity is still a Varsity.

I may be wrong- but I think that Miyata checks a couple boxes for you, but isn't a bike you really want. If you've got the parts to replace what needs replacing- go for it, but I wouldn't dump a whole lot of time and money into that bike.

The beauty of bikes is that the one you want will come around- the trick is watching for them and having the money when they show up.

ryansu

I might suggest getting the bike back up and running. replace what needs to be without going overboard, and then ride it, allot, does it fit, do you like it, does it put a smile on your face or do you keep thinking this is ok but..... I recently passed on buying a vintage Specialized Hard rock at a good $$ because I knew the voice in my head would say its ok but its not a Rock Hopper So I am going to wait till I find a Rock Hopper - stupid voice.

Cycle Tourist

Here's the lipstick you mentioned but this is definitely no pig. On big framed touring bikes I much prefer straight gauge tubing. The butted tubing loaded tourers are too flexible for me. Cantilevers are nice but good center pulls are more consistent as they don't twist much. Anyhow here's the final upgraded 610. The parts are all stuff I've aquired over the years. The wheels, saddle and 7 speed clickers where about $100 on CL. The cranks and brake levers came off a flip. The hoods, tape, chain and freewheel were my only new investments. The paint was absolutely stunning. Yes, I probably invested too much time and money but my planned trip to SF from San Diego once I strap on some old racks and panniers should be worth it.

tricky 

Love this build. Cheap and very functional. Way cheaper than a new Surly LHT. You'll really enjoy this bike on that trip and that is what matters. How does it ride?

madpogue 

Seems to have turned out just as you envisioned in the opening post. And on a budget, to boot. I can understand your attachment to the frame; evidently a tall frame with a short top tube fits your proportions.